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Terri's Fight - (Daily Thread/Updates) November 5 -7, 2003
Various | November 5, 2003 | sweetliberty

Posted on 11/05/2003 12:14:25 AM PST by sweetliberty

TERRI'S FIGHT
(Thread 5 - November 5-7)
(Link back to Thread 4 - Nov. 3-4)

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Contained in Thread 4:

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Resource links to search business and criminal records in Florida, info on special guardian ad litum meeting (attempt to change qualifications?), Michael Schiavo parody, link to referral letter for Dr. Hammersfahr to the Nobel committee, transcript to Abrams Report closing commments - Nov.3, e-mail address for Larry King Live, Florida statutes on guardianship and some damning statements against Michael.

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Click on pic for Terri's website

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This thread serves as a place for posting all new general information and references, along with links following Terri's case, plus information on cable news and talk radio shows dealing with the issue, court cases and press releases. This is also the place to post contact information, prayers and general discussion.

If you have something that qualifies as BREAKING NEWS or FRONT PAGE NEWS, please post it on a separate thread in that category in order to give it maximum exposure and then post a link to the article/thread here so that it will be included in the next update of links. Also, if you post links to articles from original sources and there is also a thread on FR, please link to the FR thread. Many original links become corrupt over time and we want to be able to access the information at will.

I know we're all getting tired, but we have to hang in there. This isn't just Terri's fight anymore. It is our fight too. To everyone who has worked tirelessly to gather information, write letters, make phone calls, spend time in prayer, be at the vigil supporting Terri's family and all the many other offerings you have given for this effort, thank you and may the Lord richly bless you.

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Latest Threads On Terri's Case

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Professor Appointed to Probe Schiavo Case

DFU SONG: Candle in the Wind (for Terri)

Coral Snake Song: When Johnny Comes Marching Home (The conspiracy against Terri Schiavo)

Should Terri Schiavo Live or Die?

Michelle Malkin: Starvation nation

Eyes on judge in Schiavo petition>

FL ACLU Files Brief in Effort to Starve Disabled Woman, as Bush Acts to Save Terri Schiavo

Terri Schiavo: Myths and Facts - Dr. Dianne Irving, PhD

Recovering from a 'Persistent Vegetative State'

Husband in Right to Die Case Moves to Block Parents in New Trial

Terri's Law Support Contested

Pro-Lifers Link Euthanasia to Abortion

Florida Court Prohibits Terri's Parents From Joining "Terri's Law" Battle (ACLJ)

Terri Schindler Schiavo Guardianship Hearing Wednesday November 5, 2003


Join the Terri Schindler Life Ribbon Campaign
Join the Terri Schindler Life Ribbon Campaign!


TOPICS: Activism/Chapters; Government; News/Current Events; US: Florida
KEYWORDS: attorneyfromhell; daily; euthanasia; florida; forcesofevil; georgefelos; guardianfromhell; hino; merchantsofdeath; michaelschiavo; righttolife; schiavo; schindler; terri; terrischiavo; terrisdailies
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To: Wampus SC
I bet your tag line really irritates some folks...LOL, love it!!!!!
201 posted on 11/05/2003 4:35:52 PM PST by tutstar
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To: Wampus SC

Well he's elected and he knows voters are watching him.

Hope Terri's Guardian Angels stay close around her.
If MS is running scared, who knows what he'll try now.
202 posted on 11/05/2003 4:36:02 PM PST by pickyourpoison
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To: pickyourpoison
"If Felos is psysic, wonder why he didn't see this coming."

ROTFL! Perhaps he was too busy making sure he didn't accidentally cause any airplanes to fall out of the sky with his massive brain leaks waves.

203 posted on 11/05/2003 4:36:39 PM PST by sweetliberty ("Having the right to do a thing is not at all the same thing as being right in doing it.")
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To: supercat
There have been over 40 court hearings. I can't even stand depositions or any hearings and I'm a former paralegal. I HATE COURTROOMS MYSELF. I'm just glad that Terri's capable Attorney pulled a rabbit out of a hat today. Maybe it was the Larry King Live tape. No reason that couldn't have been submitted as evidence.

There's still the Schiavo v. Jeb Bush matter but maybe that would go away if Michael Schiavo is removed as guardian once and for all...

204 posted on 11/05/2003 4:37:36 PM PST by floriduh voter (Breaking at baynews9.com...conservative-spirit.org FR Site)
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To: sweetliberty
The Guardian (Terri Schiavo Alert!)
205 posted on 11/05/2003 4:38:57 PM PST by NYer ("Close your ears to the whisperings of hell and bravely oppose its onslaughts." ---St Clare Assisi)
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To: Republic
Send Felos a feeding tube.
206 posted on 11/05/2003 4:39:02 PM PST by floriduh voter (Breaking at baynews9.com...conservative-spirit.org FR Site)
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To: Robert A. Cook, PE
No, reporting who pulled the feeding tube is irrelevent.

Reporting which doctor REFUSED to re-insert it (under the apparent direct threats of MS at the hospital after the law was passed) ....

THAT is worth reporting.

What? MS threatened a doctor knowing that the law had passed - perhaps the doctor did not...but MS sure did....seems to be this should be actionable and should be used in the case against MS remaining her GUARDIAN! This is explosive!

207 posted on 11/05/2003 4:39:41 PM PST by Republic
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To: floriduh voter

I hope they do something fast.

Since MS is an RN there's no telling what's up his sleeve.
208 posted on 11/05/2003 4:40:04 PM PST by pickyourpoison
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To: EternalVigilance
Maybe you want to post that again as a poll that needs freeped. I skipped over it and when I saw a reference in another post that there was a poll, I went and voted. No. Have to read the wording carefully. It is now 49% no 48 yes and 3 unsure.
209 posted on 11/05/2003 4:40:14 PM PST by Aliska
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To: floriduh voter; All; TexasCowboy; Republic; Texas Termite
Judge Lets Parents Challenge Guardianship of Terri Schiavo
By Mitch Stacy Associated Press Writer
Published: Nov 5, 2003

AP Article

CLEARWATER, Fla. (AP) - A state circuit judge Wednesday refused to block an effort by the parents of a brain-damage woman to try to get her husband removed as her legal guardian.

Also Wednesday, an attorney for Gov. Jeb Bush asked another judge to dismiss a lawsuit filed by Michael Schiavo challenging the constitutionality of the law that allowed the governor to order reinsertion of Terri Schiavo's feeding tube two weeks ago.

That action argues that the governor was never served with the suit, which would make it invalid. It also argued that it should have been filed in Leon County - where Bush is based - instead of Pinellas County.

Michael Schiavo's attorney, George Felos, questioned Bush's integrity in filing the motion, calling it "a legal move out of the gutter" and "low-ball delaying tactic."

In the guardianship matter, Michael Schiavo likely will now be forced to respond in court to charges in the petition that he withheld proper care and therapy from his wife and that he has a conflict of interest because he's in a romantic relationship with another woman and has fathered her children.

Bob and Mary Schindler, parents of Terri Schiavo, have asked Circuit Judge George W. Greer to appoint Terri's brother or sister as guardian instead. Michael Schiavo had asked for the Schindler's request to be dismissed, but after a hearing Greer said he will allow it to proceed.

Greer has already denied three previous requests by the Schindlers to remove Michael Schiavo as guardian and has repeatedly affirmed his legal right to remove his wife's feeding tube and allow her to die, as he says she would have wished.

Pat Anderson, attorney for the Schindlers, said she was pleased with the decision from Greer, who she has claimed is biased in favor of Michael Schiavo.

"It's very important because the fact of the matter is, Michael should not be her guardian," said Pat Anderson, attorney for the Schindlers. "He has a gross, gross conflict of interest."

Some doctors and Greer have ruled that Terri Schiavo is in a persistent vegetative state with no hope for recovery. She suffered severe brain damage in 1990 when her heart temporarily stopped, cutting off oxygen to her brain, because of a chemical imbalance.

But the Schindlers said their daughter had no end-of-life wishes and believe she could be rehabilitated. They also dispute that she is in a vegetative state and believe she has enough mental abilities to respond to them.

Scott Swope, who argued for the dismissal on behalf of Michael Schiavo, called the ruling "unfortunate" and said his side will prepare to fight the petition.

"(Michael) should remain her guardian because he has her best interests at heart," Swope said.

Terri Schiavo had gone without food and water for six days when the Florida Legislature passed a law Oct. 21 giving Bush authority to order that her feeding tube be reinserted.

Felos filed suit challenging the constitutionality of the law. In a brief filed last week, he charged that the hastily passed law infringed on Terri Schiavo's right to privacy and the separation of power provisions of the Florida Constitution.

Attorneys for Bush were given until Thursday to file their own arguments supporting the law, but instead filed the motion to dismiss Wednesday. Attorney Kenneth L. Connor, representing Bush, said the governor is not shying away from judicial review of the statute, but that proper procedure must be followed first.

Connor said that starts with having the lawsuit filed in Tallahassee and having the governor properly served.

"The governor has the right to a home venue privilege," Connor said. "As you can imagine, this is not the only lawsuit brought against the governor, so if you wind up forcing the governor and the staff to trot all over the state, that winds up being an extraordinary consumption of state resources."

Felos said his lawsuit was faxed to Bush's office, and counsel for governor was present at the emergency hearing Oct. 21 and did not raise those concerns.

"It's almost unbelievable that the governor of our state and someone who we hope would show some integrity and leadership would resort to such a low and trashy legal move in this case," Felos said.

Connor said the governor's motion was not a delaying tactic.

"Mr. Schiavo could have avoided the delay had he simply complied with the rules," Connor said. "If there's a delay as a result of the way in which this case has been handled it's because of the way in which Mr. Schiavo's lawyers conducted themselves, not the governor."

Connor also disputed Felos' claim that Bush improperly stepped into the business of the state's courts.

"This is not an encroachment on the judicial powers," he said. "What this is an extra added layer of protection that the Legislature passed to help assure that the lives of the disabled and their health care choices are in fact protected and respected."

And that piece of garbage has the nerve to call something "out of the gutter" or "trashy." Take a look at yourself, FELON-OS!

All I can say is, THANK GOD for the internet!!!! It has given us power and a HUGE voice. Imagine all the decades of abuse we knew nothing about. Keep it up, Freepers!

210 posted on 11/05/2003 4:41:09 PM PST by STARWISE (PLEASE DO something to save Terri Schiavo: email, call, fax, vigil,pray, GOD SAVE TERRI)
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To: floriduh voter
What I heard is that the Schindlers asked that either Bobby or Suzanne be made guardian. Since Judge Greer is requiring the HINO to go back to court to give an accounting of himself, it doesn't appear to be over, This is one time I would SO like to be corrected though!
211 posted on 11/05/2003 4:42:24 PM PST by sweetliberty ("Having the right to do a thing is not at all the same thing as being right in doing it.")
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To: sweetliberty
Fr. Rob Johansen's Daily Blog Report

Having Your Cake And Eating It

I think it's been pretty clear to most of my readers that I don't think much of Michael Schiavo. I find his story about Terri's "wish" to not be kept alive incredible, I find his efforts to portray himself as the caring husband unbelievable, and his attempt to portray Bob & Mary Schindler as the villains of the conflict contemptible. Furthermore, if, as I suspect, it was his actions which put Terri in her current state, his behavior would have been despicable.

These sentiments, as they have found their way into my writing about Terri, have prompted some to accuse me of "hating" Michael or of being uncharitable towards him. This, of course, is false. I don't hate Michael: I think he is pursuing an evil course of action against an innocent third person, and as such, it is my duty, and that of every other decent person, to try to stop him. If he relented from his relentless pursuit of Terri's death I'd be perfectly content to let him go about his life and never utter another word about him.

But I am not, in charity, obliged to pretend his actions and stated intentions are somehow less evil than they are, or to make believe that whatever good Michael might do in other spheres of his life somehow makes up for or negates the evil he is inflicting on Terri. That is, it would be silly for me to say, "Michael is nice to the child he had by his girlfriend, so he must be a decent guy, and he must have a point in wanting Terri dead." It is not charity to ignore or make light of evil actions or designs, especially when they involve the life of an innocent person.

Which brings me to my point. After reading today's article "The Guardian", by Wesley J. Smith, I realize now what it is about Michael's actions and statements that I find so reprehensible: It is that Michael is trying to have it both ways. He is trying to have his cake and eat it too.

The Schindlers have not made their allegations of abuse (which are founded on medical evidence), or disputed Michael's claim to be acting upon Terri's wishes out of some desire to hurt him. They have not challenged his self-touted image as the caring husband because they have some ill-will toward him. They're doing so, and I have taken up their cause, because his claims and image are false.

It was Michael who went to the court and, in effect, said, "my wife told me she didn't want to live like this, so please let me kill her." It was Michael who claimed that he was acting out of his love towards Terri. It was Michael who went on Larry King Live and tried to convince us that he was the caring and long-suffering husband.

And, as the Schindlers told me last week, they find his claims to be false and his pose as the loving husband to be unbelievable. I was convinced of that by what the Schindlers told me, what I read in court documents and medical testimony, and by Michael's own performance on Larry King.

The Schindlers told me that the first court-appointed guardian ad litem, Richard Pearse, found Michael to be incredible. Now, as Smith's article makes clear, Pearse's report and recommendations substantially support Bob & Mary Schindlers' statements to me:

Bob & Mary told me that Michael withheld treatment from Terri for an infection. The treatment consisted of a routine course of antibiotics. Mr. Pearse found that "Early in 1994, for example, he refused to consent to treat an infection from which the ward was then suffering and ordered that she not be resuscitated in the event of cardiac arrest. "

Furthermore, the Schindlers, in their account of the initial dispute that caused their estrangement, said that it became clear to them at that point that Michael didn't intend to follow through on his promises to seek rehabilitation for Terri. Mr. Pearse saw it the same way. Smith wrote:

Pearse confirmed the charge by the Schindlers that once the medical malpractice money was in the bank, Schiavo began to refuse medical treatment for Terri, writing:

After February 1993, Mr. Schiavo's attitude concerning treatment for the ward apparently changed.

And there were signs that that attitude had changed even earlier, as Mr. Pearse reported that Michael "admitted to the guardian ad litem that he had at least "two romantic involvements" after Terri's collapse. " Pearse concluded:
"It is apparent to me," Pearse wrote the court, "that he has reached a point that he has no hope of the ward's recovery and wants to get on with his own life." Smith adds: To say the least. At the time of Pearse's investigation, Schiavo was already living with the woman who would become the mother of his children.

Michael has proclaimed repeatedly his love for Terri. But men who love their wives stick by them, even when they are sick, disabled, or debilitated. Men who love their wives seek to have them treated if they are sick or disabled. They don't deny treatment in spite of doctor's urgings. And if love isn't sufficient or it is crushed under the weight of grief or despair, then duty and honor would urge any decent man to stay the course. As Mary Schindler once said to me, "if Michael loves her so much he could start by keeping his vows to her."

Michael is trying to have it both ways: he is seeks to exercise the prerogatives of a husband, when in fact he has not lived up to the responsibilities of a husband. He seeks the moral standing that a husband would have vis-a-vis his wife, but he has constructively not lived as Terri's husband since before he began his efforts to bring about her death.

When Michael took his vows to Terri, he committed himself to bear the burdens of marriage as well as enjoy its benefits. If he won't fulfill the one, he has no moral basis on which to enjoy the other. He can't have it both ways.

Mr. Pearse, as I wrote in my interview with the Schindlers last week, found that Michael's claim that Terri wouldn't want to live in her condition wasn't credible, saying:
his credibility is necessarily adversely affected by the obvious financial benefit to him of being the ward's sole heir at law in the event of her death while still married to him. Her death also permits him to get on with his own life.

The portrait of Michael that emerges from the Pearse report could hardly be at greater variance from his own representations. Upon scrutiny, his claims crumble into dust. He wants to be trusted as a loving husband, but we see a man who threw aside his marriage vows a long time ago. He wants us to believe that he has her best interests at heart, but he refused her routine treatment for illnesses having nothing to do with her primary disability. He wants us to believe that he is trying to live up to a promise he made to Terri, but he is revealed to have broken promises that he made repeatedly before he got the money in his hands.

He can't have it both ways.
212 posted on 11/05/2003 4:42:50 PM PST by NYer ("Close your ears to the whisperings of hell and bravely oppose its onslaughts." ---St Clare Assisi)
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To: Wampus SC; MarMema; pollywog; sweetliberty; HiTech RedNeck; All
Personally I DON'T think this FReep is over even if we save Terri. It should not be over until that corrupeth chamber of horrors Ho$pice of the Florida $uncoa$t is SHUT DOWN or put under NEW MANAGEMENT more respectful of the terminally ill and disabled, and Michael Shiavo and George Felos are FReeped into obscurity or a prison cell.
213 posted on 11/05/2003 4:43:24 PM PST by Coral Snake (deathculture(HospiceOf TheFlorida$uncoast == Andersonville + Aushwitz)
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To: Robert A. Cook, PE; All
"No, reporting who pulled the feeding tube is irrelevent."

Not neccessarily. Noory reporting it would be relevant for those who believe that a person has a moral duty to refuse such an order.

"Reporting which doctor REFUSED to re-insert it (under the apparent direct threats of MS at the hospital after the law was passed) ....

"THAT is worth reporting."

Very good point. That would be worth reporting, maybe more so. I'll email Noory with that suggestion.

Does anyone have confirmed information that a doctor refused to reinsert the tube, and if so, who it was?"

214 posted on 11/05/2003 4:46:56 PM PST by Wampus SC (Fly the Gadsen Flag)
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To: Coral Snake
You are absolutely right!! The wheels apparently have begun to turn as far as investigations into the financial dealings under Mary Labyak, let's pray the gears grind all the misdeads to a halt.
215 posted on 11/05/2003 4:48:47 PM PST by tutstar
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To: STARWISE
Great post. I think I'm in a daze right now.
216 posted on 11/05/2003 4:50:54 PM PST by floriduh voter (Breaking at baynews9.com...conservative-spirit.org FR Site)
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To: tutstar
"I bet your tag line really irritates some folks...LOL, love it!!!!!"

Hey... what can I say? ... If it irritates 'em, it's just because it's supposed to irritate 'em...

217 posted on 11/05/2003 4:52:15 PM PST by Wampus SC (Got my Godsquad membership card right here...)
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To: cyn
An important prayer indeed - in all this, there is a woman who needs love, needs care, and needs her family. Fully cognizant or not, is she not as deserving of love and care as a baby, or a puppy, or even one of PETA's chickens?
218 posted on 11/05/2003 4:53:06 PM PST by dandelion
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To: pickyourpoison; dandelion; cyn; PrepareToLeave; Republic; Ragtime Cowgirl; windchime
The officer at Hospice asked me what was being heard in Court today. I explained. FURTHER, Hospice is now paying for the police at Hospice. They are inside and out. Maybe Hospice is going to cover their behinds now and make sure nothing happens to Terri. I mean, who really wants to be investigated? I'm sure Hospice's donations are WAY DOWN...
219 posted on 11/05/2003 4:54:16 PM PST by floriduh voter (Breaking at baynews9.com...conservative-spirit.org FR Site)
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To: STARWISE
I feel the pendulum beginning it's swing back toward the right and justice.
Man's punishment will not suffice for Michael Schiavo.
He has an appointment with God, and "vengeance is mine, saith the Lord".
220 posted on 11/05/2003 4:54:30 PM PST by TexasCowboy (COB1)
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