Ithaca Officials Ignore FREEPER Objections

The clear and simple definition for fascism is --

The government lets individuals own real property subject to the condition that government controls the use of all real property.

I rarely defend Ithaca officials, but wasn't the entire parcel only assessed at $615,000 for tax purposes?

http://www.theithacajournal.com/news/stories/20030522/localnews/342676.html

And Pine got $637,500, for his HALF of the parcel or approximately $22,000.00 more than the ENTIRE property was worth.

So What's his beef?

The government lets individuals ~~own~~ rent real property.

Nobody "owns" property anymore, even when it's completely paid for you still have to pay protection money to the tax thieves.

To the FREEPMOBILE!

So What's his beef?

He wanted it all maybe??? Who knows???

PiNg

Want on my ping list ? freepmail me

Want off my ping list ? Freepmail me

I post alot of odd and unusual and some of the same old worn out U.N. and liberal/dem bashing tripe.

Remember : We the people are in charge We the people need to start acting like it.

Nobody "owns" property anymore

That is precisely what communists want you to think ... and say.

Freedom at it's fullest is individual "fee simple" ownership of real property.

Ask yourself ... Why is it that the term "fee simple" is seldom heard anymore?

It's because "fee simple" means .... "Absolute ownership (of land) with unrestricted rights of disposition."

I rarely defend Ithaca officials, but wasn't the entire parcel only assessed at $615,000 for tax purposes?

http://www.theithacajournal.com/news/stories/20030522/localnews/342676.html

And Pine got $637,500, for his HALF of the parcel or approximately $22,000.00 more than the ENTIRE property was worth.

So What's his beef?

I suspect he's getting a good deal also. Good question.

And I don't know about New York, but in Texas, properties are often assessed well below market values.

Thanks for the ping.

Yes. On the surface, being paid $600K and change does seem generous on the surface.

Although I cannot speak for either of the three co-owners of the property (Pine, Gus, and the widow), myself and others have posted at least five articles numerous comments detailing the affront the particular project poses to moral, legal, and commercial sensibilities, as well as, the public safety. (See postings under "Ithaca" and "CU" mentioning Pine)

Briefly, and by way of just a few of the problems:

1. The conveyance of his property is being done against his will (THAT in of itself is cause enough- remember we are talking about Ithaca, NY- a little town in upstate New York);

2. The other co-owner, the widow, has not even been compensated one penny for her share in the property nor the business that she also co-owns and is/was on the premises (Beam Travel Agency);

3. Ciminelli failed to sucessfully negotiate the deal to purchase Pine's nor the widow's share. Local officials threatened him saying that if he does not sell his share to Ciminelli, they will use eminent domain to expropriate the property and hand it over to Ciminelli themselves (Among other things THAT is called racketering and extortion);

4. The conveyance of the property is also being used to add a layer of concealment over embezzled funds;

5. Certain Ithaca officials are dipping into the public treasury to fund subsidies, abatements, and kickbacks for this private commercial project using taxpayer- i.e. YOUR- hardearned money. (THAT's also called fraud and graft)

Of there are even more issues you would also find extremely objectionable. The fact certain Ithaca officials are angling to get their hands on even more hundreds of thousands of taxpayer dollars to fund a project that is not even commercially viable is yet another huge red flag.

However, the best answer to your question is that if this were being done to you, you certainly wouldn't put up with it. So, why should Pine, the widow, or any other ethical, productive, law-abiding American be forced to accept this? I find the whole thing disgusting and totally unAmerican.

If you are REALLY interested in this matter, go ahead and read the articles and comments and then let us know what you think. Remember, they are fixing on using your taxmoney too.

FANTASTIC PHOTO!

Thanks for posting it.

Sadly, unless you can convince your local US Attorney's Office to take IMMEDIATE action to stop these crooks, the people are on their own against the Ithaca Baathists.

Actually, the misuse of eminent domain in this case is inappropriate and does not bear scrutiny under the law for several reasons- including a whole bunch previously posted.

If you want to help, let us know.

Actually, the misuse of eminent domain in this case is inappropriate and does not bear scrutiny under the law for several reasons- including a whole bunch previously posted. (See Below)

If you want to help, let us know.

__________________________

When is your property not yours?

Posted by Publicus to hedgetrimmer; St. Germain; Ursus arctos horribilis; nunya bidness; RLK; oldironsides; sauropod; ...
On News/Activism 05/18/2003 4:09 AM EDT #34 of 34

You make excellent points. Also, thank you very much for the link.

The abuse of eminent domain is a very, VERY serious threat to our domestic tranquility and to our very identity as a nation of laws. As I am sure you agree, complying with "procedures" to execute harmful acts does not mitigate the harm inflicted NOR exempt the individual responsible from accountability since that is like someone shooting and killing a person and declaring his/her not being guilty of the crime because he/she complied with the appropriate procedures governing the discharge of a firearm.

Myself and others have zeroed in on the Ithaca case because it is a small enough town where the individual officials involved have been identified and can be fairly easily persuaded by even only a few thousand Freepers and other citizens willing to merely make a couple of calls and/or E-Mails and/or letters to make sure these Ithaca Baathists realize their outrageous behavior has NOT escaped notice AND is NOT tolerated.

These sleazy Ithaca officials had apparently forgotten that they are civil servants and dutibound to comply with taxpayer wishes with all matters involving their use- and misuse- of taxpayer funds for their personal gain.

Fortunately, FREEPERS have been taking the time to refresh their memories with CLEAR reminders and STRONG objections to what they are doing.

Officials at larger metropolitan centers have used "stimulating the city's economic development for jobs" and/or "improving the tax base", as an excuse to destroy a citizen's livelihood by expropriating their property and handing it over to another private party.

Dana Berliner of the Institute for Justice was recently quoted in Fred Francis' report for NBC stating, “In most of the eminent domain cases going on now, cities want richer neighbors and bigger businesses instead of middle-income neighbors and small businesses”.

In the case involving certain officials in Ithaca, NY, the proposed private commercial development is not, repeat NOT, even commercially viable! In fact, the individuals who covet the property are NOW trying to get their hands on taxpayer- i.e. YOUR- monies to subsidise their pet project!

Equally disturbing, a report was published that shows that the proposed development of the property involves Enronseque schemes using taxpayer- i.e. YOUR- money to fund kickbacks!

Pine himself can confirm this and he can be reached at his business (Race Office Equipment) at (607)-273-1011. Besides, I am sure he would welcome calls knowing there IS a world outside Ithaca that DOES care about this terrifying experience he, his family, and others have been subjected to all this time.

Putting aside the egregious affront to judicial, legal, commercial, and moral sensibilities, the added rub with the proposed hotel/office project is that it also represents a NET LOSS to the public fisc AND drain on taxpayers for years to come. The disregard of all these “minor” facts by certain Ithaca officials- who seem obsessed with also providing the developer with tax ABATEMENTS in addition to taxpayer funded subsidies- further disqualifies the use of eminent domain in this case as a means to “improve” the tax base and "improve" Ithaca's tiny downtown since it actually does not. Sure it enriches certain individuals but the public at large?...NOT!

Furthermore, the matter was originally a straightforward, private commercial transaction. When the interested buyer (Ciminelli) failed to successfully negotiate the acquisition on his own, certain Ithaca officials THEN threatened one of the property’s co-owners (Tom Pine) telling him if he didn’t sell his property to their friend, they would use eminent domain to expropriate the property and hand it over to Ciminelli themselves- behavior which I believe constitutes extortion, racketeering and other acts also forbidden under RICO statutes. (I am sure your local United States' Attorney's office would also share your concerns across this matter as it also threatens ALL productive, law-abiding Americans)

Ciminelli does not even live in Ithaca or even Tompkins County. I understand he is based out of Buffalo, NY- a city that for years had foolishly embarked on this type of Soviet-style economic development- with a number of dubious multi-million dollar construction projects funded by incompetent and corrupt officials "investing" YOUR taxmoney. The result? The idiotic officials bankrupted the municipal treasury and downtown Buffalo is a sad, depressing zone. You need not take my word for this, go visit and I dare you to walk around downtown at night. (Don't stay at the Hyatt though- a friend of mine had his laptop computer and watch stolen from his room and they have done nothing to replace the items nor even compensate him for the theft of his property from the "secure" room. The Buffalo Hyatt's management is STILL giving the poor guy the runaround. He understandably wonders if the jerks may be benefitting from having a guest's room looted.)

Anyway, back to the Ithaca situation. Certain Ithaca officials have also seen fit to secretly dip into the public treasury and pay an “outside” lawyer to show them how they can "legally" expropriate the property from Pine and the widow (their constituents)- i.e. harm the very citizens who pay them to protect them and their hard earned taxmoney. This lawyer in fact also works for...Ciminelli!

More recently, Ithaca’s current Mayor- another slippery character- was seen being entertained at a sporting event in the private luxury box of...Ciminelli’s!

Ithaca’s current Mayor is also known for mismanaging his personal finances and co-mingling public funds with his own during the course of his personal use- from cellphones to overseas junkets and other activities which have achieved nothing for the taxpayers who fund them- i.e. YOU.

The IRS is also very familiar with Monsieur Alan's irresponsible behavior with finances and obligations.

As an aside, Ithaca's current Mayor tried to play "tough-guy" with a woman who had exceeded her alloted time to speak on an issue of concern at a public meeting of Ithaca's Common Council. He had the woman forcibly ejected by the police. He mentioned his hosting a delegation that was in town and his eagerness to join the visitors for food, drinks, and amusements- AGAIN at taxpayer expense, of course.

As a result, his "Lordship" was promptly sued and brought before a Judge to determine whether or not Monsieur Alan had acted properly by having the woman arrested and ejected.

At the hearing, the woman's lawyer asked him if the Mayor's rush to conclude the meeting had anything to with his possibly dating a member of the visiting delegation from Ukraine. The Baathist denied any such motivation to rush the public meeting or forcibly eject a citizen (Fay Gougakis) who is in fact KNOWN to regularly attend Common Council meetings and consistently comport herself in a proper and thoughtful manner.

So, in this case we are not only looking at another example showing the misuse of eminent domain, but a matter involving graft and embezzlement of taxpayer- i.e. YOUR- money by a small group of Ithaca officials who believe Americans are too stupid to realize what they have been- and are NOW- doing and/or too lazy to bother doing anything about it.

Let's prove them wrong.

Draw the line. Help Pine.

No Means NO!

FREEP ON!

Here's one of the alarm calls for Freepers to go...
TO THE BAT POLES! -Enjoy!

_____

Posted by Publicus to governsleastgovernsbest; LibKill; gaspar; bentfeather; NativeNewYorker; drjimmy; Atticus; All
On News/Activism 04/30/2003 6:50 PM EDT #23 of 24

! ! ! CALLING ALL FREEPERS - CALLING ALL FREEPERS ! ! !

Last week, you were told about a scam where certain Ithaca officials are using taxpayer- i.e. YOUR- money to harm a productive, law-abiding citizen (Tom Pine/tel: 607-273-1011).

They want Pine to clear out his office supply business (Race Office Supply) that he has painstakingly built over the past decade and sell his property to a friend of theirs'- Frank Ciminelli- or else they would use eminent domain proceeding to take Pine's property and hand it over to Ciminelli themselves!

Ciminelli apparently wants to build an office and hotel on the property and then lease the new buildings himself. The fact these projects are not even commercially viable on their own is one of several red-flags.

The scam also involves ignoring a widow's co-ownership share in the property, as well as, the use of taxpayer- i.e. YOUR- money to fund kickbacks with the proposed construction projects!

You were asked that- if you object to what these Ithaca officials are doing with YOUR hard earned taxmoney- to take a few minutes and call the officials involved and make sure they clearly understood your objections across their monstrous behavior and their misuse of YOUR hard earned taxmonies in such a fashion.

Well FREEPERS, your telephone calls to the officials involved are WORKING!

The Ithaca officials have suddenly changed their tactics. Rather than having open meetings and publishing how they vote on the matter- like they are SUPPOSED to- they have instead decided to now be sneaky about it and NOT tell the American people how they are voting or what they planning to do with YOUR taxmoney.

In other words, the Ithaca officials are aware of FREEPER objections. They apparently just didn't hear you very well or perhaps figured they could avoid your "annoying" demands for civil servants to serve the public. (How dare those FREEPERS try to stop our gravy train. So what if it's their money, we want our gravy-train!)

Perhaps Ithaca officials thought you were just kidding.

Let's turn up the volume so that these Ithaca officials can CLEARLY hear you and CLEARLY understand that your No Means NO!- not maybe.

FYI: Gary Ferguson is another one of the local parasites pushing for the handover of Pine's and the widow's property to Ciminelli- even if it means doing so against their will!

Without question, he stands to financially gain from the scam too, THAT's why he is promoting it without regard to any moral, legal, or commercial sensibilities.

Ferguson KNOWS that the actual cost to build the proposed construction projects is not anywhere near the $26,000,000 quoted. He also KNOWS that the proposed parking garage related to the project does not require $3,000,000 to cover "soft legal fees".

Ferguson also KNOWS that the projects are not even commercially viable in their own right and will result in continuous subsidies and abatements saddled upon the taxpayers of this country for YEARS to come.

He doesn't care because as long as he personally benefits, that's good enough for him. (What a trooper!)

Ferguson has wormed himself into an organization that ostensibly "promotes business" in Ithaca. He doesn't seem to understand the simple fact heavy tax and regulatory burdens, as well as, egregious mismanagement of public funds by Ithaca officials is NOT the way to attract businesses nor foster a healthy commercial marketplace.

Of course by keeping taxes high and regulations invasive, Ferguson and others can then arrange sleazy side-deals that avail tax "discounts" to certain select individuals who would "take care of them"- at everyone else's expense, of course.

Ferguson "works" closely with the Ithaca Urban Renewal Agency (another useless, parasitic bureaucracy set up by certain individuals in the 1970's as part of a corrupt patronage system and does little more than waste taxpayer funds on pork-barrel projects that do nothing of any real or lasting consequence but enrich a handful of select political beneficiaries- at EVERYONE else's expense while also spurring on inceasingly higher taxes to fund generous salaries and benefits packages for the administrators of these programs and their cronies.)

Ferguson has shown his stripes with his prosposterous public remarks that completely disregard Pine's and the widow's interests as productive, law-abiding citizens.

Let's also remind this bozo Ferguson (Phone:607-277-8679 Fax:607-277-8691, E-Mail:IDP@downtownithaca.com ) and the other characters that:

-NO! You do NOT want Ithaca officials using YOUR taxpayer monies to in ANY way support the private development of the proposed office/hotel- it is a private development NOT a public works project;

-NO! You do NOT want Ithaca officials using YOUR taxpayer monies to in any way threaten, harass, intimidate, or forcibly expel the co-owner of the property Tom Pine- a productive, law-abiding citizen- and his business (Race Office Supply) from his property- this is a free country and the price of something is determined on the basis of what the interested buyer and seller freely agree to- NOT what Ferguson or any other Ithaca official decides is a “fair” price.

-NO! You do NOT want Ithaca officials using YOUR taxpayer monies to in any way pressure and basically extort one side to enrich the other- this is barbaric and also completely unacceptable;

-NO! You do NOT want Ithaca officials using YOUR taxpayer monies to in any way execute an eminent domain proceeding to seize the property from Pine and the widow against their will and hand it over to another private party (Ciminelli)- This is a free country and we just got rid of the Taliban in Afghanistan and the Baathists in Iraq- you do NOT tolerate tyranny, theft, and extortion carried out by Ithaca officials with YOUR taxmoney here in the USA;

-NO! You do NOT want Ithaca officials using YOUR taxpayer monies to convey the woman's ownership interest without any compensation to her- this is the land of the free NOT the land of the thieves and American citizens are NOT entitled to being embezzled- INCLUDING widows.

-NO! You do NOT want Ithaca officials using YOUR taxpayer monies to fund kickbacks of ANY kind- we are NOT interested in having local officials practice Taliban and Baathist economics.

BTW Freepers, Ferguson also KNOWS Ithaca officials secretly used taxpayer- i.e. YOUR- money to hire an attorney to show them how to execute an eminent domain proceeding to "legally" expropriate the property from Pine and the widow and hand it over to Ciminelli. Adding insult to injury, said attorney is connected to...Ciminelli!

FREEPERS, I ask you again to take a few minutes to consider the threat this situation poses to ALL Americans because the crooked lawyers and corrupt officials involved are sharing their techniques with others around the country.

This case could set a precedent where eminent domain is used to extort concessions from one party of a private commercial transaction to the benefit of another and DIRECTLY at taxpayer expense to boot!

VERY ominous indeed!

NOTE: HUD's Inspector General (tel: 202-708-0430) cited Ithaca agencies as lacking the controls necessary to properly administer taxmonies given to them. In fact, when HUD's Inspector General discovered monies had not actually been spent in the manner specified and asked for the whereabouts of these monies, these Ithaca officials involved simply took monies from another taxpayer funded account and replenished the funds missing from the other! In other words they took money from one taxpayer funded account to cover their embezzlement from the other and, thusly, also continue to keep a few steps ahead of the United States Attorney's Office too.

If you share concern across this threat to our great Republic and all of her productive, law-abiding citizens, call Gary Ferguson (Tel: 607-277-8679) and the other Ithaca officials involved (See Below) and let them know No Means NO!

Ithaca Mayor Alan J. Cohen Phone: (607)274-6501 Email: mayor@cityofithaca.org

Ithaca Common Council Member Paulette Manos Phone: (607) 273-4170 Email: paulettem@cityofithaca.org

Ithaca Common Council Member Susan Blumenthal Phone: (607) 272-3931 Email: susanb@cityofithaca.org

Ithaca Common Council Member Patricia Pryor Phone: (607) 273-1741 Email: patp@cityofithaca.org

Ithaca Common Council Member David Whitmore Phone: (607) 273-1254 Email: davidw@cityofithaca.org

Ithaca Common Council Member Diann Sams Phone: (607) 277-8188 Email: dianns@cityofithaca.org

Ithaca Common Council Member Patricia Vaughan Phone: (607) 273-3870 Email: patv@cityofithaca.org

Ithaca Common Council Member Carolyn Peterson Phone: (607) 272-8129 Email: carolynp@cityofithaca.org

Ithaca Common Council Member Peter Mack Phone: (607) 253-7070 Email: peterm@cityofithaca.org

Ithaca Common Council Member Daniel Cogan Phone: (607) 273-2076 Email: dcogan@cityofithaca.org

Rather than speculating, go ahead and call Pine and ask him. He'll tell you.

And, if you don't mind the use of YOUR taxmonies like this, go ahead and let the officials involved- i.e. YOUR civil servants- know that you do NOT want them wasting YOUR hardearned taxmonies like this.

YOU GOT IT!

Buying a business means pluncking down several times the annual income generated. How much was Pine's business making on the premises?

Also, the "value" of a property- as with EVERYTHING- in a free society is determined by the price that the buyer AND the seller AGREE to- NOT what some fool Ithaca official "says" or "feels" is "fair".

Also, the right thing to do would be for Pine to lease his property to Cornell and Hilton directly. Having Ciminelli and others as middlemen does nothing but waste millions of taxpayer dollars with the deal. Also, why didn't Pine ask for space in the new structures as part of the terms?

Does anyone remember who was the "Ithica, City of Evil" guy, or is that you under a different name?

These type of threads deserve a tinfoil hat alert. It is the same nonsense as the tax evasion advocates or black helicopter conspiracy theorists. In short, it hurts FReeper credibility when this type of activism occurs.

Why? For centuries, eminent domain proceedings have been perfectly legal. Such a proceeding is also constitutional if it is for a public purpose. The judiciary has defined "public purpose" broad enough that this project easily qualifies.

It may be a silly purpose, a stupid purpose, and even a waste of taxpayer dollars, but it is perfectly legal.

To make all sorts of allegations of illegality turns FReepers into a pack of loons.

Note that there is no requirement that an eminent domain project be a viable commercial project. Whether or not it can turn a profit is irrelevant to legality.

There is also nothing here that indicates that owners will not get paid. So long as just compensation is paid, a taking can occur. If an owner objects, a court can hold it until the owner is willing to take payment. In other words, everyone (including that poor old widow) is going to be compensated for their respective ownership interests.

There are many dumb public projects that involve eminent domain...and someone always benefits from these projects. Yet the proper remedy is to throw out the elected officials using the ballot box. Making false allegations of illegality is just plain stupid.

Next time you complain about eminent domain and one world government, imagine what the cost of the highway you drive to work on each morning would be without the power of eminent domain. Some no-talent @ss clown could extort an inordinate amount of money from the government for a small piece of property needed for the highway to be built. The taxpayer would foot the dime for this greed.

As for the just compensation argument, if an owner considers the amount inadequate, the courts are always available to determine whether just compensation is being paid. There are thousands of decisions each year where the court sides with the landowner on compensation notwithstanding the loony accusations made by some on this thread about gov't confiscation of property.

In short, for those whackos who see a gov't conspiracy into everything, get a grip, take a Prozac, and seek professional counseling before defaming anyone and everyone in your quest to create bogeymen. For those who have posted rational comments on this thread, keep up the good work.

FR needs more like you and less of the fruits and nuts brigade.

In short, for those whackos who see a gov't conspiracy into everything, get a grip, take a Prozac, and seek professional counseling before defaming anyone and everyone in your quest to create bogeymen.

You're part of it aren't you :) I actually had no comment, I just wanted an excuse to use the freepmobile!

A conspiracy is, in a generalized way, actions taken by others who agreed to do something without letting you know, and then telling you something to keep you happy (and to keep their best interests protected, cya ya know).

So I see loads of people conspiring in this way, what one has to discern is whether or not the people telling you something are to be trusted. Politicians...well, need I say more? ;)