Free Republic
Browse · Search
Religion
Topics · Post Article

Skip to comments.

Can a Person Be Saved Without Jesus?
House of Yeshua ^ | September 2009 | Jon Thompson

Posted on 01/16/2010 8:23:23 AM PST by Colofornian

click here to read article


Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first previous 1-2021-4041-6061-80 ... 121-124 next last
To: StolarStorm

Yes, God is limited by His Word.

When He makes a Covenant by His Word, He is bound to keep it.


41 posted on 01/16/2010 10:20:38 AM PST by Cvengr (Adversity in life and death is inevitable. Thru faith in Christ, stress is optional.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 5 | View Replies]

To: Hank Kerchief

Everlasting condemnation in the Lake of Fire.


42 posted on 01/16/2010 10:23:09 AM PST by Cvengr (Adversity in life and death is inevitable. Thru faith in Christ, stress is optional.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 31 | View Replies]

To: Jack Black

There are plenty of Hebrews who were not saved. There were even priests who were not believers. There will remain, though, a remnant of Jews who are believers through faith in Christ, even after the Holy Spirit is removed from the Church Age.


43 posted on 01/16/2010 10:25:30 AM PST by Cvengr (Adversity in life and death is inevitable. Thru faith in Christ, stress is optional.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 14 | View Replies]

To: Hank Kerchief
Saved from what?

A place of everlasting torment that makes this place look like heaven: http://www.scribd.com/doc/24441270/The-Darvaza-Well

44 posted on 01/16/2010 10:34:12 AM PST by Cvengr (Adversity in life and death is inevitable. Thru faith in Christ, stress is optional.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 31 | View Replies]

To: onedoug; Colofornian
Which part of “Our Father...” is not Jewish?

None; this is from the Shem Tov Matthew:
Our father in heaven
may your name be sanctified
may your kingdom be blessed
your will shall be done in heaven and on earth
give us our bread continually
forgive us the debt of our sins
as we forgive the debt of those who sin against us
do not bring us into the hands of a test
and protect us from all evil
amen
shalom b'SHEM Yah'shua HaMashiach
45 posted on 01/16/2010 10:49:58 AM PST by Uri’el-2012 (Psalm 119:174 I long for Your salvation, YHvH, Your law is my delight.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 40 | View Replies]

To: Hank Kerchief
Saved from what?

Good Q: From sin; From a second death; From the fear of death; From bondage to Satan.

46 posted on 01/16/2010 11:30:36 AM PST by Colofornian (If you're not going to drink the coffee, at least wake up and smell it!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 31 | View Replies]

To: fish hawk

We can teach what we believe but I believe in a Merciful God. The premise is that if you don’t accept Jesus as your Savior that you will not be saved. Does that mean that all the people prior to Jesus will not be saved by God? Does that mean people in remote tribes that have never heard of Jesus will not be saved? I don’t know but that isn’t my decision... That is God’s decision.


47 posted on 01/16/2010 11:41:49 AM PST by Hootch (Another perspective)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 24 | View Replies]

To: count-your-change; Invincibly Ignorant
This sounds like nitpicking at a strawman. Who are these unidentified persons that say Jesus did away with the Law? And why the concern over whether one uses the familiar though incorrect form “Jesus” or the less familiar but also incorrect “Yeshua”?

You've got a sharp eye.

It's because of what the author says earlier in the article: Since Elohim said that His people are to keep His commandments forever (Exodus 31:16, Leviticus 16:31, 23:21), to say that Jesus did away with the Torah—and the commandments in it—places Him in the category that Moshe taught in Deuteronomy 13:1,2: “If there arise among you a prophet, or a dreamer of dreams, and gives you a sign or a wonder, and the sign or wonder comes to pass, of which he spoke to you, saying, ‘Let us go after other gods’—which you have not known—‘and let us serve them.’” Moshe cautioned not to believe that prophet: “You shall not listen to the words of that prophet or that dreamer of dreams, for YHVH your Elohim is testing you to know whether you love YHVH your Elohim with all your heart and with all your soul. You shall walk after YHVH your Elohim and fear Him, and keep His commandments and obey His voice; you shall serve Him and hold fast to Him.”(Deuteronomy 13:3,4)

You see to the Jew who has heard Christians as saying the Law has been annulled, and that this "Christianized" version of this Jesus is responsible for this, well then they immediately apply that to mean that Jesus could only be a false prophet -- for a true signs and wonder-worker would advise people to also "keep His commandments and obey His voice" as it says in Deut. 13.

Therefore, some Messianic Jews think that these Law-annulling Christians believe in a cultural Christ -- thus the author says: the modern church refers to their “Jesus” as a Prophet who annulled the Torah and taught their people not to follow the commandments in the Torah—thus this would make the “Jesus” that is usually taught by many Christian missionaries and teachers a false prophet according to the teachings of Moshe. The Torah explicitly warns the followers of YHVH not to listen to this kind of false prophet.

Thus, that is NOT a characteristic of the Jewish Messiah. Bottom line is, they are wanting to remain true to the word of God (Deut. 13).

And we all know that cultures throughout time and throughout the world have tended to redefine aspects of Jesus -- some so much so that He's no longer recognizable (even the Corinthian church did this to such a radical extent that the apostle Paul referenced how they had departed from their devotion to the true Jesus to another Jesus -- see 2 Cor. 11:3-4).

Messianic Jews are simply attempting to retain defining Him through the filter of the Old Testament expectation of the Messiah.

48 posted on 01/16/2010 11:49:26 AM PST by Colofornian (If you're not going to drink the coffee, at least wake up and smell it!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 19 | View Replies]

To: Hootch
If you really get into the Bible you would find out that God will hold no one in contempt if they never heard of him or the primitive man or imbeciles etc. that don't have a functioning brain. The ones to worry are perfectly normal people that hear his message and choose to think if folly and deny Him. You may not find one or two verses actually saying this but if you absorb Bible Doctrine your common sense would show you this. Don't be offended, when I say “you” I don't mean you personally but you in general.
49 posted on 01/16/2010 12:03:06 PM PST by fish hawk (It's sad that science gathers knowledge faster than society gathers wisdom. Isaac Asimov)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 47 | View Replies]

To: Tzfat
I have no occasion to walk into an evangelical seminary but if you have and have heard this loud and clear, then so be it. I simply haven't heard such from anyone and I do discuss religious topics with a number of different people.

Why should the name Yeshua be preferred over Jesus since a contrast was drawn between the the two as though two different individual are being spoken of?

If you feel Yeshua is a more correct form for person name of the Messiah, it's up to you to explain why. Clearly the exact pronunciation of names from the Scriptures is not known.

50 posted on 01/16/2010 12:03:45 PM PST by count-your-change (You don't have be brilliant, not being stupid is enough.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 35 | View Replies]

To: fish hawk
Beautifully summarized!
51 posted on 01/16/2010 12:06:30 PM PST by verity (Obama Lies)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 49 | View Replies]

To: Hootch

Romans2:12-17 pretty much covers it!


52 posted on 01/16/2010 12:14:54 PM PST by tajgirvan (May God Save America! May God Bless & Protect our Troops. The Finest and the Best!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 47 | View Replies]

To: count-your-change
Why should the name Yeshua be preferred over Jesus since a contrast was drawn between the the two as though two different individual are being spoken of?

Because in some cases, it does represent two different people. For instance, those who think that because he has a Christian name and is no longer Jewish. Would you say that the Arabic word "Allah" is the same as the Almighty of the Bible?

Having said that, you assert that "Yeshua" is not correct. You did not offer the "correct" name. So, what is it, do you think?

If you feel Yeshua is a more correct form for person name of the Messiah, it's up to you to explain why.

No, it was you who said that "Yeshua" was incorrect. The burden of proof is upon you, not I. I simple asked why you said that.

Clearly the exact pronunciation of names from the Scriptures is not known.

Why do you say that? Do you read Hebrew?
53 posted on 01/16/2010 1:28:36 PM PST by Tzfat
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 50 | View Replies]

To: Hootch

This merciful God you believe in has promised to throw Satan into a lake of fire for all eternity. Do you think he will not do this because he is benevolent? I don’t believe God will break his words to his creation nor to himself.


54 posted on 01/16/2010 2:12:10 PM PST by fish hawk (It's sad that science gathers knowledge faster than society gathers wisdom. Isaac Asimov)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 47 | View Replies]

To: Colofornian
Going to hell is no big deal. That's where all of the interesting people are anyways.

I'd rather hang out with Thomas Jefferson and Jimmy Hendrix than losers like Martin Luther and John Calvin.

I'd imagine that if the Christian vision of heaven is true, everyone in heaven probably has an excrement-eating Joel Osteen type grin on their face, where you praise the dear Leader 24-7. It would be like going to a really lame party.

55 posted on 01/16/2010 5:22:12 PM PST by GunRunner
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: UriÂ’el-2012

Well, I said Jewish, not messianic...unless of course you mean moshiach, as annointed in the sense of David, Solomon et al, past and to come, though with no sense of divinity.


56 posted on 01/16/2010 5:52:47 PM PST by onedoug
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 45 | View Replies]

To: GunRunner

There is nothing to joke about. It is forever.


57 posted on 01/16/2010 6:07:25 PM PST by esquirette (If we do not know our own worldview, we will accept theirs.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 55 | View Replies]

To: esquirette

How do you know? Have you been there?


58 posted on 01/16/2010 6:17:30 PM PST by GunRunner
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 57 | View Replies]

To: Tzfat
Having said that, you assert that "Yeshua" is not correct. You did not offer the "correct" name. So, what is it, do you think?

"Ιησους"

It's what we have in the source documents.

59 posted on 01/16/2010 9:07:02 PM PST by Lee N. Field ("And if you are Christ's, then you are Abraham's offspring, heirs according to promise. " Gal 3:29)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 53 | View Replies]

To: JustaDumbBlonde
Where the Jews go is not according to me. I am a mere mortal that only knows what I’ve been taught in church, and my pastor preaches the Word directly from the Bible.

And what does your pastor preach to you from the Bible (the first 3/4 of which, of course, is the sacred book of the Jews and existed for hundreds of years before Jesus was born)?

Or is your pastor silent on this topic?

Just curious.

60 posted on 01/16/2010 9:23:55 PM PST by Jack Black
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 23 | View Replies]


Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first previous 1-2021-4041-6061-80 ... 121-124 next last

Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.

Free Republic
Browse · Search
Religion
Topics · Post Article

FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson