Posted on 01/26/2009 2:12:13 PM PST by Navy Patriot
Me too.
The guy was on the ground and restrained. Video pretty clearly shows the cop stood up, drew his weapon, aimed, and pulled the trigger.
Hard to see how that is an AD.
Your innocence is charming, and I mean that in a good way.
BART cops are no worse than any other cops that have ever existed -- they consider themselves a breed apart, above the law. That's why they call us "civilians", even though they're just as "civilian" as anybody else. They're the Blue Army -- and sometimes the Blue Army kills people.
That's why is best to have as little to do with the police as possible -- because they ARE the law -- at least when no smartasses with cell phone cameras are around -- and with that kind of power even a "good cop" can go bad at any minute and with no warning. Next time it may be you or me on the receiving end of What are you gonna do -- call the cops ?
I think policing should be done by unarmed neighborhood watch groups backed up by professional paramilitary police like the Gendarmerie in France or the Carabinieri in Italy. Police should be under military discipline and subject to the UCMJ. When was the last time a GI shot an unarmed kid here in America -- 1970?
You are implying the beaten upon should turn the evidence over to the mob that's administering the beating. Unbelievable. What kind of idiot are you?
While I agree that being a known “bad actor” could explain the police treating this particular person more harshly than might appear warranted, I don’t think that could ever justify shooting him while he’s down and doesn’t justify smacking him around while he’s not immediately threatening them. I have a lot of respect for the job police officers do and the stress they go through and understand that hindsight it 20/20 but given the power that we give police officers, we also have an interest in making sure that the people who don’t have the temperment for it aren’t given that power and to make sure that those who go way too far don’t literally get away with murder.
It seems pretty obvious from the shooter’s reaction that he’s as surprised as anyone. I really believe that he thought he was pulling his taser. I don’t know what you call that: involuntary manslaughter?
1st degree murder facing lethal injection.
However, it seems pretty obvious that he unlawfully killed another person who was not an imminent threat to anyone.
Perhaps he did think he was pulling his taser. I know some are offering that opinion. I have difficulty with it since a taser is quite a bit different from a pistol:
TASER pic: http://defensereview.com/1_31_2004/Taser%20X26_1.jpg
Glock pic (I assume it was a Glock, but even if not I think the point remains):http://www.enemyforces.net/firearms/glock17_3.jpg
Hard to say what was going through the cop's mind, although I have my own theory. No doubt he is deeply remorseful. Hopefully he would be remorseful even if the incident was not recorded.
Has anybody seen this new video? The video at the link doesn’t seem to be it.
Subject was already down on the ground, and in restraints. No need to even be pulling a taser here. Not involuntary manslaughter, at all. Murder, 2d degree depraved indifference to human life...
the infowarrior
I agree, and you will note that I recited specific facts must be present to allow "probable cause for more scrutiny".
Those being: a cop on the scene must:
1 Personally know the suspect AND be able to identify him.
2 The cop must also personally know of a felony or related misdemeanor CONVICTION of the suspect.
Also, "scrutiny" means investigation, not beating or shooting.
The Chron won't link to Fox.
“Interestingly all these videos went to the media first rather than to police or prosecutors.”
According to an earlier thread
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-bloggers/2171950/posts
the police confiscated as many cell phones as they could, which is, per the thread, an illegal warrantless search and seizure. That IMO implies there is something they don’t want the rest of us to see, which therefore ironically supports one’s decision to take the video to the media.
I’m glad you find it charming. I admit my experience with the law has been little and mostly positive (ok, 2 speeding tickets in 35 years). Still even if they are overbearing bad kinda guys (and I know you didn’t mean they all were, but lets just assume) why would they be so careless to whack someone in full view of witnesses (and their cameras)? That’s why I am leaning toward it being some sort of horrible accident. I don’t mean by that that the cop who did it should just be given a slap on the wrist. When you assume a position of such authority over others you really have to be held to a higher standard. But it will take a little more info before I believe he just randomly murdered that kid just because.
But, I’m open for more info. And if he did indeed murder that guy, hang ‘em high.
OK... that’s the one I was looking for.
I can’t say it convinces me of anything one way or another. Guy#1 (the guy who got punched) was standing up... and turned and moved to his left to come up behind another cop dealing with somebody else. Then this cop (the punching one) left his guy#2 on the ground he was dealing with, came over and grabbed guy#1 pulling him back from the others and back up where he was with his back to the wall. There’s some scuffling that is admittedly a little fuzzy. I can’t tell what the guy#1 was doing with his hands, but he was grabbing either at the cop or his equipment. The the cop punches him pretty hard to the face, then steps back... the guy settles down to a sitting position.
Sure, maybe the cop was out of hand. But I’m not sure that this video says that. The important part is what you can’t see. You can’t really see what the guy was doing with his hands. Seems like that makes a difference.
I’m in pretty much that same space. The first video of the cop shooting the guy looks pretty bad. Sure, the guy was fighting while being put in restraints but he did seem to be mostly under the control of the other cops that were all over him.
And it does look to me like the most astonished person of all after the shot was the cop that fired his weapon. It looks like a dreadful yet accidental shooting, not an intentional execution.
But I’m willing to believe either, depending on where the evidence leads.
I wonder what would have happened to the evidence at the police station?
Police are not supposed to hit people lined up against a wall offering no resistance...get rid of the rotten apples before they destroy law enforcement’s reputation.
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