Posted on 11/06/2008 1:35:14 PM PST by Demosthenes
Forgive me for rehashing this if anybody is tired of reading it, but I finally did all of the research for myself, and have some info you may not have seen.
Barack Obama has never shown his birth certificate. Allow me to explain. A "certification" of live birth is a copy document, accessible by the public, or government agencies, and usually a relatively legally acceptable document in most scenarios. You can use it at the DMV, or to get a passport.
A "Certificate" of live birth is the actual document itself, created on the day/moment of the event, and it is a hospital-maintained record in most cases, accessible only by immediate family and the person for whom it was issued.
Here is what Barack Obama's website put out initially:
http://www.politifact.com/media/img/graphics/birthCertObama.jpg
This image is a fraud, plain and simple. There is no state seal, no Registrar's signature, and only a vague June 2007 stamp on the reverse side. Both the signature and seal are easily visible in any photocopy, and are deliberately so. The artifacts surrounding the text are clear photoshop work. Giving Obama the benefit of the doubt, probably some overzealous aide generated it from a viewing of the regular document.
This is an image from Factcheck.org of what the website put out, excpet here we have an actual photograph, in high resolution, proving the website document a forgery. Notice, this document has the necessary seals and signatures:
http://www.factcheck.org/UploadedFiles/birth_certificate_6.jpg
This is, at least, a real document from the State Records office. It is still not an actual copy of the Certificate of Live Birth. The State seal and signature on this document certify to all viewers that this document was created by an actual State Agency, is not a forgery, and that the State of Hawaii accept it as a legal and valid document.
Remember, this is simply a legal substitute for the real birth certificate.
Both of these were offered up as "Birth Cretificates" when they are in fact legally-acceptable substitutes for the real thing. In most cases, this is not a big deal. However, in the case of a US President, I believe they are a VERY big deal.
An actual Certificate of Live Birth in Hawaii, through the 1960s, looks like this:
http://snarkybytes.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/06/hawaii-birth-certificate-1963.jpg
And the critical bit of information it discloses is the location of Birth.
They are very specific about that, and there are boxes for the location, be it hospital, home, foreign country or otherwise.
This is the document that has been sealed by the Governor of Hawaii in 2008, in a special action that affected only Obama's Birth Certificate.
How very convenient.
Why has special action bee taken to prevent this document from being seen?
Because, I suspect, there is information on it which would directly contradict public statements about his birth and begin unraveling a number of lies told to the public about his true origin, and raise serious questions about his eligibility.
His sister, and Grandmother in Kenya have both spoken publicly, and made statements about his locale of birth that contradict his own statements.
Why hide it, Mr. Obama?
What reason on earth would you have for asking the Governor of Hawaii to hide this document on your behalf?
Now THAT is an interesting take on it. Republican President, Dem VP. Been awhile since that happened.
No, you were not “testy” This has been a very thoughtful discussion (devoid of trolls for now) and hopefully, looking at fact instead of emotion.
I don’t see how the SCOTUS cannot intervene in this case. The ramifications of letting an unqualified person assume the office of President goes to the core of our Republic.
And, it goes back to what Berg has been saying all along, all Obama has to do is produce the vault copy and the issue is over.
As it stands he has some problems with his affidavit for his Illinois law license since he stated he didn’t use any alias’ and there are at least 6 on record. But is that a felony? That alone could preclude him from seeking either the office of Senate (State or Federal) let alone a run at the Presidency.
The Democrats (and MSM) have opened up a can of worms because they wanted to get this guy elected. Had the media spent as much effort digging into Obama’s background as they did Palin’s we wouldn’t be in this mess. Forget about Ayers, Wright, and Pflager. This goes to the basic qualifications of holding an elected office. The media, and to some extent the Democrat Party has disenfranchised 65 million Americans who went to the polls thinking they were voting for a viable candidate. Whatever the final vote tally, that’s the crime.
AMEN!
Don’t you have to have a birth certificate to get a passport?
Not in every case. This was discussed in great detail the other evening....Was late to the thread and only read the comments.....Regardless, a BC in HI is a product of two types of original documentation: Registry of Birth or Certificate of Live birth...Read the thread and maybe by then one of us can find the the specific answers.
I absolutely agree with that. I hope someone knows the answer, is it Souters decision whether this goes before the whole court? I don't trust Souter.
As it stands he has some problems with his affidavit for his Illinois law license since he stated he didn’t use any alias’ and there are at least 6 on record. But is that a felony? That alone could preclude him from seeking either the office of Senate (State or Federal) let alone a run at the Presidency.
The ramifications of his fraud are staggering.
Had the media spent as much effort digging into Obama’s background as they did Palin’s we wouldn’t be in this mess.
I'm not convinced that the press doesn't know more than they're saying. They knew about the Clintons and remained silent.
I really don’t know ... I would have to do some MAJOR research.
If disqualified:
Obama could certainly lose his law license if he misrepresented facts on his bar application, but that would be up to the Illinois Bar to decide. He might also be subject to Illinois state laws concerning fraud - but I do not know the law there.
Obama could be in jeopardy of losing his Senate seat under Article I, Section 5, Paragaphs 1 and 2. However, since the Dems control the Senate, I think it unlikely.
Mucho Thanks for the heads-up on the bookmark ...
Understood - assuming Obama is disqualified:
I have some lengthy posts on other threads that explain what could happen before the Electoral College meets and the vote is certified (Obama disqualified, McCain’s electors replace Obama’s, Biden MAYBE getting the VP slot if SCOTUS ruled that his election was legal).
I also detail the scenario after the vote is certified (Obama disqualified, VP Elect becomes acting POTUS on 01/20/09 unti a new POTUS has qualified (which I would believe to be McCain - next highest total from the election). This is where the 20th Amendment kicks in. McCain to be POTUS, Biden MAYBE VP (if SCOTUS ruled that his election was legal).
I also detail what might happen after 10/20/09 (Obama disqualified, Biden assumes POTUS per 25th Amendment and selects VP, McCain suing based on the claim of fraud). Question is at that point - would McCain prevail? If he did, McCain POTUS. Again, Biden MAYBE VP (if SCOTUS ruled that his election was legal).
It’s a bookmark for my convenience so I can find my place on the thread; it shows up in my “new comments/pings” page.
Offduty -
You are forgetting the 12th Amendment ... It separates votes for POTUS and VP. I think a “ticket” now means 1 vote for POTUS, 1 for VP.
Biden did not file POTUS papers at the FEC and the States - he filed VP papers ...
I agree with you 100%. If he is found to be NOT a natural born citizen, or otherwise ineligible due to citizenship issues, and still allowed to be president, the entire Constitution now means absolutely nothing.
If you search for Berg at Scotus and change from the default Supreme Court Files to the Supreme Court Docket Files, you will find the status of Berg’s filings.
Personally IMO, if these cases continue to be dismissed and Obama is never forced to fork up his certified vault copy to anyone to be able to verify he is qualifed one way or the other, our entire Constitution would now mean absolutely nothing.
This needs to be settled and put to bed, and Obama needs to release his BC, PERIOD. If he gets away with continuing to hide what's there, I will never, ever see him as anything other than a foreign usurper who bought and stole our election through fraud.
CORRECTAMUNDO!!!
If we the people are no ready to go to war over this, then we the people are no longer the sovereigns and have been usurped by fraud that we accepted for utilitarian reasons.
I misread the other post, so I was wrong to call it that. But seriously, what do you think could have bought Gov. Lingle’s (HI) silence? She was supposed to be a major McCain supporter and she is a Republican. The only thing I can figure is that somebody at State or whatever showed her the worst case scenario (outright civil war) and convinced her to go along with it. I wonder if she demanded some sort of assurances from Obama himself, and that’s why he went there (besides the sick Grandma whom he didn’t see for 2-3 days after landing).
Guys -
I have been holding a little nugget back, a fly in the ointment as it were ...
The Immigration Reform and Control Act of 1986 (IRCA) mandates that ALL employers check work eligibility status.
I was a longtime consultant for MCI and, when they hired all the consultants in 1988 in order to save money, I had to show 3 forms of ID (BC, Driver’s License, and SS Card). And MCI had to check - some of the consultants did not make it and were let go.
In this case, there is ALSO a natural born status requirement - so the BC definitely should be produced.
If SCOTUS gives Obama a pass ... then ALL employers recently convicted for using illegal aliens and NOT verifying work eligibility would have grounds for IMMEDIATE reversal.
This would be a clear violation of their rights under the 14th Amendment (Equal Protection under the law).
Someone needs to pass this on to Berg - anyone know how to contact him?
I have heard conflicting reports about Lingle's supposed sealing of the documents. Some say she did seal it, some say she didn't.
There are good arguments made here as to why it may have been sealed (prevent any possible tampering while awaiting potential litigation). I cannot say for certain what happened or why.
The simple fact is there are many folks who will not accept the fact that he won't release the original, his transcripts or other college records, his health records, or his IL senate records.
The COLB is one of many things BO hasn't supplied. If I applied for a job that required certain documentary proof, you could be darn certain that I wouldn't get hired without it.
Check my post at 317. The underlying question at the time was there are some states that only have the top of the ticket on the ballot. Therefore, you have Obama without Biden and McCain without Palin.
Since the 12th Amendment requires electors to make a list of all votes for President and a seperate list for Vice President, could a case be made that those ballots that did not contain the names of the VP candidates be void?
It was a very narrow question/scenario we were addressing.
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