Skip to comments.QUESTIONS CONCERNING GUN SHOWS AND THE NEWS
Posted on 04/19/2013 6:37:34 AM PDT by 7thson
I have some questions I would like to ask and get a general idea of the thoughts of my fellow Freepers
Last night I am watching OReilly please no comments on why. Its a long story. Anyway, he is talking to Beckel about his unConstitutional law he would like to see the government implement. As a side note, how does he reconcile in his mind when he states the government cant protect people and then in the next breath wants the government to enact another law to make it more powerful. Anyway, Beckel makes a statement that people living in DC go to a Virginia, buy seven guns at a gun show, and then return to DC to sell them on the street.
My question in Virginia, can you purchase a firearm, much less seven, at any gun show from any licensed dealer without undergoing a background check or filling out paperwork? I know that in Maryland you have to fill out the same paperwork as you do in the store. I have not been to a gun show in Virginia so I do not know. However, I would surmise that if those selling the firearms are FFLs, then you have to fill out paperwork. Am I correct in that statement?
I know in Virginia, if you live in Maryland, they will not even sell you a firearm at a FFL. My wife and I got that information from a gun store in Virginia. In addition, in Pennsylvania, I know someone who went to Cabalas and was told the same thing.
Getting back to Beckel and BOR in gun shows across the nation, are those that sell guns licensed FFLs? Are all FFLs across the nation required to do background checks on individuals that buy guns? Is there a gun show loophole? I have also seen that those that sell guns on the internet require that the firearm be shipped to a licensed FFL? So, is there an Internet loophole?
And if the answer to my loop hole questions is no, than why do they keep stating this on television? Even Hannity does not dispute these statements. Have these people ever been to a gun show? Don't people e-mail/call these news programs and tell them that they are wrong?
My last question and just putting it out there for feedback. I have been thinking of writing to my Maryland Congress critters and inviting them to come to a gun show with me. What do Freepers think of that idea?
Honestly, I have no idea where they draw the line of what is a gun show, what isn't a gun show, what sales require paperwork, which don't etc.
Any FFL has to follow the law about background checks wherever he sells a gun.
And federal law prohibits buying a gun out of state.
You can’t purchase from a licensed dealer and leave with the gun if you’re from out state, and a DC resident would be considered out state. You could arrange to have the weapon shipped to a licensed dealer in your state and pick it up from him, but you would undergo a background check when you did. You could purchase a gun from a regular citizen wandering around the gun show(not a dealer). There are individuals that go to gunshows to sell their personal guns.
1. 90%+ of gunshow sales are by an FFL.
2. The ones that are private sales are “private sales” and the sale has nothing to do with being at a gunshow. It could be at a home or parking lot anywhere. The same as if I sell my brother a gun.
3. Most private firearms that you see at gunshows are long-guns. Trying to even find seven private pistols to purchase at a gunshow would be near impossible.
4. Laws concerning state line violations still apply to private sales.
That said, ATF agents love to hang out at gunshows. If someone was walking around buying that many private sale firearms, the ATF would be taking pictures and questioning them.
5. So how would the ATF enforce a background requirement on private sales, if they can’t enforce the stateline-transfer laws now on the books? Without 100% registration there is no way to do this. e.g. you and I walk to your car and exchange money for gun, ATF shows up and charges us. How do they prove that I didn’t arrive with the gun? They must prove that it was your gun. How can they do that without registration? They can’t.
6. It is all about registration and confiscation. The inability to enforce the new requirements is the next step to seeking total registration.
If they are Democrats, it would be a waste of time. It might also serve their goals in that they could say "I very recently witnessed purchases without background checks...blah blah blah...
The point is that Beckel's information is wrong and a lie, all the Democrats lie. There is no gun show in this country where you can go buy one, four, or seven weapons from a licensed FFL dealer at the show without having to fill out a Form 4473 and undergo a NICS check, unless you are in a state for a CCW negates the NICS check requirement like my state, Georgia. They lie because it is still legal in most locals for a person to sell a weapon to another person (private sale) at a gunshow - time, place and location does not matter. It is a great big fatassed lie they tell every time they can.
Yes, you have to do all the paperwork and wait a little while for your purchase from a FFL holder...if you purchase it inside the show. You can hang out in the parking lot and buy whatever you want, from whoever you want, with no paperwork.
Yes, you are correct. The form 4473 is required to buy from a dealer at a gun show, just like at a gun shop. The so-called gun show loophole is a myth. Private individuals at gun shows can sell weapons to other individuals, just like they could in the parking lot or a private home. These individuals often walk the aisles with a sign on their backpack or in the barrel of a long gun. The loop show language is a deliberate misstatement, as is the statement that anyone can buy a gun over the internet without a background check.
If we learned anything from the Boston Bombing:
1) Every house should have at least one gun in it to protect yourselves from terrorists and or nuts on the loose.
Imagine yourself in Watertown knowing a kook is on the loose and you need to lock yourself in your house and you had NO protection?
An FFL is an FFL no matter where they conduct business.
Obama and the Left lie through their teeth about a "gun show loophole" which merely refers to some gun shows allowing a person (non-FFL) to sell their private possession at the show.
Some gun shows in some states do not allow private sales at the show.
They are likely violating the law. If they are buying and selling for the purpose of making a profit (running a business) they require an FFL.
Many people at gunshows have run afowl of the ATF by claiming to just be "collectors", but setting up a table draws the ATFs attention, and they take note. If that "collector" is buying and selling too regularly, he is going to get cuffed.
Do you know if that only applies to licensed dealers or any transaction? Because living on the West Virginia side, within a mile of WV/OH border I have purchased many guns from private ads and flea markets in Ohio, and on the reverse side I'm sure I've sold many guns to people from Ohio as well. I never realized that could be illegal?
If someone has a huge display of guns for sale and shows them at a flea market regularly, then he is in the business of selling guns and should have an FFL.
If you are just selling a gun or two of your own on occasion, then there is no federal law against that.
I meant through a licensed dealer. I don’t know about the legality of what you describe.
Not true. You can buy rifles and shotguns in any adjoining state as long as you follow the regulations of the state in which the buyer resides.
You can only sell pistols across state lines if it is an FFL to FFL transfer. The recepient FFL boes the backgrround (NCIS) check and any other related paperwork.
If you are a Maryland resident, you can buy non-regulated long guns face-to-face in Virginia.
Regulated firearms must be transferred to a Maryland FFL who will charge you a transfer fee, do the background check, fill out the necessary Federal and State forms and submit them to the MSP, charge you additionally for those and secure the firearm for the mandatory 5 day waiting period.
Correct. I should have said "handguns," not "guns."
This is the exact same way that it is in Texas. Gun Show loop hole is bunk!
Bill “I never met a Tyrant I didn’t like” O’Reilly is a card-carrying Obamanation Journalist.
Billy OR has used every excuse that he can spin to enable Tyrant B. Hussein Obama to continue to bypass Congress and destroy the US Constitution.
Our sorry Liberal Agenda Media, including Billy OR, has proven to be a willing ally to Commie Obama by publishing gun ownership information in their sorry news outlets.
“Confidential” Gun Show background Check lists are as confidential as the weakest link in the confidentiality chain, be it the sorry ‘Freedom of Information Act,’ or a sorry Media outlet Editor.
The purpose of a confidentially armed America Citizenry is THE BEST DETERRENT to power grabs by Tyrants such as the current wannabe Tyrant B. Hussein Obama.
Gun background check lists collected will be used to confiscate our anti-Tyrant guns whenever the present or future Tyrant chooses. Of course that would happen ONLY when it is in “the National Interest.”
We need to stay focused!
DO NOT GET DISTRACTED!
Commie Obama has just begun to fight us!
With Communist-Style Communal Obamacare, B. Hussein already has one-sixth of the US Economy under his Communist heel.
Control of the US House in the 2014 National Election will clear the way for Commie Obama to take over the other five-sixth of the US Economy.
Most of the news from the Obamanation Administration centers around topics that are designed to be just another Obamanation Smokescreen to divert the attention away from Obama managing each new Constitutional Crisis into a Regulation that violates the Constitution.
Never let a Crisis go to waste, is the rule that guides Commie Obama.
Examples of these Obamanation distractions are most of the social issues that get attention by the Liberal Agenda Media.
Our sorry Congressional RINOs have been to stupid to learn this smoke and mirrors distraction game, and run from bargain to bargain or deal to deal, with nary a thought to use REGULAR ORDER, as designed by our Founding Fathers to protect us from Tyrants such as B. Hussein Obama.
If bargains and deals do not work then Arrogant, Incompetent, Communist Tyrant B. Hussein Obama will try to bypass the REGULAR ORDER of Congress by using Executive Orders, selective enforcement of REGULATIONS, and other Jack-Booted actions and verbal dictates that are consistent with the Communist Cell training that B. Hussein received in his quest to FUNDAMENTALLY CHANGE THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA.
As any card-carrying Obamanation Journalist will tell you:
- - - We must support Obama - - - TO FUNDAMENTALLY CHANGE THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA - - - into a totally Regulated Communist Obamanation of Debt and Doom.
After all, how else can - - - everyone get a fair shot? - - -
BTW, RECEIVING a fair shot would have been a lot easier if Commie Obama had succeeded in his personal recent attempted bipartisan destruction of the 2nd Amendment to disarm us - - - - .
Patriot365~:”.. Gun Show loop hole is bunk!”
Most information from Beckel is bunk
but once said , it will be repeated by libturd media, and repeated, and repeated , etc.
The media will pick up the refrain without specifying the source, and treat it like fact !
This process is called propaganda !