Posted on 04/25/2008 6:36:20 AM PDT by MizSterious
SAN ANGELO, Texas (AP) - Dozens of mothers from a polygamist retreat were bused away from their children Thursday, their legal efforts to stay united rejected as Texas officials sort out their massive custody case.
Two buses took the women from the San Angelo Coliseum, where they had been temporarily housed with their children. Texas officials were preparing to move the last of more than 400 children to group homes, shelters and residences, some hundreds of miles away, over the next few days.
One woman held a handwritten sign out the bus window that read: "SOS. Mothers separated. Help."
"There are no words to describe how it was," said Velvet, a mother who was forced to leave her 13-month old. She and other sect women have refused to give their last names, fearing it will affect their custody cases.
"We've been staying up nights to watch over the children because we didn't know what would happen," she said in a news conference outside the ranch gates Thursday.
In Austin, the state's 3rd Court of Appeals rejected the mothers' pleas to immediately stop authorities from busing the children taken from the ranch to foster homes.
The court agreed to hear arguments Tuesday, but attorney Robert Doggett, who represents 48 mothers, said that "having a hearing after the fact" was pointless.
(Excerpt) Read more at dailyiowan.com ...
Yes, it was. And it was gut-wrenching, watching the separations. I have to admit I had many misgivings until some of the facts started coming out, most particularly about the validity of the warrants. To me, that's the main thing: are the warrants valid, and was this done lawfully. I believe (based on opinions expressed by people who know lots more about the law than I do) that it was all on the up and up, at least so far. It has yet to go to court, actually probably at least two courts, family court and possibly criminal court depending on the evidence, so we'll see how it goes.
People who say children should "never" be removed from a home have no idea what evil they would unleash if they got their wish. Sometimes removal is the only thing that can save their lives. Given the waterboarding-type torture this group uses to "break" babies of crying, I would say that it's possible that's the case here, too.
BTW, for anyone searching for specifically FLDS threads, I have tried to insert the keyword flds on each thread I have seen in the past three weeks or so. I know I missed some, but most of them should be there.
If anyone posting to a thread that doesn't include that keyword would add it, that would be nice.
Thanks.
Thanks, moderator for your help.
The picture doesn't make any sense, anyway...and at least it could be modified to a smaller size. However, it really IS spam!
I'm sure that's a great comfort to the children. I'm sure the lawyers are just all as pleased as punch that there is no room on any docket for their individual case in the forseeable future, and when their individual custody case eventually does get a chance to be heard, it will be long after the fact. Who knows? Maybe they can get more billable hours that way. Who cares? It is an industry, after all. No one bats an eye.
...and it will be sorted out.
When? After the trauma to the innocent has already been multiplied many times over?
Cordially,
That is a great point, and I think that had more to do with the way this was handled than anything. I am not sure that the women and children don't know- a friend of mine that lives near Colorado City told me that the polymagists have a practice of keeping secret who parents and children are and that children are told when they think they are old enough to keep the secret. The little ones may not know but the older ones likely do. Of course I guess it is possible after doing this for a while they may have actually lost track.
I once recieved a visit from CPS at my home when my daughter was going through a messy divorce- I am really sure if we had all played games with the investigator as to who my grandson and his mother were and how we were all related to him- he would have been removed. You just can't use subterfuge with authorities and expect the best results.
We were candid with the investigator and I even stood up to him on one issue- when I truthfully told him we did have guns in our home in response to him asking- he wanted to see how we had them stored, and I told him no he could not. I did ask him how to store them around children in a way our state would approve of and he told me. I thought he might get heavy handed over that- but he didn't. It was all quite professional and we never heard from them again.
I do at times question how much power CPS has, which is normal in a free society- but I don't know how they could protect children if they didn't have a lot of power. I have heard of abuses of that power but there are bad apples in every bunch.
If I EVER get dumb enough to “groom” my 13 year old girls to marry “older” men....please,.please.....come over yourself and slap me upside the head.
BTTT
They did, at my divorce, along with my wallet and a lung. By that didn't make me hate Texas, or women, or children, or even my ex really. And it certainly didn't make me want to give child rapists a pass.
What did they take from you to make you the way you are?
I just heard Dr. Michael Baden (forensic expert) on Fox News. He said the DNA from the mother will determine which children are hers. (Microchrondial?) That test takes a couple of months. The father’s DNA can also be determined via a different test which doesn’t take as long, and the testing can determine incestual relationships.
He also pointed out that the age of the girls can be determined by bone x-rays.
Well-reasoned and articulate post overall. I don't agree with everything you have posted on various threads, but this is a keeper, IMO. Thanks
If they don’t know who the mother is, then it would seem to be much more difficult to match up the parents and children- not using the mother means they have to start with the child and compare all other DNA- I guess. Did he say anything about how this works with no verified mother either?
I was also wondering if there was a medical way to verify ages- did he say how close they can get with this method? Can they nail down the exact age I wonder or just a range of ages.
Thanks for alerting me to this post. I agree with much of the sentiment.
IMHO most at FR have some concerns about the way this is playing out, and all of us (I hope) have grave concerns about the allegations in this case, and the history of this sect.
There is more middle ground here than many of us are willing to concede.
Here, perhaps you would take the word of the women who actually lived there, and were raped.
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/2006719/posts
Tammy, I assume they will match the children to the women they have gotten DNA from. Same for the men. If there is not a match, it means the natural mother or father didn’t come forward for any range of reasons.
He didn’t get into the details other than to say bone x-rays can determine the age of children. (I assume a close approximation depending on pediatric bone development, but I didn’t catch how close to actual age. He talked about it like it would be pretty determinative, at least that was my impression.
Probably not aware as I do not watch TV. Dont really trust it. Especially since WACO.
I hope people are not miscontruing what I am saying. I certainly dont support underage fornication or marriage. Certainly if people are being forced into relationships or just sex then it of course is wrong and illegal. Ultimately the state is treading on dangerous ground when via a bogus phone call they storm a compund. The Same thing was done in WACO. I was only pointing out that teens who have sex willingly are not really abused they are not raped even though the state likes to define it as Statutory rape.
It makes me very worried that the state has the power to take children then say an anonymous phone call is what spurred them into action. From what I understand no grand Jury was assembled to investigate if a crime had been committed was there?
I for example am a Baptist Fundamentalist and we for example believe in spanking our children if they misbehave. But you better not let DFACS in Georgia find that out, because they will take your children claiming abuse. You better not spank in public either. The State has very dangerous powers and I fear that if the children especially the young ones are taken from their mother it may do more harm than good.
Was a grand jury formed???
That’s a picture of the judge fishing for some criminals! I think it a fitting theme picture for the FLDS affair.
++
How about we give it back to Mexico.
I don’t care. It’s ruining the formatting AND it’s spam.
Spam is not allowed.
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