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Scientists Abuzz Over Controversial Rumor that God Particle Has Been Detected
LiveScience.com ^ | 4/22/11 | Mike Wall

Posted on 04/22/2011 9:57:23 PM PDT by NormsRevenge

A rumor is floating around the physics community that the world's largest atom smasher may have detected a long-sought subatomic particle called the Higgs boson, also known as the "God particle."

The controversial rumor is based on what appears to be a leaked internal note from physicists at the Large Hadron Collider (LHC), a 17-mile-long particle accelerator near Geneva, Switzerland. It's not entirely clear at this point if the memo is authentic, or what the data it refers to might mean — but the note already has researchers talking.

The buzz started when an anonymous commenter recently posted an abstract of the note on Columbia University mathematician Peter Woit's blog, Not Even Wrong.

Some physicists say the note may be a hoax, while others believe the "detection" is likely a statistical anomaly that will disappear upon further study. But the find would be a huge particle-physics breakthrough, if it holds up.

"If it were to be real, it would be really exciting," said physicist Sheldon Stone of Syracuse University.

(Excerpt) Read more at livescience.com ...


TOPICS: News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: godparticle; hadron; higgsboson; lhc; rumor; scientists
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1 posted on 04/22/2011 9:57:27 PM PDT by NormsRevenge
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This track is an example of simulated data modelled for the CMS detector on the Large Hadron Collider (LHC) at CERN. Here a Higgs boson is produced and then decays into two jets of hadrons and two electrons. The lines represent the possible paths of particles produced by the proton-proton collision in the detector while the energy these particles deposit is shown in blue. CREDIT: CERN


2 posted on 04/22/2011 10:00:05 PM PDT by NormsRevenge (Semper Fi ... Godspeed .. Monthly Donor Onboard .. Obama: Epic Fail or Bust!!!)
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To: NormsRevenge
So what if it is real? What can you do with that knowledge? If you assume it is real, what will you do differently that matters? Does it justify the mountains of money spent building equipment to answer the question?
3 posted on 04/22/2011 10:02:20 PM PDT by Myrddin
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To: NormsRevenge
Nothing to add.

Just wanted to post.

Image and video hosting by TinyPic

4 posted on 04/22/2011 10:02:37 PM PDT by Cyber Ninja
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To: NormsRevenge
Well, son of a gun.


5 posted on 04/22/2011 10:02:41 PM PDT by oyez (The difference in genius and stupidity is that genius has limits.)
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To: NormsRevenge
God particle is not scheduled to make its appearance until May 21:

Fundamentalist-evangelical Harold Camping predicts rapture of 200 million on May 21, 2011

yitbos

6 posted on 04/22/2011 10:03:09 PM PDT by bruinbirdman ("Those who control language control minds." -- Ayn Rand)
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To: Myrddin
We're a thousand years away from fusion, IMHO.

But, if we don't do the research, we're 1001 years away, and counting.

At some point, we have to think past our own lifetimes.
7 posted on 04/22/2011 10:09:05 PM PDT by SJSAMPLE
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To: bruinbirdman

I dunno, I figured it’d show up by Sunday morning...


8 posted on 04/22/2011 10:09:34 PM PDT by bigbob (u)
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To: NormsRevenge

Let’s see...we are spending billions of dollars and thousands of man hours of highly educated people to try and find this little particle to show that all that we see could have happened be chance (dumb luck)...I fail to see the logic.

Even if it is found we then have to answer the next question...WHY.


9 posted on 04/22/2011 10:11:19 PM PDT by WorldviewDad (following God instead of culture)
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To: NormsRevenge

>> “If it were to be real, it would be really exciting,” said physicist Sheldon Stone of Syracuse University.

Now, how exactly would Stone know that he’d be excited without evidence of the particle’s existence? Hmm....


10 posted on 04/22/2011 10:11:27 PM PDT by Gene Eric (*** Jesus ***)
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To: NormsRevenge

This would be one of the primary physics discoveries of the last 30 years or so.

The stupid name of it sucks, but the Higgs Boson is a really amazing idea. It brings the entire universe closer to making all creation down to a few lines of formulas.

IMO, it might be as simple as -1=+1=0. And we’re in one of those sides which seems as real as anything, but in effect is nothing.


11 posted on 04/22/2011 10:15:47 PM PDT by Tolsti2
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To: Myrddin

It is believe the “God Particle” is the missing link that would fill in the blanks for theoretical physics.


12 posted on 04/22/2011 10:16:38 PM PDT by Red Steel
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To: Red Steel

I wish that name would stop. It’s not that much more important than the Z and W bosons in the scheme of things, I think.

It’s a major thing though. Can we, as humans, understand the basic building blocks of reality and space/time?


13 posted on 04/22/2011 10:19:13 PM PDT by Tolsti2
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To: NormsRevenge
I am doing some reading on all of this. Seems like such a discovery could help unify relativity (big picture) and quantum theory (small picture).

The god particle somehow would explain how subatomic particles (virtual particles because they seem more like ideas than things) are connected or something.

This research is significant because they might lead to technology like instantaneous faster than light communication, the possibility of sending messages backward in time, how complex information in DNA and RNA first come into being, taping energy from empty space or perhaps shaping physical reality through consciousness.


14 posted on 04/22/2011 10:21:37 PM PDT by garjog
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To: NormsRevenge
Ahh...
But to get an unGodly number of particles
there is nothing like the
Spallation Neutron Source

But they will all be neutral...


15 posted on 04/22/2011 10:23:39 PM PDT by HangnJudge
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To: Tolsti2

Sounds positively fractal.

:)


16 posted on 04/22/2011 10:24:32 PM PDT by D-fendr
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To: NormsRevenge

The ironic thing is that the God particle is inherent in the nature of the universe if you follow.


17 posted on 04/22/2011 10:26:14 PM PDT by Republic_of_Secession.
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To: NormsRevenge
Do you think this discovery will make my VCR stop blinking 12:00?

It's really starting to get annoying.

18 posted on 04/22/2011 10:26:25 PM PDT by OldDeckHand
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To: garjog

Like, they could actually beam us up?


19 posted on 04/22/2011 10:42:40 PM PDT by abigailsmybaby ("To understan' the livin', you gotta commune wit' da dead." Minerva)
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To: D-fendr

Indeed. heh.

Eventually these discoveries could lead to anti-gravity and far reaching energy demands. A huge interuption in this stuff was the cancelation of the SSC by the clinton admin, one of the worst mistakes in history was to push the IIS instead of the SSC.

Both were worthy and it’s hard to say which is really better, but I’d have opted for the SSC.


20 posted on 04/22/2011 10:45:47 PM PDT by Tolsti2
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To: WorldviewDad
Let’s see...we are spending billions of dollars and thousands of man hours of highly educated people to try and find this little particle to show that all that we see could have happened be chance (dumb luck)...I fail to see the logic.

Yes, you do.

Your first failure of logic is that you are assuming people are doing this just "to show that all we see could have happened by chance (dumb luck)." That is not at all why anyone does research.

21 posted on 04/22/2011 11:02:11 PM PDT by ottbmare (off-the-track Thoroughbred mare)
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To: Myrddin

What can you do with that knowledge?

Bigger better bombs?

A Bombs.
H Bombs.
Neutron Bombs.
Boson Bombs.

There has got to be a way to explode the universe,
after all it happened before.


22 posted on 04/22/2011 11:20:35 PM PDT by tet68 ( " We would not die in that man's company, that fears his fellowship to die with us...." Henry V.)
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To: NormsRevenge

Thanks Norm, I love this stuff.


23 posted on 04/22/2011 11:41:59 PM PDT by MissMack99 (BO Stinks!)
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To: NormsRevenge

I have trillions of God particles in my yard. It’s called dirt.


24 posted on 04/23/2011 12:26:43 AM PDT by faucetman (Just the facts ma'am, just the facts)
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To: NormsRevenge; OldDeckHand; abigailsmybaby

That boson report is just a rumor, whereas there’s indisputable evidence that a bozo has been detected in the white house.


25 posted on 04/23/2011 12:31:25 AM PDT by aquila48
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To: tet68
Basic research is what we're doing when we don't know what we're doing.

It's a little frustrating to see all the taxpayer money pissed away on "research" that has no return on the investment. We all work hard to earn the money that is confiscated and passed around to folks that screw around.

26 posted on 04/23/2011 12:46:12 AM PDT by Myrddin
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To: WorldviewDad

“Even if it is found we then have to answer the next question...WHY.”

Ah.....now enters the Philosophers.


27 posted on 04/23/2011 1:10:23 AM PDT by Puckster
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To: OldDeckHand

“Do you think this discovery will make my VCR stop blinking 12:00?
It’s really starting to get annoying.”

I gotta tell ya, I’m really frightened right now......because, I get what your saying.


28 posted on 04/23/2011 1:16:12 AM PDT by Puckster
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To: tet68

You forgot:

F-Bombs


29 posted on 04/23/2011 1:18:14 AM PDT by Puckster
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To: NormsRevenge

I suggest they name it “Clapton”.


30 posted on 04/23/2011 3:01:06 AM PDT by Stosh
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To: garjog
"might lead to technology like...the possibility of sending messages backward in time"

If it becomes possible to send messages backwards in time, why aren't we reading those messages from the future, now?

31 posted on 04/23/2011 4:15:09 AM PDT by norwaypinesavage (Galileo: In science, the authority of a thousand is not worth the humble reasoning of one individual)
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To: garjog
"might lead to technology like...the possibility of sending messages backward in time"

If it becomes possible to send messages backwards in time, why aren't we reading those messages from the future, now?

32 posted on 04/23/2011 4:16:37 AM PDT by norwaypinesavage (Galileo: In science, the authority of a thousand is not worth the humble reasoning of one individual)
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To: OldDeckHand

What’s a “VCR?”

/s


33 posted on 04/23/2011 4:19:10 AM PDT by dinodino
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To: Stosh

Thanks - too funny lol


34 posted on 04/23/2011 4:30:52 AM PDT by atc23 (The Confederacy was the single greatest conservative resistance to federal authority ever.)
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To: Puckster

F-bombs

Yes, you’re right, I stand corrected.


35 posted on 04/23/2011 4:33:37 AM PDT by tet68 ( " We would not die in that man's company, that fears his fellowship to die with us...." Henry V.)
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To: NormsRevenge

I wonder if this info was leaked on April 1st.


36 posted on 04/23/2011 4:43:36 AM PDT by Right Wing Assault (Our Constitution: the new Inconvenient Truth)
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To: dinodino
What’s a “VCR?”

I think it is a term that describes clocks that are right twice a day.

37 posted on 04/23/2011 4:44:40 AM PDT by Right Wing Assault (Our Constitution: the new Inconvenient Truth)
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To: norwaypinesavage
If it becomes possible to send messages backwards in time, why aren't we reading those messages from the future, now?

You don't think they will waste their messages on an era with so many non-believers in Man's ability to span time and also become "I Am", do you?

38 posted on 04/23/2011 4:59:11 AM PDT by trebb ("If a man will not work, he should not eat" From 2 Thes 3)
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To: Myrddin

Yes, it does. Science is not done for practical purposes. Engineering is done for practical purposes.


39 posted on 04/23/2011 5:30:23 AM PDT by GAB-1955 (I write books, love my wife, serve my nation, and believe in the Resurrection.)
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To: Puckster
Ah.....now enters the Philosophers.

Only if you're paying union rates! Or else there will be a philsophers’ strike!

40 posted on 04/23/2011 5:31:38 AM PDT by GAB-1955 (I write books, love my wife, serve my nation, and believe in the Resurrection.)
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To: SJSAMPLE
"We're a thousand years away from fusion, IMHO. But, if we don't do the research, we're 1001 years away, and counting. At some point, we have to think past our own lifetimes.

All this applies to fission as well. By today, we could have had intrinsically safe fission reactors in place and working (we do have intrinsically safe reactor DESIGNS, but they have not been commercialized).

And don't give up on fusion quite yet. There are versions of both hot AND "cold" fusion that are much closer to realization than you might think (although I think you are correct on the "magnetically confined" versions).

The hot fusion design can be found with search terms {"bussard polywell"}....without the curly brackets, of course.

The cold fusion design can be found with search terms {Rossi "cold fusion"}...again without the curly brackets.

I'm using search terms rather than links so you can see both the positive and negative points from various people, rather than providing a direct link to each so as not to "pre-prejudice" what you might see.

41 posted on 04/23/2011 6:01:11 AM PDT by Wonder Warthog
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To: Myrddin

Imbecilc Luddite alert...


42 posted on 04/23/2011 8:01:37 AM PDT by TXnMA (Remember the Alamo! Remember Goliad! REPEAT San Jacinto!!!)
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To: NormsRevenge

I’m sponsoring a car in NASCAR called THE SCIENCEMOBILE. I’ve got three physicists from MIT to drive it. They’re going to make one right turn and see what happens. My hypothesis is that they’ll find the God particle.


43 posted on 04/23/2011 9:22:24 AM PDT by blueunicorn6 ("A crack shot and a good dancer")
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To: norwaypinesavage

“If it becomes possible to send messages backwards in time, why aren’t we reading those messages from the future, now?”

Two possible answers: first the messages from the future can only be obtained one the technology is invented to capture entangled particles from the future.

Second, these message have been obtain, but are not publicized. The diagrams of Da Vinci seem to be more than anticipations of the future. http://www.mos.org/sln/Leonardo/VisionsoftheFuture.html

Third, we may be able to do anticipate future events mentally with uncanny intuitions.

New physics will show how effect proceeds cause.

http://cosmiclog.msnbc.msn.com/_news/2007/07/17/4350992-backward-research-goes-forward


44 posted on 04/23/2011 12:25:55 PM PDT by garjog
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To: tet68
There has got to be a way to explode the universe, after all it happened before.

Simple. All you have to do is cram all the matter in the entire universe into a space a billion times smaller than the period at the end of this sentence. Then say these four little words: Let there be light.....

45 posted on 04/23/2011 6:45:17 PM PDT by Red Badger (Mitt Romney: The Harold Stassen of the 21st century........)
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To: Stosh

Then it would be on par with the meson.....


46 posted on 04/23/2011 6:48:45 PM PDT by Red Badger (Mitt Romney: The Harold Stassen of the 21st century........)
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To: Red Badger

I think that’s what Obama is working on.
He’s going to print all the money in the world
and compress it down to fit into the US treasury
and then say the magic words,”Let there be debt.”


47 posted on 04/23/2011 7:51:11 PM PDT by tet68 ( " We would not die in that man's company, that fears his fellowship to die with us...." Henry V.)
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To: ottbmare

“you are assuming people are doing this just “to show that all we see could have happened by chance (dumb luck).”

First I am not assuming that SOME of the people are doing this research to prove just what I said. I have read their research articles and SOME of them have stated as such. The rest of the researchers might have different reasons...reasons that I am not aware of.

“That is not at all why anyone does research.”

That is a pretty absolute statement...so NOBODY ever does research to try to prove that this world came about in a way different then...”In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.”

You may want to rethink that statement.


48 posted on 04/23/2011 7:57:38 PM PDT by WorldviewDad (following God instead of culture)
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To: TXnMA

A victim of the public school system, probably. How can one explain the life of the mind and the pursuit of pure knowledge to such a person?


49 posted on 04/23/2011 8:08:21 PM PDT by ottbmare (off-the-track Thoroughbred mare)
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To: WorldviewDad

I know a lot of scientists. I did my graduate work in one of the “hard” science areas. I never met a single scientist who said, “I’m going to devote my life to proving that those stupid Christians are wrong and this whole thing came about by chance.”

People go into any scientific discipline because they are absolutely fascinated with it, not because they want to show everybody that Christians are wrong. Many scientists, especially the young ones who don’t have administrative responsibilities yet, will tell you gleefully that they’re thrilled some research facility is willing to pay them to spend all day in a lab, because they’re so enchanted with the work that they’d pay to do it. It’s love and delight, not some nasty contempt, that fuels most of them. Please don’t rely for your ideas about scientists on obnoxious types like Richard Dawkins.

You may be surprised to learn this, but many scientists have religious faith. Some even study science with delight in discovering how God created some particular aspect of the universe or the living world. I’ve talked to some physicists, including one in my own family, who admit that they want to know exactly how “in the beginning, God created the heavens and the earth.” Lately I have been corresponding to a mathematician who ecstatically describes mathematics as “the language of God” (not an original concept with him, by the way).

And if somebody wasn’t pursuing pure science with no direct, immediate application, we wouldn’t have developed the technology that allows you to write this to me on a computer and send it through the Internet to Free Republic, where I can disabuse you of your inaccurate ideas about scientific research.

A very blessed Easter to you.


50 posted on 04/23/2011 8:28:05 PM PDT by ottbmare (off-the-track Thoroughbred mare)
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