THE ANTI-CATHOLIC NATURE OF FREEMASONRY

Catholic Church Teaching on Freemasonry ^ | March 17, 1927 | MARTIN J. SCOTT, S.J.

[vox_freedom]

Also, perhaps, Ivan the Terrible's conquests of the Mongols. Ivan was not, to say the least, an admirable or saintly man, but he accomplished one crucial job, at least.

Correcto, Cicero.
From now on we'll call him, Ivan "the mostly" Terrible

[sitetest]

Dear MeanWestTexan,

I'd be inclined to say that the same is true of the York rite ceremonials. I have a book of York rite-related ceremonials. I'll have to go back and re-read some of it (I hate to do it - it's in really small print and so far I've resisted getting reading glasses - so I have to hold the book about two feet from my face in order to read it).

However, my impression from previous readings was that although the imagery used was explicitly Judeo-Christian, I felt that the statement that the moral lessons were drawn from natural revelation still applied, at least as understood from a Catholic perspective.


sitetest

[dangus]

Incidentally, I only meant to show how Free Masons were playing with fire and trying to invert imagery from the Catholic Church; not that they are by nature an intentionally Satanic cult. The immediately preceding argument reminded me that I did NOt want to be lumped in with some of the conspiracy kooks!

[SaintDismas]

Sorry that you're sad, I'm not sad in the least. I will trust the Church that Jesus established anyday over anything you or anybody else says. What I can't figure is that you seem to discount what is plainly wrote down, BY THEM... not the Catholic Church, huh?

[oldtimer]

If you are a Brother Mason, and you are serious about "taking your 32nd degree ring off", I would be amazed.

The RCC has always maintained that the Pope is infallible in matters of Church and faith.

Suggest you read A WORLD LIT ONLY BY FIRE - William Manchester - noted historian.

I am a 32nd KCCH, and have NEVER seen or heard anything that would compromize my belief in Jesus as my Lord and Savior.

[oldtimer]

As a proud Christian and Freemason, I would be very, very proud of the Roman Catholic Church if it would go to absolute and total war with the abortionists - and vow ex-communication with members of the Church who voted for democRATS who mindlessly still are democRATS.

The murder of unborn children is a crime not even conceived by our Lord and Savior Jesus.

Meanwhile, millions of democRAT Catholics vote like sheeple for the murdering RAT party.

[Cicero]

Or maybe, Ivan Who Looks a Bit Less Terrible If We Understand the Nature of the Muslim Threat Against Civilization.

[sitetest]

Dear oldtimer,

A little off-topic, no?

But anyway, the Catholic Church excommunicates all those who directly and proximately participate in the crime of abortion.

Excommunication, however, is a drastic penalty, and a maxim of the Church is that penalties are applied narrowly.

Thus, merely favoring the legality of abortion doesn't incur automatic excommunication.

However, the Church has declared that politicians who publicly support legalized abortion commit objectively grave evil (the matter of mortal sin), and that those who vote for these politicians because they support legalized abortion also commit objectively grave evil.

I assure you, the Church's war against abortion is quite total. A Catholic politician is in grave sin if he does not hold that eventually, abortion should be entirely banned, even in cases of rape or incest or life of the mother. Is your commitment to life as total?


sitetest

[nopardons]

None of the fraternal organizations existed, except the Masons, when Pope Clement XII's Papal Bull against the Masons was issued in 1737. It was a political, not a religious move. This was the first anti-Masonic stance made by the Catholic church; however, it wasn't the first time someone had decided that their subjects not be allowed to be masons. That "honor" is due Louis XV of France, in 1736. OTOH, when Pope Clement XII sent out that first Bull, King Louis XV, as usual, went against the Pope, whom he had for decades seen the Pope as an Gallacian and NOT worth listening to, since he saw himself as THE most "Christian King" and not the vassal of someone unworthy of being Pope.

At the time period we're talking about, Catholic and Protestant Europe had been waging both literal and verbal war with each other, for centuries. Alliances and wars and even which Prince got elected ( yes, ELECTED !) to be THE HOLY ROMAN EMPEROR. The Papal Bull of 1738 had far more to do with Maria Theresia being a girl and thus incapable of being crowned the Holy Roman Emperor, than the spurious garbage about Masons supposedly being against the Catholic church. I suggest that you read up on European history. I have neither the time nor inclination to spend the rest of this evening explaining to you why the first and subsequent Papal Bulls are spurious libel. I will give you a book list, though, should you so desire to become educated on this topic.

[nopardons]

But obviously, one can obviously believe all kinds of drivel, post it to FR, and imagine that he and he alone has the facts; you just proved that.

And yes, it IS a fact that one of the reasons the Catholic church is against Freemasonry, is because Masons can be of any religion, as long as they are of good character and believe in GOD. And it IS this component, which set Pope Clement XII to write the first Bull against Freemasonry; which WAS political, not really "religious" ( except in reference to the English Protestant's take on how they wanted to be governed....vis-a-vis the way in which Catholic nations were managed by their Kings of that time ), and the fact that several Catholic kings and queens were afraid of having to give up some of their power, if their subjects were to be any more influenced by fellow Masons.

With time, later Popes added onto the original ideas, until the defamation grew quite out of hand.

Your last sentence is without substance, merit, and means nothing, re Catholics being a Mason.

[Nihil Obstat]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gabriel_Garcia_Moreno

[nopardons]

Masons AND Shriners have been donating VERY expensive and much needed medical equipment ( such as iron lungs, when polio was rampant ) to nonMasonic and nonShriner hospitals for more than 100 years, in America.

[AlaninSA]

They may have stood for something at one time, but from what I've heard, both are in great decline and are now largely irrelevant.

Irrelevant?

I can't speak for the Masons, but I can certainly speak for the Knights. I'm a Fourth Degree Knight here in San Antonio.

Some of the "irrelevant things" we do as Knights include:

Hurricane Katrina

The Knights of Columbus Gulf States Disaster Relief Fund grew to more than $10 million, and that financial aid was supplemented by hundreds of thousands of volunteer hours of service by Knights in the immediate area (hundreds of Knights worked eight-hour shifts at the Houston Astrodome, for example) and by Knights throughout the U.S. and Canada, who collected clothing, food and other staples for storm victims.

The Knights of Columbus also quickly provided badly needed resources to Catholic Charities offices in Baton Rouge, La., and Mobile, Ala., when they were suddenly overwhelmed with thousands of people who escaped the storm with little but the clothes on their backs. The Knights wired $200,000 to Baton Rouge Catholic Charities just a few days after the storm hit, long before resources were available from any other source. Individual Knights of Columbus at dozens of K of C halls in the region served thousands of meals to evacuees, and several halls were made available to police and national guard officials for use as temporary command centers.

The Knights of Columbus also made significant contributions to the restoration of Catholic education in the affected areas, including a $500,000 grant to the New Orleans Catholic school system, which paid tuition expenses for hundreds of low-income students whose parents were suddenly left without jobs or income.

September 11

The Knights of Columbus were one of the first organizations to offer relief to families of fallen police, firefighters and emergency personnel – within two days of the September 11 terrorist attacks. Since 2001, the Knights have also taken the lead in helping the country to remember the day in a prayerful way. Among the highlights of the Knights activities in the aftermath of September 11:

$1.49 million in immediate aid provided to 419 relatives of fallen emergency personnel through the Knights’ Heroes Fund, which began distributing checks to family members – regardless of religious affiliation – within two days of the attacks.

More than $3500 distributed to each recipient for emergency needs. The fund was established September 12, 2001, and the first checks were delivered September 13.

More than 40 members of the Knights of Columbus members were killed on September 11.

Full scholarships to the Catholic college of their choice are available to 29 children of members killed or disabled in the line of duty on September 11 through the Order’s Matthews and Swift Educational Trust Scholarship program.

Irrelevant?

Hardly?

In decline?

NOT A CHANCE!

The Knights are not ones to brag, but we're here, raising money and making a better world. For more and smaller-scope activities, I invite you to look at the Knights in Action section of our website (http://www.kofc.org/un/news/kia/index.cfm).

The Knights ARE relevant and we're not a drinking group (although we do some of that, too!). We're a group of committed Catholic men who serve God through service to our fellow man.

[AlaninSA]

Please FReepmail me if you'd like to be added to or removed from the KofC ping list.

[Aussie Dasher]

I didn't know any of that. Thank you for the info.

Seems pretty stupid for men of good will to be at each others throats centuries later over something I'm betting they didn't know about either.

[Aussie Dasher]

I've been invited to join the Masons on a number of occasions. Like you, I can't do it.

[Conservative til I die]

Nothing the Sikhs said or did in those two instances contradicts my point. There's nothing wrong with a Sikh protesting helmet or knife laws if they're trying to protect their religion. To me that doesn't mean that they're making trouble, anymore than a Catholic hospital protesting a state law mandating they carry birth control does.

Let's face it, if they're was true freedom of religion, our Sikh friends would be able to carry their knives with them and ride their motorcycles without a helmet. But the law does interfere with most religions to some degree. Us Christians, living in a historically Christian company, generally see less of this than newer religions to this country.

[Conservative til I die]

"Great Architect of the Universe"

That prhase was actually first coined by John Calvin, who can hardly be called anti-Christian.

Yes, but we're talking about Catholic-Mason relations here, and John Calvin doesn't really hold a lot (or any actually) theological weigh in our Church.

[Conservative til I die]

But obviously, one can obviously believe all kinds of drivel, post it to FR, and imagine that he and he alone has the facts; you just proved that.

You can discuss the issues without resorting to personal attacks.

Your last sentence is without substance, merit, and means nothing, re Catholics being a Mason.

"Did you know you also can't be a Catholic and a Hindu at the same time? Or a Muslim, Jew, Sikh, or Wiccan?"

This was my last sentence. It a) doesn't mention Masons and b) is completely with merit. Are you going to argue a Catholic can also be a Muslim, Jew, Sikh, or Wiccan?

But, to apply this statement to Masons, it is still completely with merit. Catholics cannot be Masons and still be Catholics. Seriously.

[MarkBsnr]

Then why are there lodges based upon other religions? Not as many, of course, but they are there.

And I wanted to point out that each of the Grand Lodges in the United States dictates that in all of its lodges, all religious texts are considered equal and serve equally as well in the lodge. If your Master decides that the Bible in your lodge should be replaced by the Koran and the vote is passed, it is so.

Further, you've never heard of a 1st degree member who has taken a 2nd degree at another lodge? You don't think that this is so? Ask around.

You've never heard of all-degree days in which the 1st, 2nd and 3rd degree are done in one lodge in a district and the new member actually joins another lodge? Funny, I've participated in them. I also did an all-degree weekend for the Scottish Rite in the Scottish Rite Theatre at the Masonic Temple in Detroit.

It turns out that I was highly ignorant of a lot during my active days - I was the 3rd degree team leader and made it up the chairs to Senior Warden before I moved out of Michigan - and I'd suggest that you might benefit from some reading yourself.