"It worked for us...
...sort of."
Posted on 04/06/2010 7:41:39 PM PDT by NoCmpromiz
Do not stare directly into the goatse.
Now, if the two renderings are the separate author's recounts of the same event, AND if all Scripture is God breathed (which it is) then the Divine Author breathed the very words to the human author to allow us to fully understand the meaning. God allowed Matthew to let us know that false prophets can be recognized by their fruit because the tree that is bad cannot bear good fruit. Luke allows us to see that the same criteria can have a broader application to other areas of our life and walk. Viewing both texts as equally God Breathed, we see that while not literally correct, it certainly is exegetically correct (when the scripture as a whole is considered) to say that Mat. 7:20 has application beyond the immediate context. It would detract from the Truth of the Scripture to ignore one or the other passage.
It is correct to note that proper Biblical exegesis is severely lacking in the Church in the USA today. Sad. Try talking to some of the products of todays cemeteries, er, seminaries. How many times have you heard Luke 6:37 mutilated...
So folks, I am not an Ophra clone, but in this case, you all are correct. This is probably not a hill to battle over...
On that note, I am off to bed. Still love me?
You'd better, or when we get to Heaven I'm going to find out where you are and move in next door.... ;-)
you as well.
Thank you for taking the time to go through that.
Have a great night’s sleep. (don’t know about the love thingy but hunt me up anyway when we get to Heaven! lol)
We are to judge other believers and those who claim to be Christians. Matt 7 is still only talking about false prophets. I do not deny that we are to live lives that reflect Christ, but we are also to judge others faith by their actions and doctrines.
We cannot know the heart of another other, but again, TRUE Christians will wear their ‘heart’ on their sleeve and we need to judge those who claim to be Christians, lest we allow the wolves in (which has happened greatly in the last 50 years in American Churches).
Surely God will decide. Judge not lest Ye be judged.
Romans 16:17
I urge you, brothers, to watch out for those who cause divisions and put obstacles in your way that are contrary to the teaching you have learned. Keep away from them.
2 Thessalonians 2:15
So then, brothers, stand firm and hold to the teachings we passed on to you, whether by word of mouth or by letter.
2 Thessalonians 3:6
In the name of the Lord Jesus Christ, we command you, brothers, to keep away from every brother who is idle and does not live according to the teaching you received from us.
1 Timothy 1:3-4
3. As I urged you when I went into Macedonia, stay there in Ephesus so that you may command certain men not to teach false doctrines any longer
4. nor to devote themselves to myths and endless genealogies. These promote controversies rather than God’s work—which is by faith.
1 Timothy 1:7
They want to be teachers of the law, but they do not know what they are talking about or what they so confidently affirm.
1 Timothy 4:1-2
1. The Spirit clearly says that in later times some will abandon the faith and follow deceiving spirits and things taught by demons.
2. Such teachings come through hypocritical liars, whose consciences have been seared as with a hot iron.
1 Timothy 4:6
If you point these things out to the brothers, you will be a good minister of Christ Jesus, brought up in the truths of the faith and of the good teaching that you have followed.
1 Timothy 4:11
Command and teach these things.
1 Timothy 6:3-5
3. If anyone teaches false doctrines and does not agree to the sound instruction of our Lord Jesus Christ and to godly teaching,
4. he is conceited and understands nothing. He has an unhealthy interest in controversies and quarrels about words that result in envy, strife, malicious talk, evil suspicions
5. and constant friction between men of corrupt mind, who have been robbed of the truth and who think that godliness is a means to financial gain.
2 Timothy 3:16-17
16. All Scripture is God-breathed and is useful for teaching, rebuking, correcting and training in righteousness,
17. so that the man of God may be thoroughly equipped for every good work.
2 Timothy 4:3-4
3. For the time will come when men will not put up with sound doctrine. Instead, to suit their own desires, they will gather around them a great number of teachers to say what their itching ears want to hear.
4. They will turn their ears away from the truth and turn aside to myths.
Titus 1:11
They must be silenced, because they are ruining whole households by teaching things they ought not to teach—and that for the sake of dishonest gain.
Titus 2:1
You must teach what is in accord with sound doctrine.
Titus 2:15
These, then, are the things you should teach. Encourage and rebuke with all authority. Do not let anyone despise you.
Hebrews 13:9
Do not be carried away by all kinds of strange teachings.
2 Peter 2:1-3
1. But there were also false prophets among the people, just as there will be false teachers among you. They will secretly introduce destructive heresies, even denying the sovereign Lord who bought them—bringing swift destruction on themselves.
2. Many will follow their shameful ways and will bring the way of truth into disrepute.
3. In their greed these teachers will exploit you with stories they have made up. Their condemnation has long been hanging over them, and their destruction has not been sleeping.
2 John 1:10
If anyone comes to you and does not bring this teaching, do not take him into your house or welcome him.
Luke 7:43
Simon replied, “I suppose the one who had the bigger debt canceled.” “You have judged correctly,” Jesus said.
Luke 12:57
”Why don’t you judge for yourselves what is right?
Acts 4:19
But Peter and John replied, “Judge for yourselves whether it is right in God’s sight to obey you rather than God.
1 Corinthians 5:12
What business is it of mine to judge those outside the church? Are you not to judge those inside?
1 Corinthians 6:1-4
1. If any of you has a dispute with another, dare he take it before the ungodly for judgment instead of before the saints?
2. Do you not know that the saints will judge the world? And if you are to judge the world, are you not competent to judge trivial cases?
3. Do you not know that we will judge angels? How much more the things of this life!
4. Therefore, if you have disputes about such matters, appoint as judges even men of little account in the church!
1 Corinthians 11:13
Judge for yourselves: Is it proper for a woman to pray to God with her head uncovered?
As AMPU posted on another thread:
When Jesus told us not to judge (Matthew 7:1), He was telling us not to judge hypocritically. Matthew 7:2-5 declares, “For in the same way you judge others, you will be judged, and with the measure you use, it will be measured to you. Why do you look at the speck of sawdust in your brother’s eye and pay no attention to the plank in your own eye? How can you say to your brother, ‘Let me take the speck out of your eye’ when all the time there is a plank in your own eye? You hypocrite, first take the plank out of your own eye, and then you will see clearly to remove the speck from your brother’s eye.” What Jesus was condemning here was hypocritical, self-righteous judgments of others.
In Matthew 7:2-5, Jesus warns against judging someone else for his sin when you yourself are sinning even worse. That is the kind of judging Jesus commanded us not to do. If a believer sees another believer sinning, it is his Christian duty to lovingly and respectfully confront the person with his sin (Matthew 18:15-17). This is not judging, but rather pointing out the truth in hope—and with the ultimate goal—of bringing repentance in the other person (James 5:20) and restoration to the fellowship.
We are to speak the truth in love (Ephesians 4:15). We are to proclaim what God’s Word says about sin. 2 Timothy 4:2 instructs us, “Preach the Word; be prepared in season and out of season; correct, rebuke and encourage — with great patience and careful instruction.” We are to “judge” sin, but always with the goal of presenting the solution for sin and its consequences—the Lord Jesus Christ (John 14:6).
Great...
You can pop over for a cuppa tea any time then
:)
This is probably not a hill to battle over...
On that note, I am off to bed. Still love me?
- - - - - -
Oh, I GUESS I still love you. LOL. And you are right that is isn’t a hill to battle over.
These verse are constantly misused by Mormons and being an ex-Mormon and now in ministry to Mormons, I am perhaps a bit picky about that passage.
But we should not allow it to cause division among other Christians.
FRiends all?
To me this is the heart of these scriptures, not so much the letter.
For the most part I would agree with you, but the phrasing you used gives me pause. Perhaps because I see James 1:5 misused so much.
Do I know Obama’s heart? No, but I do see his actions and his actions show he is NO Christian. The doctrines he espouses (like other cult members) show he is not a Christian.
I have no trouble stating that he is not, in the least, a Christian. If he were, if Christ changed him then Zero would not do what he does.
If he doesn’t live a Christian life then it is reasonable to conclude he is not a Christian.
Thank you for your encouragement, dear sister (or is it brother) in Christ.
> “We are awed by the grace he showed even to those who
> would have killed him,”
Moslems do not believe that Jesus died on the cross.
The "I's" don't have it!
"It worked for us...
...sort of."
Obama did not directly address those doubts on Tuesday, but said: "as Christians, we believe that redemption can be delivered -- by faith in Jesus Christ. And the possibility of redemption can make straight the crookedness of a character; make whole the incompleteness of a soul."
The president also said that of all the Gospel stories, Jesus' last words on the cross -- "Father, into your hands I commit my spirit" -- especially resonate with him during the Easter season. "These words were spoken by our Lord and savior, but they can just as truly be spoken by every one of us here today," Obama said.
Royalty always speaks in the first person plural.
Ah...
so someone ELSE noticed it as well!
In this 'agreement', can we admit that SOME of us may be WRONG?
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