The half-life of DNA in bone:... [YEC takes a hit, DNA half-life only 521 years]

http://rspb.royalsocietypublishing.org/content/early/2012/10/05/rspb.2012.1745 ^

[truthfinder9]

[If dinos walked with man, there should be dino DNA, however, there is not.]

Claims of extreme survival of DNA have emphasized the need for reliable models of DNA degradation through time. By analysing mitochondrial DNA (mtDNA) from 158 radiocarbon-dated bones of the extinct New Zealand moa, we confirm empirically a long-hypothesized exponential decay relationship. The average DNA half-life within this geographically constrained fossil assemblage was estimated to be 521 years for a 242 bp mtDNA sequence, corresponding to a per nucleotide fragmentation rate (k) of 5.50 × 10–6 per year. With an effective burial temperature of 13.1°C, the rate is almost 400 times slower than predicted from published kinetic data of in vitro DNA depurination at pH 5. Although best described by an exponential model (R2 = 0.39), considerable sample-to-sample variance in DNA preservation could not be accounted for by geologic age. This variation likely derives from differences in taphonomy and bone diagenesis, which have confounded previous, less spatially constrained attempts to study DNA decay kinetics. Lastly, by calculating DNA fragmentation rates on Illumina HiSeq data, we show that nuclear DNA has degraded at least twice as fast as mtDNA. These results provide a baseline for predicting long-term DNA survival in bone.

[bgill]

Thomasauras

[Gil4]

I consider him a heretic for refusing to renounce the Council of Trent decrees.

[tophat9000]

Yea..I never got the 6000 years..the bible has nothing about 6000 years..the 6000 years comes from some preacher in the 1800’s If I recall correctly.....if you want to refute the bible at least be intellectually honest and read what you want to refute..

[1010RD]

It was Eve that was deceived and Adam went along with it afterwards to fulfill God’s commandment to be fruitful and multiply. Without Eve that commandment couldn’t be fulfilled as she had to be expelled from the Garden in Eden.

[dangus]

Uh, no... you can simply add up the years in the bible to get about 4,000 years from Adam to Christ. In my figuring, the universe legitimately looks several billion years old. Then again, Adam has always been conceived of as having been formed an adult. Why would Adam be formed mature, why do scientists expect that the universe would not have been formed mature? And why do creationists expect that the universe should not look old?

[Pete from Shawnee Mission]

“Ye?” You mean “The,” of course. Believe it or not, uneducated moderns do not know that use of the letter “y” in the middle english “ye” was actually a printer’s type substitute for the old english letter thorn. Of course, you also mean to clumsily ridicule creationists as medieval,uneducated,unscientific,etc. If anyone wants to know about this, go look at the Wikipedia entry for “Thorn (letter)”

[Springfield Reformer]

ping for reference. BTW, I have seen DNA decay as an argument FOR YEC. Some Japanese fellow claiming thermal decay predicts no DNA could survive more than about 10K years, even under the most perfectly protected conditions. Creation magazine (Answers in Genesis) touted this as a basis for being suspicious of dating any discovered dinosaur DNA to periods significantly beyond the 10K limit. And this new proposal on half-life does not seem to be inconsistent with that premise. Perhaps I am missing the point, but I do not see how this harms the essentials of the YEC position at all.

[Hostage]

Adam was 933 years old when he died; that’s 933 years from the time he was cast out of the Garden, not from the time he was created.

He was created a ***spiritual*** ***immortal*** being. For all we know he could have existed billions of years as a spiritual immortal being, inside the Garden.

Time is not a physical phenomenon. Physicists do not recognize time as anything physical; it is a linear measure that transitions to a nonlinear measure in the presence of singularities such as Black Holes, but it is just a measure that is used in the definition of mechanical parameters such as velocity, acceleration, power etc.

Time grinds to a halt when a body approaches the speed of light.

God is infinite, God is light. Time has no attachment to God; He is infinite, without bound.

[Hostage]

It was also Adam. He was culpable, he was Master and he followed Satan because he knew that Eve was following Satan.

[gleeaikin]

The article referred to this a geographically constrained set of samples. So the 500 years pertains to those samples. On the other hand since temperature is an influence, I’ll bet that the DNA of some of those frozen mammoth carcasses is probably still in pretty good shape.

[Last of the Mohicans]

Answers in Genesis? Ken Hamm is a buffoon who can’t be taken seriously in the creation-evolution debate.

[Springfield Reformer]

Answers in Genesis? Ken Hamm is a buffoon who can’t be taken seriously in the creation-evolution debate.

Well, I've met Ken personally, and he seems a nice enough chap. BTW, although I was hoping against hope for something other than an ad hominem attack, your response was exactly what I have come to expect in these discussions. No substance, all bluster. I am not a professional scientist, and am willing to learn, but I have zero respect for non-arguments like name calling. They serve no one, and diminish the authority of anyone who uses them. IMHO.

[1010RD]

You are utterly incorrect. The Bible is very clear on the matter:

But I fear, lest by any means, as the serpent beguiled Eve through his subtilty, so your minds should be corrupted from the simplicity that is in Christ.
http://bible.cc/2_corinthians/11-3.htm

And Adam was not deceived, but the woman being deceived was in the transgression.
http://bible.cc/1_timothy/2-14.htm

Eve’s own testimony confesses as much: And the LORD God said unto the woman, What is this that thou hast done? And the woman said, The serpent beguiled me, and I did eat.

http://bible.cc/genesis/3-13.htm

Adam didn’t follow Satan, he followed God. God’s own testimony is clear on this matter as well:

And unto Adam he said, Because thou hast hearkened unto the voice of thy wife, and hast eaten of the tree, of which I commanded thee, saying, Thou shalt not eat of it: cursed is the ground for thy sake; in sorrow shalt thou eat of it all the days of thy life;

http://bible.cc/genesis/3-17.htm

So Adam didn’t hearken unto Satan, but Eve. Why would he follow the counsel of his wife?

1. She’s God’s created Helpmeet, that is a companion worthy of Adam. http://bible.cc/genesis/2-18.htm

Did God err? No.

2. Adam recognized as much and stated it thusly:
And Adam said, This is now bone of my bones, and flesh of my flesh: she shall be called Woman, because she was taken out of Man.
Therefore shall a man leave his father and his mother, and shall cleave unto his wife: and they shall be one flesh.
http://kingjbible.com/genesis/2-23.htm

This is the purpose of Eve and women in general. To become married, one flesh, and a man should cleave to his wife. It is God’s purpose.

Adam, in partaking of the fruit, didn’t follow Satan, but God. You’re mistaken or have been mislead. There is a lot of false doctrine out there, but you can read it for yourself, now, and understand the truth.

[1010RD]

Fascinating story and good to know, but you’re misunderstanding allmendream. YE in that post stands for Young Earth as in YEC where the C stands for creationist.

[bert]

Heretic?

Heretics are people murdered for their beliefs by various Popes through the ages before freedom to think was established

[driftdiver]

Heretics aren’t defined by their being murdered. They are defined as people who push false teachings of Christianity.

[driftdiver]

” BTW, although I was hoping against hope for something other than an ad hominem attack, your response was exactly what I have come to expect in these discussions.”

yeah amazing that happens when the OP starts insulting Christians in the very first post, shocking even

[bert]

-——people who push false teachings-——

or, who don’t conform to the party line, the theological consensus of the day

[daniel1212]

Thanks. And before sin there was no decay, and when it did we can only speculate the aging that took place at that point. And then there is the “gap” theory.

[SunkenCiv]

The point of this article is, half the DNA vanishes every 521 years; half the remainder in another 521 years; etc.