Posted on 03/23/2007 7:05:34 PM PDT by Pro-Bush
The Arizona Daily Star Published: 03.23.2007
UFOs flew over Phoenix in '97, Symington says By Tom Beal ARIZONA DAILY STAR
"The universe is a big place, and we're conceited to think we're alone." Fife Symington, former Ariz. governor Former Gov. Fife Symington says now that those strange lights that appeared over Phoenix a decade ago were from another world and that he had a close encounter with an alien craft on March 13, 1997.
"I'm a pilot and I know just about every machine that flies. It was bigger than anything that I've ever seen. It remains a great mystery. Other people saw it, responsible people," Symington said Thursday. "I don't know why people would ridicule it."
Symington, who was in his second term as governor of Arizona during the Phoenix Lights incident, recently told a UFO investigator making a documentary that he had kept quiet about his personal close encounter because he didn't want to panic the populace. He repeated his story Thursday on CNN, saying the craft he saw was "enormous. It just felt other-worldly. In your gut, you could just tell it was other-worldly."
(Excerpt) Read more at azstarnet.com ...
Do you have a reference or citation for this? I'm particularly interested in whether the prophetic elements You cite were found and dated.
Thank you.
I usually do find very interesting things in your extended posts.
Online Critical Pseudepigrapha
In about 1967 and about a hundred miles south of Phoenix I was involved in a similar sighting.
Not 'three miles' but a reportedly huge and consistently described vehicle, lights, low flying, ozone (the whold nine yards) and reported by several dozens of diverse sources.
IIRC - When it was all over, there were no photos, no radar images, and zero feedback from our reports (common experience). Control tower SAW it, pilots and military SAW it, I did not see it; no one offered up photos.
Although I've recited this tale before, it's kind of fun:
During another night time sighting (attributed to obsolete USN aircraft where they were almost never seen) I called Mt Lemon radar to advise them - then could not raise them on a return call.
About that time I'd have believed anything might have happened.
An hour or so later I did get through to learn the entire crew had rushed outside to SEE something after my alert call - the screens were left untended.
THANKS TONS FOR THE DETAILS.
Fascinating.
Especially the radar folks leaving their screens to get a gander themselves.
ELISABETTA BOARETTO (Weizmann Institute of Science): We are going to take a very small amount of samples, and we are going to burn the sample in order to recover the carbon in the form of CO2.
NARRATOR: The test measures the amount of radioactive carbon present in the sample, an amount that decays steadily over time at a known rate. The technique cannot pinpoint a precise year, but it gives a probable range of dates for the material. The rope comes from sometime between the years 70 and 260hardly conclusive results. It could be, as Freund believes, from the time of the First Revolt when the temple was destroyed, but it could also be from Bar Kokhba's time.
RICHARD FREUND: Is it the older extreme or the newer extreme?
NARRATOR: Freund is not discouraged. As he presents his findings at a conference at New York University, he has one more card to play, a well-accepted test by an Israeli archeologist to narrow the range.
RICHARD FREUND: It's called Broshi's Law. Magen Broshi came up with a law when they carbon-dated all of the Dead Sea Scrolls but they still had a 200 year gap, and they couldn't figure out. And Broshi's Law was an experiment that they did on letters from the Cave of Letters. Why? Because the Cave of Letters has dated documents.
NARRATOR: Using three letters from Bar Kokhba, archeologist Magen Broshi compared the actual dates appearing on the letters to the results of the carbon-14 analysis. In each case, the actual date of the letters corresponded almost exactly with the older date in the carbon-14 range.
RICHARD FREUND: Broshi's Law is, "You always follow the older extreme." That's what they use in the Dead Sea Scrolls; I didn't make this law up. But I also want to start to show you something very interesting about the carbon-14 dating we did.
Vincent "The Chin" Gigante
I was referring to the alleged mention of Herod. Is that found in the Dead Sea Scrolls?
My question is whether the mention of Herod is in the fragment dated to 200 BC. I've asked this specific question three times now. I don't know how to make it any clearer.
I have looked for sources myself; otherwise I wouldn't be asking.
From Charlesworths Pseudepigraphra - speaking of chapters here fragment IDs and current scholarly dating (also taken from Charlesworths book) are mine:
2. The Book of the Similitudes (37-71) 105-64 BC
3. The Book of Astronomical Writings (72-82) four copies 4Q208-211 110 BC
4. The Book of Dream Visions (83-90) - 4Q205, 4Q206,4Q207 165-161 BC
5. The Book of the Epistle of Enoch (91-107) - 4Q205, 4Q206,4Q212 105-104 BC and pre-Maccabean
My book on the Dead Sea Scrolls probably has the carbon dating on each of the fragments. Unfortunately, it is boxed up somewhere in the basement since we recently moved. But here is an online sample showing how the radiocarbon dating comes in with a earlier date:
From Radiocarbon Dating of Scrolls and Linen Fragments from the Judean Desert (1995), 4Q208 has Radio Carbon dates of 166-102 BC and 186-92 BC - and a Paleographic date 200 BC
I must leave now but Ill see what more I can find on the subject in the books which are not in storage.
Your original post on the subject strongly implied that Enoch made specific predictions regarding Herod, and that these predictions had been carbon-dated to 200 BC.
I have been unable to unable to substantiate this claim from any online source, nor have I found anything in your posts -- a quotation from a reference, for example.
What, specfically, is the "Herod inference"?
Interesting.
Thanks.
Hmmmmm. Plausible.
Impressive. Thanks.
Aside from telling Jack Northrop that he could have the Bomber contract for the relatively stealthy B-49 only if he moved all the work to Texas, and merged with Convair....
Then doing everthing he could to ruin Northrop for the sin of refusing his corrupt demands.
Instead we got the "aluminium overcast" B-36 with propellors and a RCS as big as a smallish planet, and slow enough to give the world a weeks notice that they were on the way.
Well, I take it personally.
Symington once formally requested a report from military sources regarding the possible existence of subterranean superhumans.
Per wikipedia....
As I said before, the presupposition of scholars dating ancient manuscripts is that prophesy cannot happen. Thus the mention of an event which is a verifiable bit of history causes them to date the manuscript after that historical event.
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