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UFO Cults Are Flourishing in New Age Circles
Christian Research Institute ..... "because truth matters" ^ | Unknown | Hank Hanegraaff

Posted on 05/25/2010 10:19:08 PM PDT by Outlaw Woman

CRI Statement

A leading East Coast New Age magazine, New Frontier, recently ran a “dirt for sale” advertisement in its November issue. But this one had a twist — the dirt had allegedly been supercharged by extraterrestrials (ETs). It stated: UFO LANDING site radiates cosmic energy alters psychic awareness. Soil samples $5 + p&h.

Not surprisingly, the Boulder, Colorado firm that ran the ad did not respond to a letter asking for proof that there was something unusual about the dirt.

While it is not immediately known how many people actu­ally sent in their $5, the appear­ance of such an ad is not unusu­al. Alongside all the ads bought by New Agers — peddling crystals, “power within” seminars, and channeling sessions — are news bits about recent UFO landings, announcements of upcoming UFO conferences, and advertisements from some of the nation’s leading names in the field of UFOs and the New Age. Some of the ads are placed by alleged “walk-ins,” people who claim that ETs have literally invaded their bodies and can be summoned up (sometimes for a fee) to share wisdom and Ann Landers type advice.

In short, more and more peo­ple today are saying UFOs have landed. And while proof that they have seems consistently elusive, it is clear that the phe­nomenon of UFOlogy — a fas­cination with UFOs and alleged space creatures — has landed squarely in the middle of the New Age movement.

What is behind the recent resurgence of interest in UFOs, particularly in New Age circles?

(Excerpt) Read more at equip.org ...


TOPICS: Current Events; General Discusssion
KEYWORDS: cults; heresy; newage; ufos
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This is being posted on the behalf of a fellow FReeper who has a family member deeply involved in this. If anyone has any personal experience with these cults and has any insight on how to deal with them, it would be appreciated if you could share your knowledge. Please hold this family in your prayers as they battle to bring their family member out of this "darkness".
1 posted on 05/25/2010 10:19:08 PM PDT by Outlaw Woman
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To: The Ignorant Fisherman

Any thoughts?


2 posted on 05/25/2010 10:23:34 PM PDT by Outlaw Woman (Control the American people? Herding cats would be easier.)
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To: Outlaw Woman
You were saying ...

This is being posted on the behalf of a fellow FReeper who has a family member deeply involved in this. If anyone has any personal experience with these cults and has any insight on how to deal with them, it would be appreciated if you could share your knowledge.

Ummmm..., a call for a bit of clarification here ... :-)

First, "deeply involved in this" ... exactly what is "this" ... (maybe it's obvious to some, but not exactly obvious to me... so I'm asking).

And then, secondly, you ask if anyone has had any "personal experience with these cults" -- again exactly what cult are we talking about here?

For example, if you're talking about the "New Agers" -- that would be typically a "worldview" and not so much a "cult". There may be a cult that has the "worldview" of "New Agers" but "New Agers", strictly speaking, are not necessarily a cult.

But, if someone is directly involved in Raelian Movement, then they would be directly involved in a cult. BUT, if someone simply "thought like the Raelians" but were not directly involved with them -- then they are typically exhibiting a "worldview" that matches the Raelians, but they are not "in a cult".

So, what you're asking needs to be "pinned down" more, with more of an explanation here...

3 posted on 05/25/2010 10:36:36 PM PDT by Star Traveler (Remember to keep the Messiah of Israel in the One-World Government that we look forward to coming)
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To: Outlaw Woman

It’s not new... the AZ Center for Kooks (aka Sedona) has had a glossy magazine covering this for ages...

http://sedonajournal.com/


4 posted on 05/25/2010 10:45:04 PM PDT by az_gila (AZ - one Governor down... we don't want her back...)
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To: Outlaw Woman

I think most of these people harmless. But some need to be inststuinalized.


5 posted on 05/25/2010 10:50:49 PM PDT by BigCinBigD (Northern flags in South winds flutter...)
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To: Star Traveler

Sorry for the confusion but the cult is listed in the title of the article “UFO Cults are Flourishing...”. And being deeply involved in, also meant to be being heavily persuaded/influenced. I’ve never been involved in a cult but have read ‘some’ and could use a ‘Jim Jones’ as an example or even ‘The Heaven’s gate’ situation to show the damage they can do to a belief system. Hope that clarifies the intent. Thanks.


6 posted on 05/25/2010 10:52:13 PM PDT by Outlaw Woman (Control the American people? Herding cats would be easier.)
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To: Outlaw Woman

My thought is this: That the answer is family, and the uncontingent love that binds it. In a case like this, I might speculate that when someone “misses love”, as Nietzsche alluded, they will seek it in doctrine. Of course, this will be a doctrine other than the one which seemed to them to be displacing the love that they missed in the first place. To cast the issue in terms of a “battle” between doctrines is hopelessly misguided.

That is my thought.


7 posted on 05/25/2010 10:55:20 PM PDT by dr_lew
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To: dr_lew

Thank you dr


8 posted on 05/25/2010 10:58:20 PM PDT by Outlaw Woman (Control the American people? Herding cats would be easier.)
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To: Outlaw Woman

The best way to “deal with them” is through a visit with a licensed doctor and committed use of the pharmaceuticals prescribed.


9 posted on 05/25/2010 11:02:35 PM PDT by Artemis Webb (DeMint 2012)
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To: Star Traveler
I disagree that New agers are involved in anything less than a cult...the history of new agers goes back to Alexander the Great until Christianity stomped it out....they ALL are based on paganism practices.

Some like to believe, because practicing todays new age means you can pick from a pot of many eastern beliefs to fit your own idea, that it's somehow acceptable or not New Age, However their basic principles and practices remain the same...and they do lead people away from Christ in time.

The title mentions “Ufo New Age” which these are definately cult. Similar to the Heaven's Gate group. Believing humans have taken the form of aliens etc. The Ralien movement is one of many from Pledians to Starseeds...etc.etc. The galactic federation etc. They also wrap themselves in many of the government conspiracy issues.

The dangers are the transcendental meditations and the strong arm of internet “teachers” who spoonfed this junk...

10 posted on 05/25/2010 11:03:31 PM PDT by caww
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To: Outlaw Woman
You were saying ...

Sorry for the confusion but the cult is listed in the title of the article “UFO Cults are Flourishing...”.

Okay, that's a "generalized description" -- not a cult group. For example, "the Raelians" are a cult group, but a "UFO cult" is not a cult group -- but a "generalized description".

I should also clarify my statements, too -- a little bit further. There are a lot of people who will hold to "opinions" that may match the Raelians, in certain areas and in certain ways -- but the fact that they hold to those opinions that may "match" the Raelians does not mean that those people are "in a UFO cult group". Not at all.

All that is happeing there (with those particular people I just described) is that they "hold a worldview" that matches the worldview of the Raelians.

There happen to be FReepers here who will maintain and argue for -- some of the same things that the Raelians may believe and what they maintain (not everything, but a lot of it, at least the generalized "idea" anyway). But, that doesn't make those FReepers members of a cult group and they can't be said to be in a "UFO Cult" ... not at all.

These FReepers do not have a "Biblical worldview" but that doesn't make their own worldview (which I believe is wrong, according to the Bible) -- a "cult".

The actual cult groups that are mentioned here -- are Streiber's Communion support groups, the Raelians and the Jesusonian Foundation.

Now, are you saying that it's one of those that are mentioned... one of those three? If not one of those three, then which one, in particular, is this person a member of?

And again, just believing in UFOs is not a matter of being in a cult group. It's a "worldview" outlook, but not a "cult" ...

I should mention that there are Christians who believe that these reports of UFOs have a "Biblical basis" and there is a "Biblical understanding" to them. And many Christians think they are "real" and not imaginary.

I'm sorry it this is starting to sound confusing, but I've been all through it and it's not simply that someone belongs to a "UFO cult" -- because they believe in UFOs and that there are extra-terrestrial, very advanced civilizations coming here and visiting mankind and earth, and are abducting people, and are experimenting on them, and are trying to interact with people. That's not a cult group. That's a "worldview" that many (including many FReepers) have taken on, and is part of their "belief-system" -- not a "cult group".

And, by the way, Heaven's Gate is (was) a cult group.

11 posted on 05/25/2010 11:10:57 PM PDT by Star Traveler (Remember to keep the Messiah of Israel in the One-World Government that we look forward to coming)
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To: Star Traveler; Outlaw Woman

It is one thing to say that, given the vastness of the Universe (heck, you can look at the vastness of our little galaxy), the probability of species who are both intelligent and able to travel across interstellar distances is > 1.

Include the infinite footprint of the Universe and the probability is also infinity.

But it is another thing to suggest a single set of these aliens has contacted someone and directed them to do something, especially something awful.

Unless and until we have a landing like in “To Serve Man” or “The Day The Earth Stood Still” or, for that matter like “War of The Worlds,” “Independence Day,” “District 9” or “Mars Attacks!” or then the idea that a 3rd kind encounter has occurred is ridiculous.


12 posted on 05/25/2010 11:31:43 PM PDT by freedumb2003 (The frog who accepts a ride from a scorpion should expect a sting and the phrase "it is my nature.")
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To: caww
You were saying ...

I disagree that New agers are involved in anything less than a cult..

It's a matter of definition here.

There is such a thing as "New Age thinking" or a "New Age worldview" that many people have -- but are not involved in a "cult group".

By me saying that they are not involved in a "cult group" does not mean that they are Biblical and that they are in line with basic Christianity. That's not what is meant by that.

Everyone who denies Christianity is not -- "in a cult group" -- by that denial of the Bible's message of Christianity and it's doctrines.

Now, if one is a Jehovah's Witness member -- then -- they are "in a cult group". Being in a cult group has a "dynamic" that is very oppressive and coercive. There is a list of "bullet-point-items" that one can "check-off" to see if a "group" meets the definition of "cult group".

But, having a "worldview" that is opposed to the Bible and the doctrines of Christianity -- as an "individual" (but not as a "member" of a paricular group) -- that "worldview" just by itself, doesn't make one a "cult member".

It may sound like I'm splitting hairs here, but there is a definition to "cult groups" and you can identify particular ones -- and each one has its own way of teaching and viewing things, which will be different from another. They all may be wrong (according to the Bible) -- but -- they are all "not the same" with one another and there are "distinctives" that separate one cult from another cult group.

See Walter Martin's book on Kingdom of the Cults -- and you'll have many groups actually "defined" and "identified" and their teaching analyzed -- and you can distinguish the one from the other, with cult groups.


The title mentions “Ufo New Age” which these are definately cult. Similar to the Heaven's Gate group.

You mention "Heaven's Gate" and that is definitely a "cult group"... but there is no such "group" as the "New Age group" that you can identify as a "cult group".

There is a "worldview" that is "New Age" ... but that is not a "cult group" itself. You can generally identify "thinking" that is typical with "New Agers" -- and the thinking is not Biblical and does not accord with Christian doctrine -- but just because that individual has a "New Age worldview" does not put him in a "cult group".

But, if you are talking about "Heaven's Gate" (which will incorporate "New Age thinking" into its group) and the person is a "member" of "Heaven's Gate" -- then -- they are in a "cult group".


It's important to know if a person is involved in a "specific cult group" -- or instead -- if they merely hold to a "worldview" (like "New Agers"), but don't belong to a cult group.

If they are in a specific cult group, you would approach that person in a different way, than if they were merely a "New Ager" in their "thinking" (i.e., "worldview").

You do need to know if you're dealing with a "cult group member" -- or -- if you're dealing with a person who holds a particular "worldview" as an individual. The "dynamic" is different and the way you approach them will be different.

13 posted on 05/25/2010 11:32:23 PM PDT by Star Traveler (Remember to keep the Messiah of Israel in the One-World Government that we look forward to coming)
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To: Star Traveler

......”because they BELIEVE in UFOs and that there are extra-terrestrial”......

I think it is important that what one believes or wants to believe is important to consider.....one might imagine possible in Extra Terrest. but the reality is there has not been evidence this is so.

Anyone can Believe in anything but it does not mean it is so. Some of the illusion games and such you would swear are moving or turning a certain way ...but they are stationary...our eyes view things a certain way so when you add belief into the equation that hightens the expectation levels substantially.

Add in the idea of raising ones consciousness thru the various levels then one can believe they are visiting planets or as is stated in the New Age experience...astral-projection...and believe they are actually doing so...but the reality is it’s a fantasy.


14 posted on 05/25/2010 11:38:29 PM PDT by caww
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To: caww

“...as is stated in the New Age experience...astral-projection...and believe they are actually doing so...but the reality is it’s a fantasy...”

Or, for some, like the Heaven’s Gate leader, forget his name, it was delusional thinking.

But really, what it is for people is they feel a need to fill some void in their lives, insecurity, need for love, something. So, I would say the answer is study what they feel they are missing and work from that point.

The foolishness these groups offer is loss of time accomplishing the real goal.


15 posted on 05/25/2010 11:47:49 PM PDT by Beowulf9
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To: Outlaw Woman

A mind that can beleive in Global Warming is capable of easily beleiving in little green men whizzing around in Flying Saucers.


16 posted on 05/26/2010 12:37:05 AM PDT by screaminsunshine
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To: freedumb2003
I agree...additionally we would have picked up something with the various instruments we have to monitor space with...besides they would have made themselves known by now...furthermore why would they be contacting the people they do if their intentions are to “better the planet”...seems to me their selection of people comes up wanting very much.

Many of those who claim abductions can't seem to bring back any evidence from the ships...not buying the aliens prevent this...and as articles have said and those who investigate these people...many have been previously involved in the occults...as were many of the founders of the new age movement...in early history as well as today.

17 posted on 05/26/2010 1:43:27 AM PDT by caww
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To: Beowulf9

For others it’s an escape to start... then they get sucked in or hooked....still others simple curosity... and then they are caught at a weak moment and they are in it far more than they believed possible.

The problem starts with the meditation and going thru the dimensions they teach as possible...alot of guilt tripping and reverse psycology is used by the instructers.... and preaching the religious aspect of it...they use scripture twisted to suit their purposes as well.


18 posted on 05/26/2010 1:49:27 AM PDT by caww
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To: Star Traveler
But my understanding is the “New Age Thinking” is to do far less of critical thought and far far more of feelings...it is almost always feeling based...self-centered...and their are comman threads woven between the whole spectrum of New Age....the Sedona group in Az is certainly that...as was Heaven’s gate...but the teachings trasfer across the new age spectrum...and are all based in the same new age “thinking” that was in the dark ages and even further back...but just like everything else today...they dress it differently but it is still the same.
19 posted on 05/26/2010 1:56:53 AM PDT by caww
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To: Outlaw Woman

UFO cults are flourishing in UFO cult circles.


20 posted on 05/26/2010 2:22:50 AM PDT by Salman
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To: freedumb2003

Given the vastness of the universe, the probability is infinite that a planet exists, somewhere, that’s shaped just like Alfred E. Newman’s head. One day we will find it. One day.

Some say there is no planet shaped just like Alfred E. Newman’s head. Such arrogance! As if we’re so special that the image of Newman could only exist here on Earth.


21 posted on 05/26/2010 2:48:19 AM PDT by Yardstick
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To: caww

It would REALLY be a LOT wiser

for a lot of folks on the topic to be MUCH better informed.

Evidently, including, you.


22 posted on 05/26/2010 5:13:51 AM PDT by Quix (THE PLAN of the Bosses: http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/religion/2519352/posts?page=2#2)
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To: caww

Ah . . . well . . . as you wish . . .

DISPLAYS OF IGNORANCE are also informative

to those well informed and awake.


23 posted on 05/26/2010 5:14:43 AM PDT by Quix (THE PLAN of the Bosses: http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/religion/2519352/posts?page=2#2)
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To: Outlaw Woman

bttt for other FReeper’s opinions/input.


24 posted on 05/26/2010 7:00:50 AM PDT by Outlaw Woman (Control the American people? Herding cats would be easier.)
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To: Outlaw Woman
Okay, "people" (all-o'-y'all FReepers), here's a starting point for a discussion of dealing with some people who are "Starseeds".

Now, let's don't go off on the deep-end cracking jokes and stuff here ... just face the fact that there are people who are living their lives believing this. And so, let's start from that standpoint and go forward.

The question would be "who are these people" and "what do they really think" -- does anyone here have any direct experience with them? Anyone been "on the inside" of this group?

Has anyone had a family member who has been involved in this kind of specific group? What do you do? How do you talk to them? Anyone have any ideas?

That's what we're talking about here ... (and let's have some useful suggestions not stupid ones ... :-) ...).



ARE YOU A  STARSEED?

"Mission Control acknowledges that the process of waking up is a little tricky. Even though you are genetically encoded to do so, by the time you reach the point of activation, you will be totally convinced that you are an Earthling."

E. T. 101
Zoev Jho

Is it possible that you came to planet Earth from another star system? Are you here on a special mission to help this planet and its human family shift into a higher vibration by raising the spiritual awareness of those around you? 

As incredible as it may sound, there are many people on planet Earth today who have a deep, inner knowingness that they may indeed be here as a Starseed. Such individuals are often educated and respected members of society. They can be found in the fields of medicine, law, teaching, the humanities and other walks of life that seem to center around some form of service. 

Millions of others are in the process of awakening at this very moment. And they too are seriously wondering if they came from the stars

Beginning in 1960's, and continuing for the next 20 years or so, a series of books were published, which contained channeled information from a humble, discarnate messenger called Ra. The first book in the series is called, The Ra Material. 

Ra's message raises the distinct possibility that there are indeed beings from elsewhere (Wanderers) who are continuing to awaken on planet Earth. To be precise, Ra estimated that 65,000,000 were already incarnate on Earth during the 1960's.

Wanderers are described as beings who have evolved to a point of physical and spiritual maturity, which compels them to compassionately reach their hands out to any entities in the universe who call for help. Ra further states that these individuals are from all reaches of the infinite creation. And they are bound together by a common and very singular purpose; to serve those in need.

At this moment, planet Earth and its inhabitants fit that description well. We are in great need. That is why the Starseed wanderers are among us. They are here to help us raise our vibrations and those of Earth Mother so that their transformation, prophesized for these times, can take place. 

This will be accomplished by shifting our awareness from self-centeredness and an over-identification with the  material world to a more balanced one that puts far more emphasis on the spiritual. If we do not do this soon, we'll have to start all over as a family of souls until we get it right. Apparently, we've reached this point before during the times of Atlantis. That civilization also over-identified with the greed, pleasures and self-indulgences of the material world, while at the same time ignoring the spiritual aspects of life. 

During the late 1980's, another book was published called, E. T. 101. It has been out of print for a while. However, you should be able to find a copy here. It ranks among the finest literature I've read that relates to the Starseed experience. Like The Ra Material, it is also channeled information and it is THE manual for Starseeds.

In essence, E. T. 101 stresses that there are many Starseeds on planet Earth today who were pre-programmed to awaken at this critical moment in time. These awakened Starseeds are here to help Earth and its inhabitants shift into a higher vibrational dimension. And it appears to be imminent.

This book describes Starseeds as volunteers from distant star systems, who respond to the cry of help from individuals on planets that are in the process of awakening to their true spiritual nature. Plant Earth and its inhabitants is one of them. 

After hearing the call, Starseed volunteers came to Earth in earlier times and purposely forgot their real identity and origin. This temporary amnesia allowed them to become dysfunctional humans by taking on all the ego-based, human traits. 

Today, Starseeds find that their outer and inner worlds are being turned inside out and upside down, which has ignited their awakening process. As the Starseeds gradually remember their true identity and mission, the fear-based thinking they've taken on by becoming an Earthling is being transformed to that which is based upon love. This in turn impacts the entire collective consciousness of this planet in a very positive way. And we are experiencing that shift this very moment. 

E. T. 101 tells us...

"As the old programs of a dying world begin to unravel, you may experience a little discomfort, such as your entire world falling apart. It may be useful during this transition to remember that you are an interdimensional master who is an expert at transmuting crumbling realities. You have done this many times before."

This book is a must for anyone who wants to know if they are a Starseed, what's going on, and how to move through your inner changes and mission successfully. In a nutshell, when our entire lives have fallen apart, this book brings hope, understanding and the explanations why. 

Another book that does the same is, From Elsewhere, by Scott Mandelker, Ph.D.

If you have a deep, inner feeling and knowingness that you might be from another star system, don't be frightened. Apparently, there are many here at this moment in time who are part of the same courageous mission. If you have a fascination with the stars, UFO's, ETs, have  awakened spiritually, find your life is in turmoil, have an urgent need to be of service to mankind, or any combination of these "symptoms," then you may indeed be from another star system. 

Take heart, Starseed. You have long endured the human trial and have finally begun to awaken to your true nature and purpose. As you go through your day-to-day struggles, know in your heart that you are transmuting all the negative, dysfunctional patterns you have willingly become by taking on the human form. This is turn makes it easier for those who are human to follow your lead. 

Although you may not remember it at this time, you agreed to do this to assist the Earth in her birthing process into the Light and to liberate the souls who have lost their way on this planet. That is why you are here. That is your mission of love and service.

As always, my words are meant to inspire thought and a sense of wonder about who you really are. Please, in the end, reach your own conclusions  by researching the books I've listed below.

References:

E. T. 101 by Zoev Jho. You can purchase this book by clicking on this direct link. It will provide you with a list of stores that carry the book. It is a must read for Starseeds.

The Ra Material -- (book 1) by "Ra"
From Elsewhere -- by Scott Mandelker, Ph.D.
We the Arcturians -- by Norma Milanovich, Ph.D.
Songs of the Arcturians -- by Patricia Pereira
Eagles of the New Dawn -- by Patricia Pereira
Songs of Malantor -- by Patricia Pereira
Arcturian Songs of the Masters of Light -- by Patricia Pereira

25 posted on 05/26/2010 8:02:39 AM PDT by Star Traveler (Remember to keep the Messiah of Israel in the One-World Government that we look forward to coming)
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To: Quix

Hey Quix... how about this ... the Post #25). Have you heard of them. And this does sound like part of the “M.O.” of how some people in the “last of the end days” will be like and how they might be thinking, part of that deception that will go on.

Is there anyone in your ping list that knows anything about this ... just wondering ... :-)


26 posted on 05/26/2010 8:04:44 AM PDT by Star Traveler (Remember to keep the Messiah of Israel in the One-World Government that we look forward to coming)
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To: Quix
My statement is not made from ignorance Quix....some might imagine this to be so but there are certainly positions on both sides of the isle. Belief or not believing do come into play as with many positions of the unknown....and for that matter the known as well.

One might have interest in discovery from a scientific position as well...wanting the evidence and not just speculation or possibilities. As of date there is no evidence of extraterrestrials it's not there...but one is certainly allowed to believe anything they want....the reality is that aliens are not here.

BTW the term “awake” is commonly used by those who believe there is an “awakening” of peoples awareness that they are one of the aliens and or responsible to work with “the great awakening The “great gathering” so to speak...which by the way has been predicted many times over the years and still has not arrived.

It is common for people who believe in aliens invading peoples bodies to see those who do not believe as ignorant and uninformed.."unenlightened"...it is a standard response actually taught by those who promote and market new age....and this regardless of the science disproving their findings. New agers often are anti-science unless of course it supports their belief... To them the general public is not one of the “elite” given these special revelations...which gives the believers a sense of specialness above the crowd.

My personal opinion is the New Age Movement has hijacked those who seriously investigate UFOs....makes for better packaging and promotion of their new age beliefs....just as they use scripture to entice people to a higher state of "Christ-Consciousness"....which is bogus... but of course one won't know for sure unless they go thru their programs...or seminars...or buy their books...or "progress" thru the steps to "heavenly bliss"...where they become God.

Becoming like God is the very same words satan used clear back in the garden....." you'll be like God"....oh how slippery the slope....there is really nothing New about New age....same o' same o' deception and lie Eve heard.

27 posted on 05/26/2010 8:14:29 AM PDT by caww
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To: Outlaw Woman
bttt for other FReeper’s opinions/input.

There are no aliens visiting our planet. There is only the fun in believing so.
28 posted on 05/26/2010 8:19:11 AM PDT by ZX12R
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To: Star Traveler

Star....isn’t “Ra” from the old pagan Gods clear back in Cannan?...or at least Egyptian?.....God raised up Israel to wipe those people out because they were worshipping other Gods in the most horrific ways. I have noticed in my own research many of the beliefs come from or are borrowed from pagan gods and rites....just wrapped in different paper...


29 posted on 05/26/2010 8:25:48 AM PDT by caww
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To: ZX12R
You were saying ...

There are no aliens visiting our planet. There is only the fun in believing so.

So..., in regards to Post #1 ...

This is being posted on the behalf of a fellow FReeper who has a family member deeply involved in this. If anyone has any personal experience with these cults and has any insight on how to deal with them, it would be appreciated if you could share your knowledge.

What are you suggesting then?

While you're at it, you might take a look at Post #25 ...

30 posted on 05/26/2010 8:25:50 AM PDT by Star Traveler (Remember to keep the Messiah of Israel in the One-World Government that we look forward to coming)
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To: caww

Well..., just “off the top of my head” I think “Ra” is an Egyptian sun god ... but I could be wrong ... :-)


31 posted on 05/26/2010 8:27:30 AM PDT by Star Traveler (Remember to keep the Messiah of Israel in the One-World Government that we look forward to coming)
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To: Star Traveler
What are you suggesting then?

Baker Act, psychiatric evaluation, deprogramming, therapy. I'm sure there are professionals who deal specifically with cult deprogramming. Find one.
32 posted on 05/26/2010 8:33:15 AM PDT by ZX12R
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To: All
Okay, a follow-up to Post #25 and an "example" for some more of the "thinking" involved in this kind of group ... for anyone who may have information on it ... :-)



PASSPORT TO ASCENSION

A message from Archangel Michael

Transmitted through Ronna Herman - May, 2009

Beloved masters, the ascension process is initiated when you become aware that you are out of harmony with your God-self and our Mother / Father God, which leads to a desire to make life changes. Thus, a Divine discontent ignites within as you seek your own highest truth, and the desire to transmute and release past transgressions begins which, ultimately, includes the process of forgiving all others as well as yourself.

Maintaining a state of harmlessness is the foundation of the ascension process. Discord begins from within and is triggered through misqualified thoughts. There are many levels and stages of ascension: personal earthly ascension, whereby you gradually balance and harmonize your chakra centers which in turn triggers the process of clearing your physical vessel and your auric field of discordant energies. This begins the process of downloading the upper portion of your MerKaBa to create a star tetrahedron, the MerKaBic field of Light. As you progress in consciousness and attain a more refined resonance this basic field of Light will gradually transform into the MerKiVah, which is the Light vessel of ascension. Thus begins the solar system and galactic ascension process for humanity. Ultimately, we will experience the universal ascension process together. This phase of ascension will take place in the far-distant future; however, we in the higher realms of existence have had glimpses of this prodigious cosmic event and, we assure you, it is so magnificently complex and awe-inspiring that it is beyond your present comprehension.

You, the Star Seeds on Earth at the present time, have a vast, rich and glorious past, and this critical assignment on planet Earth is only one of the many important missions you have accepted in your long journey into the great void of unmanifested space. Many of you answered the call from the far-distant regions of the Omniverse in order to be a part of this universal experience. Before you began your decent into density, I promised you that we would reunite when our universal assignment was complete, and we would go forth together under the guidance and command of the Supreme Creator to the next glorious task of carrying out the mandate for the creation of new worlds and star systems, perhaps, even a new universe.

The Essence of the Supreme Creator resides in your diamond-core God Cell deep within your Sacred Heart which was placed there before you began your journey into physicality. The attributes, virtues and qualities of God-consciousness were stored within the chakra system and a reserve of Adamantine Particles were also placed within each chakra.

To advance on the spiral of ascension, you must take the Sacred Fire you personally need to become a self-master; and then you must share your newly gained wisdom with others in order to proceed to the next level of en-lighten-ment. This is a universal law, and if you do not share your Light and your wisdom, the energy flow of God particles will gradually diminish. Pure motives and intention, a loving attitude and a desire to live your truth as it has been revealed to you, along with a will to be of service are vital if you are to traverse the spiral of ascension successfully.

You may advance slowly upon the path of evolution by connecting with and drawing forth the Sacred Fire from your own God Self; however, you may call upon the ascended masters, the archangels who are ever ready to assist you or any of the great Beings of Light you resonate with. Ask them to overlight you with their qualities, virtues and attributes. This will put you on the path of accelerated transformation and will help you to attain the necessary Light quotient to move to the next level of God-consciousness. Your advancement on the path is carefully monitored by your Higher Self. If the inner light of awareness shines too brightly too soon, it can be a strain on the conscious mind and the ego desire body, thereby creating a battle for supremacy. Whatever energy you draw forth, qualify and direct out into the universe becomes your sole responsibility and will surely be returned to you some day, either in a positive or a negative form. This is the law of karmic cause and effect.

Each soul draws forth a quantity of its God-Self essence in proportion to the life's mission it assumes for a particular incarnation. The choices you make as a physical entity with free will determines how much of your storehouse of Sacred essence you will have access to and can benefit from. Remember, the unconditional love you embody and project contains the formula for igniting the Sacred Creator Fire within. You must be vigilant in maintaining an energetic signature/ frequency pattern of the highest resonance in order to assure a constant flow of the Sacred particles of Creator Light from the higher realms.

Beloveds, we are rapidly clearing the way for you to become Divine messengers, inspired teachers and initiates of a new way of existence. The Divine Rays which originated within the heart core of the Supreme Creator are refracted Light of stupendous power, which has been stepped down and refracted through the prism of our Father / Mother God's consciousness via the Great Central Suns of this universe.

Humankind has been living in the shadowlands since the sinking of Atlantis. Humanity gradually forgot the source of their being, thereby sinking deeper into polarity; and thus the broad spectrum of duality began. You will learn the lessons of life through experience, suffering or grace. Which will you choose? You must clear out your emotional storehouse of the past, the old emotional grudges and self-judgment that lower your self-esteem and empowerment.

Very few souls have been privileged to have access to the wisdom teachings of ascension which are now being revealed. Before the Earth year 1930, the secret wisdom teachings were only given to the most spiritually advanced souls by the ascended masters within the retreats and ashrams around the world. These teachings were called 'occult wisdom' which means hidden or veiled. Also in1930 a Divine dispensation was granted, which was the first time since the final sinking of Atlantis that the knowledge of the individual I Am Presence was given to humanity; and the transforming energies of the Violet Flame were accelerated in preparation for the forthcoming ascension process of humanity and the Earth.

As you learn to use the universal laws of manifestation, it is of vast importance that you discipline the mind and clearly define what you wish to create, for as you assume the mantle of an empowered Self-master, you will more readily create or become that which you focus on. In the past, your desires, thoughts and intentions were foggy, unclear and unintentional, and were often influenced or ruled by the sub-conscious or unconscious mind. The science of the soul will guide you along the path of soul education and spiritual evolution. The wisdom teachings of today could be called a passport for ascension. Pure motives and intention, a loving attitude and a desire to live your truth as it has been revealed to you, along with a desire to be of service are vital if you are to traverse the spiral of ascension successfully.

What good is information if you do not use the knowledge to gain wisdom, thereby assisting you to draw forth more Sacred Fire or God Particles of Creation, the full-spectrum Metatronic Light which contains stepped-down Supreme Creator Light, instead of the half-spectrum primal life force substance that has been available to earthlings since darkness put a cloud over humanity's consciousness and your life-force was greatly diminished?

True spirituality means adhering to the living truth and is not practiced just one or two hours a week as in done in most religious ceremonies. It is an incessant burning desire to be in constant communion with Spirit. Humanity must move past the shallow waters of orthodox worship into the mystical river of life. Akashic records are vibrational patterns--positive or negative--which are stored within the cosmic library which contains the total history of creation.

White fire God cells, called Adamantine Particles, are the essence of your Being. That is what is referred to in the saying 'You were made in God's image.' Each of you must learn how to draw forth the Sacred Fire containing Adamantine Particles of Light necessary for your ascension, and for the ascension of the Earth as well. The ascension flame must come through the hearts of men and women like you in order to be accessible and beneficial to the Earth and humanity. The more Adamantine Particles you draw forth from the cosmic river of life, activating them with your own precious gift of love and then allowing the major portion to flow through you out into the world of form, the more your allotment will increase and the more god-like you will become. Through you, the Light and power is blended with your earthly essence and stepped-down or transmuted to acceptable frequencies to be used by humanity and also to be integrated into the Earth. Through your efforts, this Divine elixir of life is now available to the animal kingdom in a greatly modified way, and it will also be used by the devic and elemental kingdoms to nourish and replenish the nature kingdom. It is important that you understand, the rays of Creator Light nourish and sustain all Creation. The Sacred Sites around the Earth were fueled with the cosmic energy within the great crystalline spires which were implanted in strategic places around the world when it was first created. You, the Star Seed, are now the living sentinels of Light who are acting in the capacity of Bearers of the Living Light.

Light Packets which contain advanced information which is sometimes difficult to decipher are being down-loaded to those who have begun the process of unifying the Sacred Mind and the Sacred Heart. In time, this will become a normal process; however, for the time being, you must allow yourselves time to turn inward and contemplate what is being given to you so that you can transform the knowledge into wisdom and integrate that which rings true to you. You must then put your newly-found wisdom into action which will gradually enhance your Light quotient and will add a new vibrational pattern to your Soul Song. Ask yourself this question before your sleep time: What have I contributed this day to the human/earthly storehouse of wisdom and loving energy? Living in a state of harmlessness in the NOW moment is your goal. Remember, with greater gifts comes greater responsibility.

As you become more proficient as cocreators on the earthly plane, you must constantly monitor your energy patterns and seek to upgrade them. You must strive for sustained harmony and refined godly expression. You must liberate the power of the Sacred Fire within which has lain dormant for many thousands of years. You must learn to direct and focus your energy into the areas of your life you wish to change. By establishing and constantly upgrading your Creator Wheel of Life, you are planting the seeds of focused change and you are supplying the Sacred Fire of Creation needed to manifest what you have envisioned. When you can do this proficiently, your personal world will become a wonderland, and you will become a beacon of Light for all to see.

Beloveds, these are times of momentous change, and it is a wonderful opportunity for those like you to shine your Light. Do not let others discourage you. Follow your heart and allow Spirit to be your guide. We are ever near to inspire and support you. In you we are well pleased,

I AM ARCHANGEL MICHAEL

Transmitted through Ronna Herman *STAR*QUEST**
Phone/Fax: 775-856-3654 *
Email: ronnastar@earthlink.net
*Website: www.ronnastar.com

Dearest friends: Archangel Michael's teachings truly are reaching all corners of the Earth. We will soon have three books translated into Russian: Your Sacred Quest; On Wings of Light and The Golden Promise. On Wings of Light is now available in Hungarian and also, within a month or two, On Wings of Light will be available in Spanish. This makes ten languages in which AA Michael's teachings are available in book form, and the monthly messages are translated in most all major languages around the world. I have always noted on the monthly messages "Copy freely and share," with a request that I be given credit for the messages along with my website and Email address. More and more people are adding the monthly messages to their sites and I find that many are also excerpting quotes from the messages, stating that they are from Archangel Michael, but without giving me credit as author or reference to my website. Soon, as with so many other beautiful works, people will be putting "author unknown." It is my great pleasure and my mission to bring forth AA Michael's beautiful wisdom teachings; however, it does take much effort and time. Again, I ask those of you who wish to use the messages on your site or in any way to add my name to the messages or any excerpt: "Transmitted through Ronna Herman" along with my website and Email address: www.RonnaStar.com E-mail: RonnaStar@earthlink.net. Love and angel blessings, Ronna

33 posted on 05/26/2010 8:41:59 AM PDT by Star Traveler (Remember to keep the Messiah of Israel in the One-World Government that we look forward to coming)
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To: Star Traveler

Here are some very interesting comments pretaining to Scott Mandelkers videos: I tend to agree with this.

1. First of all, he has absolutely no basis for anything he says. He, in fact, says he can’t prove anything, and has no intention of doing that. The people “who are ET’s” just know they are. Using that approach, I can pretty much make up anything I want.

2. The belief that a 100 million people have ET’s within them is utterly rediculous, unless you want to make sure that a fair number of people that you convince this is true become a source of revenue for you.

3. Let’s assume that it’s true that the Earth is 4 billion years old, which is 4,000 million years. What is the liklihood that aliens are here on the planet at just the right time (last few centuries) where we would even be able to notice them and yet we cannot find any electromagnetic transmissions for them? Well, someone might say the ET’s have been here all throughout our planet’s history, because there’s millions or billions of alien civilizations “out there”. Well, if that’s true, where is there any electromagnetic transmission evidence? We should be have a multitude of transmissions, just like we have light from all of the stars. Even one would be a start.

3. Also, There’s the issue of traveling the distances in space. I’m not at all saying that in the estimated 3 billion galaxies out there, that there is no life, intellgent or otherwise. What I am saying is that it’s statistically highly unlikely that all this is conveniently occurring at this moment in our planet’s & civilization’s history. Let’s say they came by our planet at some point in the past. You’re looking at a time period of 4,000 million years for them to pass by. You can see that the statistics are totally against it.

4. As far as 2010 goes, this involves our planet passing the plane of the Milky Way Galaxy. There was an attempt to tie it in with thfe black hole that is suspected of being at the center of our galaxy. Outside of the black hole, the objects orbiting it would not see the black hole,but would fee the the gravitation effects the same way the feel the gravity from a star. We are a huge distance from the galactic center, so passing the plane will not have an effect.

5. And lastly, people crave the “fuzzy” strokes and want to feel that they’re part of something big and important. This is how cult’s develop. All this baloney about “star seeds” is exactly that. They take the fundamental need for people to feel important and create what I call “hogwash” to sell tapes, books, etc. Star Trek and Star Wars are not real They are science fiction made up for entertainment. No matter how much you want to believe it, there is not “Federation of Planets” that we know of. If you ask me “could it be possible?” I would absolutely yes. But due to the absolute restrictions associated with the unbelievable huge universe the distances limit our contact and confirmation of this.

6. As a final note, most people have DNA all wrong. They think that the DNA is the genetic code that essentially produces the person. This is only partially true. (Ref: “A Life Decoded:My Genome”, by Craig Venter). First of all, over 80% of our DNA is “junk”, which has nothing to do with us, other than the evolutionary history. Another point is that the way to view DNA is like that of a hard drive with file fragments all over the place. The DNA cannot defragment itself, so the instructions are not all together. The have to be “pulled” from many locations in the DNA structure.

I live in the world of reality. Unfortunately, I’ve found that a large number of people in our country, as well as others in the world, now live in a world of fantasy. A person has the right, for instance, to believe that there are large beings that live on the surface of sun, but I’m here to tell you that it is a fantasy if they believe that...pure and simple.

One other thing to consider is where is the “out there”? It’s essentially on the back of our eye and in the brain. Vision comes from the object we’re viewing to our eyes, not the other way around. So the world we know is based upon the images on the backo of our eyeballs, tied in with touch, hearing, taste, ect., which ultimately ends up in the “mind”. And depending on your circumstances, what your mind “sees” may or not be reality. Below is an excellent example that shows this. (see attached file spinning-wheels.jpg) The circles below appear to be moving, but they’re not. If two people look at this for just a second or two , one close and the further back, and then had to testify in a court of law, one person would swear they were moving and the other would swear they were not. Who’s correct? The reality is that the one who said they were moving was incorrect, even though he “perceived” them to moving. It does matter how much he wants to believe this, the reality is they are not moving.


34 posted on 05/26/2010 9:18:36 AM PDT by caww
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To: caww
I live in the world of reality. Unfortunately, I’ve found that a large number of people in our country, as well as others in the world, now live in a world of fantasy. A person has the right, for instance, to believe that there are large beings that live on the surface of sun, but I’m here to tell you that it is a fantasy if they believe that...pure and simple.

You are not going to get along very well with the FRingies.
35 posted on 05/26/2010 9:24:12 AM PDT by ZX12R
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To: caww

Link to how the eyes can and do decieve us....you think that looking at this phot that it is moving...you caouls swear it is...however it is not...stand back a couple feet from your computer and you will see it is stationary.

http://thinksmart.typepad.com/good_morning_thinkers/images/moving_illusion.bmp


36 posted on 05/26/2010 9:25:57 AM PDT by caww
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To: ZX12R

In order for anytype of deprogramming the person must want to leave these beliefs or has an understanding he has been deceived....until then the question is how do families and loved ones deal with the situation as it is.


37 posted on 05/26/2010 9:28:25 AM PDT by caww
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To: ZX12R
That may very well be the case...people do tend to flock to those of like minds....I do not believe others do....

What I do realize is there is much deception built into the New Age UFO teachings....again do I believe in UFOS...well of course..we all do...they are after all unidentified flying objects...we don't know what they are until they are proven one way or another. But there are no aliens..and that is reality.

38 posted on 05/26/2010 9:32:21 AM PDT by caww
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To: caww
In order for anytype of deprogramming the person must want to leave these beliefs or has an understanding he has been deceived....until then the question is how do families and loved ones deal with the situation as it is.

Baker act confinement, for the purpose of a psychiatric evaluation is the only option. Then, if they do not present a threat to themselves or others, you keep trying to talk to them, and live with it.
39 posted on 05/26/2010 9:34:06 AM PDT by ZX12R
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To: Star Traveler
Star, these are channelers statements....made from contacts either from within their own minds or perhaps in some cases demonic entities influencing them....either way contact with the dead...or Masters as they choose to call them is expressly against what God calls abominations to Him....scriptures are clear about this. You do not do this....

Some would say in doing so you can leave yourself open to demonic influences...and that the “spirit guides” they profess are just that..from the dark side. After all satan is well known to masquerade as an angel of light....interesting how often new agersuse the term “Light”....

Additionally is is known that people who go into deep meditation over a period of time can and do “suspend” their critical thinking abilities...which makes perfect sense.

The dangers are...,as Scott Mandlker teaches, there is a total preparation and later transfer of ones personality and being to another...willing done by the party because by then they have become so entrenched they have lost their ability to discern good and evil. “A suspension of critical thinking” does happen.

....”these meditations of going to other realms are actually states of altered consciousness that are the same as being hypnotized. This means that judgment and critical thinking skills are suspended. So one is opening himself up to influences from anywhere (demonic) and allowing experiences to validate this beliefs. This is quite dangerous.”.........Former new age instructor now Christian.

40 posted on 05/26/2010 9:49:33 AM PDT by caww
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To: caww; Star Traveler
Some would say in doing so you can leave yourself open to demonic influences...and that the “spirit guides” they profess are just that..from the dark side.

Like a Ouija board?
41 posted on 05/26/2010 9:54:19 AM PDT by ZX12R
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To: ZX12R

The Baker Confinement Act depends much on the states laws and there is much contriversey concerning evaluating the danger the person actually is to themsleves or others.

But I agree that an adult simply has the right to believe whatever they want and the most you can do is keep trying to talk to them and find a way to live with the choice they have made.


42 posted on 05/26/2010 10:05:34 AM PDT by caww
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To: Star Traveler
You can see by these channelers their ultimate gain is the books you buy from them....there is big money in spreading this garbage to the minds of people who are primed today to believe such none-sense. They always end up announcing their next conference or seminar or book and of course their websites which generally give the prices they require for their personal help...it's a racket and they all borrow and refer to one another.

“Project Camelot” also adds that their proceeds go to some poor troubled man or people in south Africa you can send your money too....but upon investigating the address and bank accounts you see this is an off shore deal that protects their income. In other cases they claim proceeds go to children's hospitals in Hawaii etc....none if any actually make it there.

43 posted on 05/26/2010 10:13:08 AM PDT by caww
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To: ZX12R

I would think these boards would be included as the idea is to gain access into the spirit world. People look at these “games” as just fun...but others take it wuite seriously as with Tarot cards...palm readings...channelers etc. These all are on the “darker”side so to speak and likely much has to do if one believes or not. In some cases it wouldn’t matter I suppose...but I sure wouldn’t mess around that close to the edge....never underestimate the enemy of mens souls....he’s not called the father of lies for nothing...and certainly par excellant at deception.


44 posted on 05/26/2010 10:27:31 AM PDT by caww
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To: Star Traveler
From a Christian perspective all these channelers are saying is hocus pocus mumbo jumbo and can easily be debunked via scripture....

Generally they go off into their fantasy land with no regard for reality...they speak in generalities otherwise which any person could say....”The earth will have difficulties in the year 2010.”.....well, in what way? How? Be specific. They simple borrow from what is already known and reveal nothing at all, or manufacture whatever they think will sell to the hearers.

As you can tell they speak in circles because it is fantasy.

45 posted on 05/26/2010 10:41:49 AM PDT by caww
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To: Star Traveler

Well star Traveler if I didn’t know better it would look like you are promoting starseed ideals. It is not unusual for religious people and even true believers to believe in this...in fact they oftentimes “hook” people who are believers because they are already aware of biblical teachings, how be it often limited.

At any rate accession to other states of consciouness is a big not happening...rather the feel good mode comes about from the chemical responses which are natural to our bodies...(snapse) and endorphines come into play as well...that is why people keep going back ..it is a feel good thing...their happy fix for the day. Same thing occurs with alcohol or drug use...

If a person professes to be a Christian, but knowingly participates in many activities that are clearly spelled out in the bible as forbidden and demonic, it is reasonable to interpret this to be that they’re not really a Christian and that they may be risking the loss of their soul. That cold hard reality may have a more profound effect on the person than all of the “logic” in the world.

It’s my understanding that all activities, such as channeling, astral projection, reincarnation, astrology, etc., are not of God or Christ. If someone told me that I could immediately understand all the branches of science without any effort, or that I could become rich beyond my wildest dreams and never have to worry about having enough money ever again, but would have to give up my soul, I wouldn’t even consider it. Yet many of these people may end up risking their souls for the a fantasy that makes them feel they now “see the light”.

I don’t know if this helps, but perhaps this perspective might help people see the deception that is taking place and avoid going to far to return to reality.


46 posted on 05/26/2010 11:03:54 AM PDT by caww
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To: Outlaw Woman

yes watch the christian move Unidentified... that is my position...


47 posted on 05/26/2010 2:30:10 PM PDT by The Ignorant Fisherman
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To: The Ignorant Fisherman

You can’t move unidentified until they have identified the object. ...until then it’s UN-identified. Simply a matter of known or unknown...no Christian about it one way or another. Also being unknown still does not mean it is an alien ship, which the real ufo enthusiasts might want to believe....it simply isn’t known.


48 posted on 05/26/2010 5:11:31 PM PDT by caww
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To: Star Traveler; Alamo-Girl; Amityschild; AngieGal; AnimalLover; Ann de IL; annieokie; aragorn; ...

IF ANY OF YOU ON THE END TIMES OR UFO PING LISTS KNOW MUCH MORE ABOUT THE ET/NEW AGE MOVEMENT ‘SCRIPT,’ BELIEFS, TEACHINGS ETC. AND CARE TO COMMENT MORE, some of your fellow FREEPERS would appreciate your input.

I don’t know of any other Freepers who are greatly read up on the topic though there must be a fair number. They just haven’t come forward noting that or emphasizing it.

Post #25—my cursory read/scan of most of it—it sounds like fairly standard NEW AGE stuff vis a vis UFO’s, ET’s and the whole GREAT DECEPTION associated therewith. I’ll ping both the END TIMES LIST and the UFO ping list and see if anyone on either list knows more and is willing to talk about it.

It’s a fairly boring and bothersome topic to me. It’s kind of like reading a script from the cesspools of hell. Not my preference.

I have enough of their number, I don’t need to bother a whole lot more about it than to keep some slight tabs on where they are in their script currently. I don’t even do that weekly but maybe every few months just a bit.


49 posted on 05/26/2010 8:01:10 PM PDT by Quix (THE PLAN of the Bosses: http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/religion/2519352/posts?page=2#2)
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To: caww; Amityschild; AngieGal; auggy; autumnraine; bearsgirl90; bethtopaz; BigBadWolf; Blogger; ...

Of course the New Age movement and the fallen angels/ET’s are in cahoots. They are both managed from hell. NO big surprise there.

HTTP://WWW.ANCIENTofDAYS.NET

has tons of great material on all such.

It doesn’t matter to me whether, as Guy Malone at the above link convincingly asserts with an impressive panel of high level scholars—that the ET’s are all fallen angels

and/or

IF they are, as they claim [while being chronic liars] that they are from distant planets.

IT IS CLEAR THAT THEY ARE IN CAHOOTS WITH SATAN AND THE GLOBALISTS TOWARD ESTABLISHING THE WORLD GOVERNMENT OVERTLY—ULTIMATELY TO BE RAN BY SATAN INCARNATE.

That’s mostly all I need to know about the critters. Being in cahoots with the globalists is equal to being in cahoots with Satan. End of story.

However, I think it wise to be alert to their schemes, plans, teachings.

Scripture says the END TIMES will entail a GREAT DECEPTION SO CLEVER THAT WERE IT POSSIBLE, THE VERY ELECT OF GOD WOULD BE DECEIVED.

I believe that those walking intimately with God will not be deceived. “Luke warm” so called “Christians” may well be deceived to their great hurt if not eternal damnation.

Certainly I believe that the massive paradigm shifts coming from that whole sphere—shoved down the throats of the whole world—will be devastating to many “Christians” because they are not used to critical thinking; are not used to walking close to God; tend to treat their “Christianity” as a convenience thing; a social club thing; a business thing; or a fire escape/trauma escape thing rather than an INTIMATE DANCE WITH GOD.

Those folks are likely to find themselves in enormous confusion, distress, problems . . . unless they confess, repent, quickly call on God and get on track WITH HIM.


50 posted on 05/26/2010 8:10:44 PM PDT by Quix (THE PLAN of the Bosses: http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/religion/2519352/posts?page=2#2)
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