Posted on 11/26/2004 7:18:49 PM PST by Arkansas Boy
The Separation of Church and State Myth: Why God MUST be acknowledged.
How many of you have heard the term Separation of Church and State is in the Constitution? How many of you know that the Constitution does not even contain that phase? I would like to address a very important issue– an issue upon which the future of our nation rests: The issue is whether or not our government will acknowledge God.
The First Amendment is the main defense of those who wish to keep God out of our law and government. These folks say that the First Amendment is supposed to erect a barrier of “Separation between Church and State”. This is simply not true. The fact is, the phrase “Separation of Church and State” is not found in the First Amendment, or anywhere in the Constitution. The First Amendment to the United States Constitution simply states:
Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof. . . (it goes on to discuss freedom of the press, etc.)
Known as the “Establishment Clause”, this amendment was meant to protect religious freedom by giving the churches protection from the government, not the government protection from the churches. Let me explain: When America’s forefathers fled England, they were seeking freedom of religion, not freedom from religion. They did not want the government to meddle with Christendom and establish a "National Church" which would impair other denominations, as King James had done by establishing the Church of England.
Our founding documents, such as the Declaration of Independence, acknowledge the founders’ dependence upon God. The Declaration alone refers to the Sovereign Creator four times as “God”, “Creator”, “The Supreme Judge of the World”, and “Divine Providence”.
This nation was explicitly founded upon Christian principles, upon the God of the Holy Bible, but not upon one particular Christian denomination. This is further evidenced in the writings of our forefathers! Patrick Henry, the great revolutionary leader, said it best:
It cannot be emphasized too strongly or too often that this great nation was founded, not by religionists, but by Christians; not on religions, but on the Gospel of Jesus Christ. For this very reason peoples of other faiths have been afforded asylum, prosperity, and freedom of worship here.
While other people may be free to practice Buddhism, Hinduism, or Humanism on our soil, we are STILL a nation governed by Biblical principles. Our laws were not established on some trivial ideals, but on the solid and unchanging Word of God. The rally cry of the Revolutionary War was “No King but King Jesus!” It is on this very foundation that America was born, and it is upon this very foundation that the future of America rests.
Some people think “There’s no place for God in government”. What they don’t realize is that when God is cut out, something else must be put in. Removing God and His principles from government never results in neutrality, but always results in the government stepping in and “playing god”. When God is rejected, the government is not held to any absolute. They become the highest authority. Right and wrong becomes whatever the government says it is. When God is not in the picture our liberties are no longer recognized as “God-given”, but rather as “State-given”. The people’s unalienable rights and the people’s authority over their government is no longer recognized by the public servants, because there is no recognized authority higher than themselves. When the government does not acknowledge God as Sovereign, the government becomes a law unto itself. This is called tyranny, and this is what our forefathers tenaciously fought against.
For years now, God has been generally cut out of education, society, and government. Tolerance has become the rallying cry! But, as one wise gentleman once said, “The only thing tolerance tolerates is tolerance.” Folks, tolerance only tolerates God and the Bible when they are kept in a closet! God’s principles have been hushed in public circles. Why are we surprised when the phrase “one nation, under God” is attacked in the Pledge of Allegiance? God is being taken out of our legal system, and the Ten Commandments are being stripped from public view because they offend. Why, then, should we be surprised when the murder of millions of innocent babies is called “legal” by our courts? Why, now, are we shocked when the sacred and God-given institution of marriage is assaulted and perverted? Will we continue to sit quietly by, and watch our State and nation rot into moral perversion like Sodom and Gomorrah? We have rejected God Almighty, the Author of Liberty. Are we surprised, then, to see that our liberties are being severed, and that we are being put, shackle by shackle, under the bonds of slavery? The Bible says, “Where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is liberty.” “God bless America” I hear folks cry! But, can we expect the blessing of the very God we reject? The Bible says, “Blessed is the nation whose God is the Lord.”
Ladies and gentlemen, we are in a crisis. However, the blame does not rest only in Washington or with our public officials. The blame rests on us. The condition of our government reflects the condition of our people.
In the Bible, God says, “If my people, which are called by my name, shall humble themselves, and pray, and seek my face, and turn from their wicked ways; then will I hear from heaven, and will forgive their sin, and will heal their land.” (2 Chronicles 7:14).
My friends, we must repent for OUR rebellion against God. This is the only way God’s blessing can be restored to our land.
Then may we earnestly demand, through constitutional means, that our State and national governments return to the God who birthed them! The decision is ours. God save us, and God Save America.
You stated, "If your intent is to reach those who need pursuading, there are better ways to make the obvious need for God given rights unescapable to even a hardened liberal. Unalienable rights, as endowed by a Creator, are so important because government has no legitimate authority or power to violate those rights if they are endowed by a higher authority. It is a concept so important that, if there wasn't a Creator, we'd be best off maintaining whatever pretense necessary that there was."
I believe your concern in this regard was a point made in the title post.
Also, regarding your concern that quoting the infallible, inerrant, inspired Word of Almighty God was not suitable for a "secularist", I must state that the Bible is solid Truth-- period. While this author referenced several sources, it is, in fact, profiable to prove your posistion based on the Sovereign Truth-- the word of Almighty God the Creator. Logic and history (which is His-Story, by the way) are but little aside from the truths found in Scripture.
Proverbes 16:6: "By mercy and truth iniquity is purged: and by the fear of the LORD men depart from evil." How do you direct men to depart from evil, but by showing them why and what certain actions are evil? And, how do you show them evil, but by showing them truth?
2 Timothy 3:16-17, states: "All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness: That the man of God may be perfect, throughly furnished unto all good works."
Go ahead on with your obvious breast beating. My observation is that it's failing.
Whatever happened to "let your light so shine before men," or, "not every man that sayeth unto me, Lord, Lord"?
Logic and history (which is His-Story, by the way) are but little aside from the truths found in Scripture.
They are manifestations of truths found in Scripture.
How do you direct men to depart from evil, but by showing them why and what certain actions are evil? And, how do you show them evil, but by showing them truth?
So, stick with that until they're ready to learn the source of that Truth. It's a lousy political tactic to blow them over or turn them away with citations to the Bible before they're ready, just because you want to feel good about the righteousness of your faith.
"Werefore by their fruits ye shall know them."
So what you say is that it is a... belief...
It isn't and never was a fact...
Glad you agree with me!
Sorry, you say that Thomas Jefferson, Georges Washington, Benjamin Franklin and John Adams who weren't Christian and din't wan't the peomotion of "christian" values (whatever these are... And history says more lack of values) had an agenda you don't agree with....
Maybe another country would be better for you then...
In public, not inm private...
But he wasn't... As most educated people weren't then... They were deists, and some atheists...
Agreed!
The idea that they were Christians and wanted to impose Christianity is false and constitutes crass historical revisionism!
Sorry, the Bible isn't the inerrant word of God... You believe it is, but it isn't a fact at all, only your belief (flawed )
You've used selective quotes from just a few of the Founders. The only for certain Deist was probably Franklin--Jefferson, as your quote reveals was really Unitarian, and Payne was an Atheist.
Washington, like not a few regular church goers today, didn't use "Jesus" in his conversation or correspondence, but very frequently referred to Providence.
Also, all these men assumed common moral absolutes--and have various quotes that but for religion (by which they meant Christianity) the experiment of Democratic Republicanism wouldn't work.
Of the 100 or so Founders over 90% were best understood as conventional 18th Century Christians--you found the exceptions to the rule.
It's inaccurate to say the Founders were all devout Christians--however it is even more inaccurate to say they were mostly Diests or Unitarians.
LOL! BUMP
1 George Washington Episcopalian
2 John Adams Unitarian
3 Thomas Jefferson raised Episcopalian later in life, belonged to no specific religion held many Christian, Deist and Unitarian beliefs
4 James Madison Episcopalian
5 James Monroe Episcopalian
6 John Quincy Adams Unitarian
7 Andrew Jackson Presbyterian
8 Martin Van Buren Dutch Reformed
9 William Henry Harrison Episcopalian
10 John Tyler Episcopalian/Deist
11 James Knox Polk Presbyterian/Methodist
12 Zachary Taylor Episcopalian
13 Millard Fillmore Unitarian
14 Franklin Pierce Episcopalian
15 James Buchanan Presbyterian
16 Abraham Lincoln raised Baptist; later no specific denomination
17 Andrew Johnson no specific denomination *
18 Ulysses S Grant Presbyterian/Methodist
19 Rutherford B. Hayes Methodist
20 James A. Garfield Disciples of Christ
21 Chester A. Arthur Episcopalian
22 Grover Cleveland Presbyterian
23 Benjamin Harrison Presbyterian
24 Grover Cleveland Presbyterian
25 William McKinley Methodist
26 Theodore Roosevelt Dutch Reformed; Episcopalian
27 William Howard Taft Unitarian
28 Woodrow Wilson Presbyterian
29 Warren G. Harding Baptist
30 Calvin Coolidge Congregationalist
31 Herbert Hoover Quaker
32 Franklin Delano Roosevelt Episcopalian
33 Harry S. Truman Baptist
34 Dwight D. Eisenhower Jehovah's WitnessPresbyterian
35 John F. Kennedy Catholic
36 Lyndon Baines Johnson Disciples of Christ
37 Richard M. Nixon Quaker
38 Gerald Ford Episcopalian
39 Jimmy Carter Baptist
40 Ronald Reagan Presbyterian
41 George H. W. Bush Episcopalian
42 William Jefferson Clinton Baptist
43 George W. Bush Methodist (former Episcopalian)
The operative statement is "Freedom OF Religion", not Freedom FROM Religion.
It is accurate to say that the vast MAJORITY were Christian, which can be proven in the letters and other writtings of the day.
You have bitten a rotten apple. The "most were deists" is the stuff of urban legend. One doesn't have to work very hard to find in their public records and writtings the evidence that refutes this silly urban legend.
It is factual that NOT all were Christains, as some have claimed.
Just a couple of examples:
The article you chose uses slick out of context quotes to make its' flawed point, quoting Adams as saying that best of world's is one without relgion in it.....yet this same Adams said that the Revolution forever joined the principles of Christianity and civil government, and that if it did not, then the revolution was in vain.
Adams also said describing the IMPORTANCE of the study of the Bible said, "...it is not so much praiseworthy to be acquainted with as it is shameful to be ingnorant of it"
The first draft of the First Ammendent proclaimed that Congress shall pass no law prohibiting the free excercise of any DEMONINATION (this is key to understanding the actual intent of the ammendment).
The author of the First Ammendment was Fisher Ames. And what does the AUTHOR of the FIRST AMMENDMENT say of the Bible. "...should not the Bible regain the place it once held as a school book? The reverence for the Sacred Book that is thus early impressed lasts long...."
And as for the favorite misquoted and taken out of context Founding Father, Thomas Jeffererson, Jefferson authored bills for the state of Virgina, promoted by Madison, that included"
"A Bill For Saving the Property of teh Church Hertofore by Law Established"
"A Bill for Punishing Disturbers of Religious Worship and Sabbath Breakers"
"A Bill for Appointing Days of Public Fasting and Thanksgiving"
But wait, it gets BETTER. Jefferson, while presdident, approved several measures appropriating FEDERAL FUNDS to pay for CHRISTIAN missionaries to the Indians.
And for good measure, Jefferson designed space at the University of Virgina for chapel services and expected students to participate in the various religious schools which he PERSONNALY invited to locate adjacent to and UPON the University property.
Now why would a DEIST, who would believe God no longer concerned in the affairs of man, place a chapel in the University that he designed, and further expect students to make use of this chapel?
When are the judges who rule FOR the ACLU in cases against the Ten Commandments, or any mention of the Almight God in "educational" institutions going to themselves be impeached for ruling against the Constitution? THE TIME
HAS COME!!!!
No I don't agree with you.
Yes when will you be moving!??
Welcome to FreeRepublic...
Be careful using the democrat here..
Because democracy sucks.. and democrats are the suckers..
Welcome to FR
"It cannot be emphasized too strongly or too often that this great nation was founded, not by religionists, but by Christians; not on religions, but on the Gospel of Jesus Christ. For this very reason peoples of other faiths have been afforded asylum, prosperity, and freedom of worship here."
I got this quote from "America's God and Country: Encyclopedia of Quotations" by William J. Federer (page 289). Mr. Federer referenced Steve C. Dawson's "God's Providence in American History", David Barton's "The Myth of Separation", and M. E. Bradford's "The Trumpet Voice of Freedom: Patrick Henry of Virginia" as sources for this quote.
I appreciate your post, yet I am unaware of any misquotation here. Are you saying Mr. Barton has acknowledged it cannot be found in Mr. Henry's correspondence?
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