Forest Service Chief Calls for Controlled Burns, while in Oregon

KGW TV/AP ^ | 09 August 2002 | Jeff Barnard

[Grampa Dave]

Forest Service Chief Calls for Controlled Burns 08/09/2002

By JEFF BARNARD, Associated Press Writer

U.S. Forest Service Chief Dale Bosworth toured the Florence Fire Thursday and said it is imperative to thin national forests and restore the natural role of fire in the ecosystem.

Bosworth said he wanted a firsthand look at the largest active wildfire in the nation, to see how well the national firefighting effort is dealing with what could become the worst wildfire season in history.

"The most important thing we can do in a good part of the West is doing some thinning and reintroduce fire back into these fire-dependent ecosystems in a controlled manner," Bosworth said.

The National Fire Information Center reports 5 million acres have burned in the country this year, including more than 715,000 acres in Oregon.

The Florence Fire has grown to 296,000 acres on the Siskiyou National Forest and adjoining lands in southwestern Oregon and northern California.

The threat to the 17,000 people of the Illinois Valley has eased, but the fire continues to threaten the community of Agness in the Rogue River Canyon and the Wilderness Retreat subdivision east of Brookings.

To date, $27.2 million has been spent fighting the fire, though it is only 15 percent contained. More than 5,000 people have been assembled from around the country to fight it.

Bosworth wanted to see how the money is being spent.

"We're really interested in finding out how things are working out on these fires, how well crews are working," Bosworth said.

Brian Waidmann, chief of staff to Interior Secretary Gale Norton, said he was impressed by the cooperation between federal, state and local agencies.

The $325 million budget for fighting fires this year has been spent, and the bill could run up to $1 billion, Bosworth said. Money allocated for preventing future fires has been moved to firefighting, and he hoped Congress would restore the diverted funding.

Fire commanders hope to keep the fire away from Agness on its north flank, but the blaze still has the potential to break out toward the coastal town of Brookings.

"It kind of looks like a war zone up here," said Serene Ireland, owner of the Agness RV Park about 25 miles east of Gold Beach. "We've got military trucks, Red Cross vans, all kinds of earth mover equipment, big fire trucks. It's not quiet little Agness right now."

The Florence and Sour Biscuit fires were brought together west of O'Brien by burnout operations that have consolidated and strengthened containment lines.

"That means we have a pretty solid containment line from north of Selma to the California border," said fire spokesman Mike Ferris.

Weather forecasts called for a warming and drying trend into the weekend, with winds of up to 40 mph.

Other fires burning in Oregon included:

-- Tiller Complex, 32,665 acres, Umpqua National Forest near Tiller, 25 percent contained.

-- Timbered Rock Fire, 27,145 acres, outside Shady Cove, 90 percent contained.

-- Monument Fire, 24,378 acres, outside Unity, 95 percent contained

[Grampa Dave]

Sounds like the company line adopted in 1995 by the Babbitt Floristry Circus People.

If he restricts the management to burning, not thinning by logging and removal of dead trees for wood uses, this is right out of the Enviral Take Over Agenda of the Forestry Service during the Clintoon/Babbitt era.

[Grampa Dave]

The Oregon Live is into Feel Good Things to do this weekend with no fire updates from yesterday.

This was an interesting article at the KGW Site. Jeff Barnard has done a pretty good job reporting on this fire.

Please post what you hear and see. Again that is the best way to get data.

[E. Pluribus Unum]

Better to burn it at a loss than let people use it and turn a profit from it.

[Grampa Dave]

This is this morning's thread on the fire.

The Brookings area which is SW of the Fire will be cooler today. However, high winds are predicted all day from the North.

There is no real control on the west side of the fire as off yet. This could be a factor.

Appreciate your pinging on this, as it is not important to most Freepers. They had rather argue about esoteric things than the reality of two counties in Oregon being threated with a massive fire. A massive fire that is the result of miss management of burnable materials for at least a decade.

[EBUCK]

-- Timbered Rock Fire, 27,145 acres, outside Shady Cove, 90 percent contained.

My Brother just started a house in Shady Cove (started on it Saturday) glad to see that they've got a handle on it.

EBUCK

[Grampa Dave]

This is this morning's thread on the fire.

The Brookings area which is SW of the Fire will be cooler today. However, high winds are predicted all day from the North.

There is no real control on the west side of the fire as off yet. This could be a factor.

Thanks for your concern about this fire.

[Grampa Dave]

EPU posted, "Better to burn it at a loss than let people use it and turn a profit from it."

This is ultimate goal of the Green Jihadists who control our forests, national parks and wilderness areas.

They don't want a single stick of a tree to become a product that can be harvested and sold at a profit to come from our forests.

They are the true communists of the world still alive. They hate capitalism, America and Americans who work for a living. They are true Watermelons. Green on the outside and very red (communists) on the inside. You have to wonder how much of their agendas are created and driven by Old Gorby as he works in the Presido in San Francisco to weaken America via the Green Jihadists's Watermelon agendas.

[madfly]

ping

[E.G.C.]

BTTT!!!!!

[Grampa Dave]

Here is the forecast for Brookings. The temps are on the side of the fire fighters, but the high winds will not be:

Link to Brookings, Oregon forecast: (Weather forecast for Brookings, Or.)

[dixiechick2000]

Thanks for the update, Gramps.
I checked the KOIN 6 and KATU 2 websites. I didn't see anything at KOIN and KATU's story is pretty much the same as this one. I thought this was interesting from KATU, though.

The Florence Fire was threatening to become the largest wildfire in state history after expanding to 308,000 acres on the Siskiyou National Forest and adjoining lands in southwestern Oregon and Northern California.

The largest wildfire in Oregon was the Tillamook Fire in 1933 which burned 311,000 acres in the northwest corner of the state.

I'm off until this afternoon. See ya' soon.

[archy]

What this country really needs is a *controlled burn* in Washington.

-archy-/-

[Grampa Dave]

Gasquet California residents told to flee

Published: August 9, 2002, Crescent City Triplicate



Gusty winds pushed the Florence fire across a fire line and spread it to the trigger line which prompted the evacuation of Gasquet residents. Dixie Dies, information officer with the U.S. Forest Service, said the winds were causing some problems with the firefighting efforts. "At noon (Thursday) they were having a little trouble with the wind and difficulty flying helicopters because of it," Dies said yesterday afternoon.
The Daily Triplicate, Crescent City, California



By Kent Gray

Triplicate staff writer

Gasquet residents were ordered to leave their homes last night and head for Crescent City when the Florence Fire was suddenly aroused and began marching toward the community.

Fueled by strong dry winds, the fire jumped the fire line north of Gasquet and hit the evacuation trigger point two miles north of Gasquet – sending deputies from the Del Norte County Sheriff's Department door-to-door through the community to order the evacuation.

"The fire began moving south after picking up some smaller fuels," said Lyn Carranza of the U.S. Forest Service, a fire information official for the Florence Fire in California. "Because of the wind, some embers were landing on the trigger line and that's what the Sheriff's Department is acting on."

Captain Doug Plack said the blaze hit the trigger point at approximately 9:10 p.m.

"Sheriff (Jim) Maready said during the meetings in Gasquet that if the fire struck that trigger line we would notify the residents of the need to evacuate," Plack said. "They are being directed southbound on Highway 199 to the Crescent City area."

Although no structures were in immediate danger last night, at 10:30 p.m. Plack said the department decided to implement the evacuation as soon as possible before conditions worsened.

"The reason we are doing it tonight is because of the smoke and the nightfall," Plack said. "It's better to begin the process as early as possible rather than saying, ‘Oh, let's wait and see, and then have to move people out at 2 p.m. or 3 p.m. There is more communication available now and this way we can make sure it is an orderly process."

Plack said he hopes the department is not criticized for acting promptly, even if it is inconvenient for residents.

"People may think that we are being too cautious. I'm sorry, but we are thinking of what's best for the community and for the safety of the residents," said Plack.

Gasquet residents who were not directed by deputies last night should contact the Red Cross stationed at Crescent Elk School at 994 G Street in Crescent City if they need assistance.

The fire increased in size from 23,814 acres on Tuesday to 24,327 acres Wednesday, but until last night most of that increase was in the eastern sections.

Dixie Dies, information officer with the U.S. Forest Service, said the winds were causing some problems with the firefighting efforts.

"We are experiencing an increase in fire activity in the southeast portion," Dies said yesterday afternoon. "At noon (Thursday) they were having a little trouble with the wind and difficulty flying helicopters because of it."

---

When those strong North winds blow down over the burning inferno that used to be the Kalmiopsis Wilderness Area, that will blow ashes, embers and even live fire to the south.

This is what happened yesterday and could happen all day today. The winds are from the North and will be in the 20 to 30+ range all day.

This could spread rapidly down over these small Smith River towns and over the Smith River. Then Crescent City could be at peril.

You think that the Oregon Federal Floristry Circus has some pro fire rules, the Kali Federal Pink Panty Wearing Floristry Circus makes them look like pikers. CDF will do a good job if allowed to fight the fires.

Since this area voted for GW and against Grayout Davis in the last elections, Davis will probably just ignore the fires and hope the whole county gets burnt out. Then, rural cleansing by fire will remove a lot voters against him.

[Granof8]

Del Norte county sheriff decided to "err" on side of safety, Gasquet, CA evacuated last night. Embers falling within 2 miles of Gasquet. Highway 199 still open.

Agness, Oak Flat, Wilderness retreat still on pre-evac notice.

Zone 2 Florence fire at 308,000 acres this morning and 15% contained.

Fire has broken out of Kalmiopsis wilderness.

Weather forecast not good. Inversion holding smoke down, dampering fires now. FS spokesman compares to a wood stove. Bad news when the draft is opened.

[B4Ranch]

Bluff Fire Sparks Management Plans

08/08/2002

The fire was already racing through the dry blackberries and cottonwoods behind Sharen Kasch's home on Willamette Bluff, casting an eerie shadow that flickered across her shed.

Kasch didn't even have time to pull on shoes. She grabbed a backyard hose and sprinted to fend off the flames, cringing as snakes fleeing the heat slithered over her bare feet.

A firefighting helicopter dips water from the Willamette River as the fire burns in the background. (AP File Photo)

.

The Bluff Fire swept across the Willamette Bluff a year ago, leaving behind a moonscape of blackened earth and skeletal trees. Helicopters and 170 firefighters fought the five-alarm fire alongside homeowners such as Kasch, who organized bucket brigades and confronted the fire with garden hoses.

The city is working on a long-term plan to fight fire on the bluff with native plants and with stricter building codes. But the same tangled patches of quick-burning weeds that fueled the bluff fire still exist on a couple hundred acres in Portland, botanic supervisor Andi Curtis said.

The fire turned the purple flowers of Kasch's Butterfly Tree into black sticks and covered her furniture and carpet with ash. Firefighters used so much water on her yard that a lilac bloomed in August, three months late.

All you could see was fire, she said. We couldn't see the river, we couldn't see anything. Just flames. You couldn't get near it. It came so fast, it was just unbelievable.

City Preparing Fire Rules

Fire Marshal Jim Crawford compares Portland wildfires to floods: They seem to run in cycles that nobody can predict. The Willamette Valley is wet enough to avoid the seasonal fires of Central and Southern Oregon. But some years, the moisture drops, the wind picks up, and a spark in the weeds begins to run.

The Fire Bureau expects to release a draft proposal next week that would require more fire-resistant roofs in areas most susceptible to wildfire. The rule would apply only to new or replacement roofs. We wouldn't be going in and requiring everybody to change their roofs, Crawford said.

Thousands of Portland residents live in a wildfire hazard zone, Crawford said. Most of the West Hills are at risk of wildfire, along with Rocky and Powell buttes, Mount Scott, Oaks Bottom and the Willamette Bluff.

After the Bluff Fire, city leaders also pledged to pursue land-management rules that would require homeowners to clear away underbrush. Since then, though, they have found that environmental concerns greatly complicate such plans.

Clearing away brush might weaken hillsides and hasten erosion, adding to landslide dangers. It also could worsen pollution and run afoul of endangered-species laws. Homeowners living in environmental zones need a city permit before they can begin cutting trees.

Workers hose down a charred hillside after the fire. (KGW File Photo)

The city is at least a year away from proposing land-management rules that address fire, Crawford said.

I'm not particularly pleased about that, he said. But that's the reality of converging interests between the environment and fire management. If it were just a matter of me saying, (Clear) 30 feet,that would be easy.

Native Plantings Slow Fire

The city planted native grasses on the 23 acres of bluff scorched by last summer's fire. Neighbors thought the landscape looked like Ireland this spring, with bright wildflowers scattered through the new green grass.

The planting cost $180,000 and was covered by Union Pacific Railroad, faulted for the train's spark that started the fire.

Blackberries and other non-native weeds had choked the bluff before the fire, growing in dense clusters that would tower over an adult. Those plants, packed with combustible oils and growing close together, fueled the bluff fire, City Forester Brian McNerney said.

The city's Bureau of Environmental Services is preparing a three-year project to plant oak and madron trees and open grassland along the bluff. Part of that plan involves attacking non-native weeds with herbicide to help prevent catastrophic fires, Botanic Supervisor Andi Curtis said.

City workers spray the bluff with grass seed. (KGW File Photo)

The project will cost $60,000; the city already has a $23,000 grant for it from the U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service and Metro. The city also will need the cooperation of private landowners whose yards could be affected.

But the bluff extends for miles from the project site, from the Willamette River to Canby -- hundreds of hillside acres tangled with blackberry bushes and other noxious weeds. And Curtis estimated that at least 300 acres in Portland, and probably more, have similar clusters of fire-friendly underbrush and weeds.

The city is working to identify those places where the weeds have grown too thick and have pushed out native plants. It also is looking for the money to pay for similar re-planting efforts.

The bluff fire was really a catalyst for a more-intensive management plan, McNerney said. I think there's a greater awareness in the city now. But people need to use common sense and not get overly concerned, have a knee-jerk reaction.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------

The amazing part to this is that they seem so calm about having "at least 300 acres in Portland, “and probably more,” have similar clusters of fire-friendly underbrush and weeds." This is FIRE SEASON !!

[Grampa Dave]

Actually we need a controlled burn in all state capitols where there is a Rat enviral governor with rat enviral state legislators as well as the beltway.

Too many conservatives have this polly anna dream that if we turn everything over to the states, everything will be fine.

Well with Davis, Kitznslobber and the ChiCom Governor of Washington, these 3 scare me as much if not more than the Feds.

[Grampa Dave]

What are they doing planting Oak and Madrone on those hills.

Madrone will explode like a thermal grenade when it gets hot. Oak dries up in the summer time and will really burn.

Oh well, if the enviralistia burn up most of Portland via their agendas, that will be some beneficial urban cleaning by fire.

[Grampa Dave]

Thanks for this data and enjoy the grand kids, NaNa DCMM.

The Florence Fire was threatening to become the largest wildfire in state history after expanding to 308,000 acres on the Siskiyou National Forest and adjoining lands in southwestern Oregon and Northern California.

The largest wildfire in Oregon was the Tillamook Fire in 1933 which burned 311,000 acres in the northwest corner of the state.

With this North Wind today and tomorrow, the fire will easily exceed the Tillamook Fire's total acreage burnt, which they still talk about up in that area.

Black Oregon brought to Oregonians by the Green Jihadists who hate people.

[Grampa Dave]

Here is the Kalmiopsis Weather for today: (Link to Kalmiopsis Weather forecast for today, 8 Aug 2002)

They are predicting gusts of wind over 50 MPH for today and tomorrow. There is nothing that you can do re controlling a fire with winds that high.

If they are from the north, Agness will probably be spared for now. However, the small towns along the Smith River in Kali land could be even in more peril than they were yesterday.

If the fire heads south and jumps the Smith River, this will become a two state disaster. The further south you get in Kali, the dryer and hotter it is in August.

[Grampa Dave]

Thanks for the update. The 50 + MPH wind gusts in the former Kalmiopsis Wilderness area will open that dampener of the wood stove that used to be the Wilderness area. There is no fire screen on the chimney. The sparks and live embers will go with these gusts of wind. Winds that high can set fires miles away when hot/burning/live embers settle in unthinned trees and brush. So a few simple firelanes will not stop the fire from jumping to miles away.

You posted : Fire has broken out of Kalmiopsis wilderness.

We should now refer to it as The Former Kalmiopsis Wilderness. It is basically black and burnt by now. The roadless wilderness gift from the Watermelon Enviralists to the people of Oregon.

[EBUCK]

Head of nail....Meet hammer!!!!

EBUCK

[lobo59]

Delusional enviro-wackos have mislead people too long. Fire is an agent of destruction, not a creative force. The impact of fire is much worse than logging, human use, grazing and all of our activities which have a positive economic empact. The huge costs of these fires fall directly back on us through taxes and deficite spending. It is time to renounce these eco-terrorists and ask if they have been controlling the fires or simply spreading them to advance their pryromanical agenda of destruction.

[Grampa Dave]

Here is what I have been concerned about for a week. The communities SW and W of the Former Kalmiopsis Wilderness, now a blackened and burning inferno, are in harm's way.

This story is from the Oregonian and is talking about the beautiful Chetco River Inn and other homes up the Chetco River NEN out of Brookings:

---

Fire turns toward rural inn, homes

08/09/02

JEFF MANNING, The Oregonian

BROOKINGS -- Normally the Chetco River Inn would be packed with guests this time of year, but the antique-filled bed-and-breakfast in the rugged hills 15 miles east of Brookings is empty.


Co-owner Sandra Brugger hasn't had a paying guest in two weeks, ever since the massive Florence fire prompted officials to close the road leading to the inn and the community of Wilderness Retreat two weeks ago.

Thursday was anything but tranquil for Brugger, despite the dearth of customers, because the tread of heavy boots and the pounding of hammers reverberated through the building.

A crew of firefighters had stormed the roof of Brugger's property in an attempt to save it. They were rigging an impromptu sprinkler system to protect the inn from the stubborn, powerful blaze that Thursday pushed down the Chetco River drainage directly toward Brugger's inn.

More than 5,000 firefighters and support staff are fighting the Florence fire, which covers about 463 square miles in Southwest Oregon and northwestern California. Although favorable weather limited the fire's advance in the Agness area, east winds gusting to 40 mph and temperatures in the 90s gave the blaze new vigor in the steep hills and valleys east of Brookings. Forecasters are predicting east winds could reach 50 mph today.

Fire officials issued a 24-hour evacuation notice to the area's residents Thursday afternoon. Curry County Sheriff Kent Owen met earlier in the day with Brugger and 30 other residents of Wilderness Retreat and other nearby neighborhoods.

"Unfortunately, this thing is getting ready to blow up," said Owen. "It's been sort of idling the last few days. But with the wind change, it could go into high gear."

Leaders of the firefighting team are moving new resources to the Chetco drainage. Thursday, fire officials frantically assembled a new base camp large enough to house 1,000 firefighters on a pasture about five miles downstream from Wilderness Retreat. About 400 multicolored dome tents were set with military precision on one side of the field.

Area residents were first warned a week ago of the possibility of evacuation. Some have already moved their families out. Lonnie Reneman said he moved his wife, three children and pets to a friend's place in Brookings on Wednesday. He returned Thursday for one last effort to fireproof his house.

Like many of his neighbors, Reneman voiced confidence in the firefighters' ability to stem the fire's progress. His kids are enjoying the temporary move, he said, viewing it "as just another camping trip." Reneman is trying to remain similarly buoyant. "You've just got to deal with it," he said. "There's no use crying over milk that hasn't been spilled yet."

Others in the crowd vowed to stick it out and stay with their homes. Though falling ash sprinkled on cars as the folks met, no flames were visible, even in the distant hills, leading some residents to doubt that the situation was really all that grim. Bob Wilhite said he's been building his house for two years and is still doing some Sheetrock and tile work. "I'm not gonna pick up and leave now," he said. "These guys seem pretty good at what they do."

Owen and others urged residents to leave promptly if the evacuation order is given. With current wind conditions, the blaze can move quickly. The gusty wind has led to spot fires -- started by wind-blown embers -- nearly a mile in advance of the main fire.

Many area residents have moved out significant personal items. "We've removed some of the more important pieces of furniture," said Brugger, the innkeeper. "We are so grateful for the help," Brugger says, looking at the three yellow-clad firefighters straddling her roofline. She made homemade ice cream for the workers, some of whom have come from as far away as Yellowknife in the Northwest Territory of Canada.

If Jim Littlepage's structure protection system works, some Wilderness Retreat residents will come back to undamaged homes -- even if the fire does sweep through. Littlepage, former member of the Hillsboro Fire Department, is overseeing fire crews rigging sprinkler systems as a last-ditch method of saving structures.

Crews strung fire hose from the Chetco River up to, over and around Wilderness Retreat homes. A series of portable pumps sends river water through the hoses to the sprinklers that douse the houses and nearby land. For houses too far from the river, they'll feed the sprinklers with tanker truck water.

About 50 houses in all have been rigged with sprinklers.The houses will be wetted down a couple of hours a day, Littlepage said.

"We saved 840 residences in the Rodeo fire in Arizona using this system," he said. "I've seen houses intact even as the fire has swept right over it."

[EBUCK]

This is horrible! I hope we can learn from these fires and take the power back from the eco-naughts!!

Click on Picure

EBUCK

[Grampa Dave]

I agree totally with your reply and will repost it:

Delusional enviro-wackos have mislead people too long. Fire is an agent of destruction, not a creative force. The impact of fire is much worse than logging, human use, grazing and all of our activities which have a positive economic empact. The huge costs of these fires fall directly back on us through taxes and deficite spending. It is time to renounce these eco-terrorists and ask if they have been controlling the fires or simply spreading them to advance their pryromanical agenda of destruction.

The only thing that I would add is that most people don't realize that these uncontrolled fires are the most effective tools the Green Terrorists have for rural cleansing around these fires, during and after the fires.

In fact your statement reply is so good that it will end up on my home page. Thank you.

[Archie Bunker on steroids]

I wonder what these wackos think of their worshiped Crater lake. You can hardly see the water from the top of the crater thanks to the green Al Queda, watermelon, arsonists.

[Grampa Dave]

I can't wait to get your stickers to put them on my Bronco and give a few to a few others.

If this damn fire moves to Kali and burns a lot of that beautiful area, I will be buying more from you for our local enviral let it all burn down nazis.

The Upper Chetco River area is one of the most beautiful areas in the world only the Smith River may surpass or equal it. The lower Rogue area from the Rogue Wilderness Area down to Gold Beach is my play ground. We planned another visit this September.

Now all of these beautiful areas are in terrible peril due to these enviral nazi agendas to burn it all down. The innocent people living and working in these areas could lose their homes and pay checks or businesses before this is over.

May God Damn all of these Enviral Green Nazis! They are far more dangerous to us than the al Qaeda thugs/terrorists. There is no controlling legal authority over them. So they do things like this to innocent Americans.

[EBUCK]

My printer says today or monday they'll be done. Won't be long now!

EBUCK

[yoswif]

They're not really the Forest Service anymore. It's more like the US Dept. of Arson for Profit. Their motto is "the more trees we burn, the more green we earn".

Solution; get rid of the USFS and let local citizens manage our forests through their local school board. Congress can give us a single page of regulations subject to change by 2/3 majorities of both houses (normal size typing paper with normal spacing and print size) and we'll manage our forests in the best interests of our local economy and our local environment.

[Grampa Dave]

I cancelled a hunting trip years ago in the areas around Crater Lake. That was the dry October that eventually caused the Oakland fires in our area.

My sons met me up there. One was fishing and the other was riding his mountain bikes. The mountain biker and I went out to check for elk hunting. It was so dry and the area even then was choked with dead trees and brush. This son asked me not to hunt as it was really too dry and dangerous. So I cancelled the hunt and we just did the tourist thing in the old WPA buildings down the road going to Shady Grove.

Later that weekend we ended up with the terrible Oakland Hills fires in the Bay area.

I can imagine how bad that area is now with the Green agenda to blacken Oregon the past 10 years.

[Grampa Dave]

Sounds good. However, I would not want our pro lesbo and green jihadist school board to control our forest lands. We would be safer under Babbitt, Clintoon, and Jake Reno.

Our local Nazi eco PC/Diversity Driven Nannies are truly scary people.

[Grampa Dave]

Is the Florence Fire link site down for you too?

[Granof8]

Can't access it this morning either.

[Grampa Dave]

From the Oregonian at the Oregon Live site:


Wildfire News
A Special Report with The Oregonian
More From The Oregonian

Wildfire News
Two Oregon wildfires become one giant inferno

08/09/02

R. GREGORY NOKES

AGNESS -- Driven toward the south by strong winds, the Florence and Sour Biscuit wildfires burned Thursday as one mammoth blaze more than three times the size of the city of Portland.



Fire officials said they would henceforth consider them a single fire, called the Florence, burning 296,133 acres in both Oregon and California. Portland, a city of a half-million people, is 89,628 acres.

Southwest Oregon communities were threatened in nearly every direction: Agness on the north, the populated Illinois Valley on the east and, potentially, Brookings -- 11 miles west on the Oregon coast. Smoke has been heavy in Brookings most mornings this week.

Agness and the Illinois Valley remained under evacuation alerts: 24 hours' notice for Agness and eight hours' notice for the Illinois Valley. Fire spokesman Tom Valluzzi said the fire line protecting the Illinois Valley had passed its first significant test against strong overnight winds Wednesday.

"We're feeling better about the Illinois Valley," Valluzzi said from the eastside fire headquarters in Cave Junction.

The wind also blew the fire away from Agness at the confluence of the Rogue and Illinois rivers, about 20 miles from Gold Beach on the Oregon coast. The Curry County sheriff's office has a contingency plan to close the Rogue to popular jet boat and rafting traffic, in the event of a full evacuation, said Agness Fire Chief Bill Scherbarth.

No other fire in recent memory has closed the Rogue River to boat traffic, according to the Bureau of Land Management. The agency issues permits to 120 people a day to float the wilderness section of the river -- a four-day trip.

While the situation had improved to the east and north, concern mounted to the west that the blaze could burn along the banks of the Chetco River to Brookings, a city of 5,400 people. The fire had approached within two miles of Wilderness Retreat, a 20-home community east of Brookings, and residents there were told to be ready to evacuate.

While officials preferred no wind, they said winds out of the north Thursday were the best of a bad deal because the fire lines on the south were the most secure around the fire's 202-mile perimeter. The wind on the east side was clocked at 10 mph, gusting to 20 mph on ridgetops.

Fire officials divided the blaze into three weather zones because conditions varied greatly over the 463-square-mile fire.

Valluzzi said smoke was blowing into Redding, Calif., about 120 miles south.

[EBUCK]

Rhode Island.....1045 square miles
Kalmiopsis fire...463 square miles

And it aint done yet

EBUCK

[Granof8]

From Oregon Live

Lumber companies not hurting from fires

08/08/02

DYLAN RIVERA

Wildfires may be eating up far more than the usual amount of Oregon timber this summer, but it appears that forest products companies will avoid having their profits go up in smoke.

The Oregon Department of Forestry estimates that 83,253 acres of state and private land have burned, said Rod Nichols, spokesman for the agency.

That's about 40 times the average amount of forestland that would go up in smoke by July, but it's still not enough to change the global market price of lumber and logs.

"While this amount of wood seems like a lot, in the global international lumber and pulp market, it's not that significant," said Chris West, vice president of the American Forest Resource Council in Portland. "But in the regional situation it is very significant."

Most of the timber burning right now wouldn't have been cut soon anyway, because of federal harvesting restrictions.

The federal government owns the vast majority of forestland that has burned so far this summer. But federal lands compose only a fraction of the state's timber harvest -- about 173 million board feet of the several billion board feet cut statewide last year.

Weyerhaeuser, which became the state's largest private landowner earlier this year when it acquired Willamette Industries, now owns 1.2 million acres statewide. Almost all of it -- 1.1 million -- is closed to recreational uses and most harvesting due to fire hazards. In Washington, the company has closed 1 million of its 1.6 million acres.

"Fire closures are not unusual in the summer," spokeswoman Jackie Lang said. "The difference this year is that the closures are coming much earlier.'

Weyerhaeuser expects to harvest about 10 percent to 15 percent less from July through September than it did in the third quarter of last year, Weyerhaeuser spokesman Bruce Amundson said.

"We normally get into fire danger this time of year, but we would expect additional closures due to fire danger," Amundson said.

Weyerhaeuser, based in Federal Way, Wash., expects a drop in revenue from timber harvests because of the fires but hasn't estimated how much. The company's mills are able to get enough logs from available inventory or the open market to keep mills running as much as they need.

Timber often is salvaged and processed after fires, but there may be less incentive for salvage harvests this year.

Prices for logs used in making pulp are at historic lows, said Kay Berg, editor of Log Lines newsletter, based in Mt. Vernon, Wash. Because those logs are the most likely commercial product of harvesting in burned forests, there's less financial benefit from harvesting in those areas, she said.

"It may be a while before anybody tries to bring any of those logs onto the market," Berg said. "If you've got a lot of pulp-quality logs that nobody wants to buy, then they're going to rot on the ground."

The fires have reignited a debate over who manages their land better -- federal or private land managers.

Timber companies say that their lands are better protected from fires because they clear underbrush regularly and thin their timber stands.

A case in point was the Cache Mountain fire that threatened Central Oregon's Black Butte Ranch resort last week.

While some federally owned land near the subdivision spit large flames, threatening houses, Weyerhaeuser's 40,000 acre tree farm nearby lost only about 1,200 acres to fire, Lang said.

"The fire moved very slowly across our land because we've been thinning and harvesting this area," Lang said. "The lack of fuels slowed the fire and allowed firefighters to create fire breaks and stop the flames."

West, with the forest resource council, said that private landowners are actually suffering from the excess fuel available for fires on federal land.

"Fire prone federal land is harming private land," West said. "In many parts of Western Oregon, federal land and private land are in a checkerboard of square mile blocks."

Rex Holloway, spokesman for the U.S Forest Service, said fire danger works both ways: Some federal land is harmed by poorly managed private land.

"There are areas where we do have overstocked stands next to maybe private lands that are not," Holloway said. "But at the same time, we also know where we have just the opposite situation."

[Granof8]

"They're not really the Forest Service anymore. It's more like the US Dept. of Arson for Profit. Their motto is "the more trees we burn, the more green we earn"."

And ....
They are going for new records. Biggest fire, longest fire line. It's all a game to them.

[blackie]

Stop the attacks by the wacko, extreme left-wing, enviro-nazis terrorist's on our Freedoms !!

Freedom Is Worth Fighting For !!

Molon Labe !!

[Grampa Dave]

Now we know why Wierdhauser is one of the biggest contributors to the Green Jihadists.

This is pure Bravo Sierra:>"That's about 40 times the average amount of forestland that would go up in smoke by July, but it's still not enough to change the global market price of lumber and logs."

It ain't the global market, that Wierdhauser will be selling most of its wood products, it is the local and regional market which will be impacted.

Wierdhauser can cut less trees this quarter, next quarter and next year due to the increased demand because less will come from these burnt up forests. Then, they can raise their prices to exceed their dollar goals for these quarters and next year. So their trees will be reserved for future profits due to the decrease in supply due to these fires and their cut backs in supply. The prices will be very high if you have to build or repair something with wood this year and next year.

[EBUCK]

Yup. Glad I built my house last winter...

EBUCK

[hattend]

Rex Holloway, spokesman for the U.S Forest Service, said fire danger works both ways: Some federal land is harmed by poorly managed private land.

Key word is "Some". Hattend, FReeper, says fire danger works both ways: Most private land is harmed by poorly managed federal land.

"There are areas where we do have overstocked stands next to maybe private lands that are not," Holloway said. "But at the same time, we also know where we have just the opposite situation."

"Maybe" private lands? He pulled this attempt at deflection out of his behind.

[Granof8]

The last four miles of Gardner Ridge road and portions of Cate road up the Chetco have been put on pre-evac notice.

A grass fire five miles north of Bandon has closed Highway 101. Traffic is being rerouted over Highway 42S. Cause of fire reported to be vehicle accident.

[Grampa Dave]

Bandon has all of that terrible Gorse growing around it.

Each Gorse plant is the equivalent of a Large Molotov cocktail in flame out put.

A rancher just east of Bodega had an out break of this stuff. Then, he had a close call with a ciggie fire that came close to being a disaster last summer.

Last winter, he went out with a forest service flamethrower between storms and set every Gorse plant on fire. In spite of being soaked with rain and dew, they just blazed and burnt up. The surrounding grass/weeds and brush were so wet, that they didn't burn.

A friend that works just West of his ranch drove by in the morning and watched him setting the Gorse on fire. It was a typical damp and foggy winter day in that area. The gorse burned up.

[Granof8]

The gorse seeds will lay dormant for years. Nasty stuff to get rid of.

[Grampa Dave]

Here is some really interesting reading about the Green Jihadists love affair with fire and how natural fires like lightening fires in Wilderness Areas were great events. That the Druids welcomed this act of nature and would allow it to burn.

Remember this fire started in the former Kalmiopsis area and was a welcomed natural event, a lightening fire!

---

Wildland Fire Use for Resource Benefits

Kalmiopsis Wilderness:

"A area of wilderness....which is protected and managed so as to preserve its natural conditions and which (1) generally appears to have been affected primarily by the forces of nature, with the imprint of man's work substantially unnoticeable..." (Wilderness Act, 1964)


What is a Prescribed Natural Fire?

This term no longer represents a type of fire and has no further use other than in historical descriptions. This term is replaced by Wildland Fire Use.

What is Wildland Fire Use?
The management of naturally ignited (usually lightning) Wildland Fires to accomplish specific prestated resource management objectives in predefined geographic areas outlined in Fire Management Plans. Wildland Fire Use is not to be confused with Fire Use, which is a broader term encompassing more than just Wildland Fires.

Wildland Fire Any nonstructure fire, other than Prescribed Fire, that occurs in the wildland. This term encompasses fires previously called both wildfires and prescribed natural fires.

Fire Use The combination of wildland fire use and prescribed fire application to meet resource objectives.
Wildfire An unwanted wildland fire (this is not a seperate type of fire)

Fire Management Plan A strategic plan that defines a program to manage wildland and and prescribed fires and documents the Fire Management Program in the approved land use plan. The plan is supplemented by operational plans such as preparedness plans, preplanned dispatch plans, prescribed fire plans, and prevention plans.
Prescribed Fire Any fire ignited by management actions to meet specific objectives. A written, aproved prescribed fire plan must exist. This term replaces management ignited prescribed fire.

The specific Resource Management Objectives for the Kalmiopsis Wilderness are:


Maintain the natural ecosystems of the area and allow fire to play its role in those ecosystems.

Reduce the risks and consequences of unwanted wildfire in the Wilderness and adjacent areas.



Frequently Asked Questions

Why did you prepare a Wilderness Fire Management Plan? The Siskiyou National Forest Land Management Plan directed that Wildland Fire Use be implemented for maintaining wilderness values and required that Wilderness Fire Management Direction be developed.

What is a "Natural Fire"? A natural fire is a fire that is started by natural causes. Lightning is the most common cause.

Why is there a need for Wildland Fire Use for Resource Benefits? The objective of this management program is to use "Nature's" ignitions to further an essential ecological process. Fire is a part of the natural process of the forest, some plants and animals depend on it for their survival and regeneration. The natural forest landscape was developed with periodic fires and many species are adapted to fire.

Will fires be allowed to burn outside the Kalmiopsis Wilderness boundary? At this time fires will be confined to the Kalmiopsis Wilderness. In the future a decision considering the values outside the wilderness and the allocations in the Forest Land Management Plan may be made which will allow Wildland Fire Use, if compatible.

Won't Wildland Fire Use be dangerous for recreationists that are visiting the wilderness? No! The area where a fire is burning will be well signed and the recreationists can enjoy other parts of the wilderness without being threatened by a fire. Safe vantage points will be identified where the recreationists can view the fire and resulting ecological process.

How many fire per year do you expect there to be? Statistically the Kalmiopsis Wilderness has experienced less than one lightning fire per year during a period of fifty years. So less than one per year statistically, yet in reality lightning fires tend to come in groups. It may be possible to have more than one Wildland Fire Use for Resource Benefits. Many other factors go into the decision to declare a lightning ignition a Wildland Fire Use, such as drought conditions, distance from the wilderness boundary, available resources to manage the fire, regional and national fire situations, available funds and threat to improvements and private property.

Who pays the cost of Wildland Fire Use for Resource Benefits Management? The costs associated with this management are paid for by a mix of appropriated funds. Emergency Fire Suppression funds will not be used unless a fire is declared a wildfire (an unwanted wildland fire not designated and managed as a prescribed fire and requiring appropriate suppression action).

Will a Human-caused ignition (other than prescribed fire) always be declared an unwanted wildland fire and be extinguished? Yes! Human-caused ignitions will always be declared an unwanted wildland fire and be extinguished using the most cost-effective means than include the protection of the wilderness resource. Persons causing an ignition are liable for the costs associated with the damage and suppression costs. It is not acceptable to use a human-caused ignition as a Wildland Fire Use for Resource Benefits because of the liability issue and that human-caused ignitions are not natural and are a "trampling of the Wilderness by man".

Is this the same idea that was used for the Yellowstone fires a few years ago? No! After the Yellowstone fires, a National Task Force reviewed what was then called the Prescribed Natural Fire Policy. The result of that review decided to strengthen policies and include an analysis of all wilderness areas to decide the appropriate use of Prescribed Natural Fire. Since then, our knowledge base and tools for using natural fire have increased. The natural fire issue was analysed in the Siskiyou National Forest Land Management Plan and identified that implementing Wildland Fire Use was appropriate.

Will there be Wildland Fire Use for Resource Benefits in the other wildernesses on the Siskiyou National Forest? Yes! The Siskiyou and Red Buttes Wildernesses are being considered for Wildland Fire Use. The Rogue River National Forest has the lead responsibility for developing the plan for the Red Buttes and the Klamath National Forest has the responsibility for the Siskiyou Wilderness. The Grassy Knob and the Wild Rogue Wildernesses are not being considered at this time but will be in the future. Problems associated with the Grassy Knob and the Wild Rogue are size, adjacent management allocations and private lands threatened with the use of Wildland Fire.

How do you manage an ignition as a Wildland Fire Use for Resource Benefits? The decision to manage a natural ignition as a Wildland Fire Use is done in three seperate stages. The first considers: time of year, projected weather conditions, dollars, resource availability, risk and location. If the ignition is identified as a potential Wildland Fire Use for Resource Benefits in the first stage, a second site specific analysis considers in detail: weather, topography, seasonal condition and risk. Once the Forest Supervisor decides to manage the ignition as a Wildland Fire Use for Resource Benefits, a validation process takes place as often as needed.

Will smoke degrade the visibility in the Kalmiopsis Wilderness, a Class 1 airshed? Smoke from naturally occurring ignitions and wildland fires are exempt from the Clean Air standards. The thinking is that wildland fire is part of the ecosystem.

Will Fires be used as a management tool, for example to improve wildlife habitat, reduce natural debris buildup, provide visual variety, etc? The objective of Wildland Fire Use for Resource Benefits in wilderness is to allow natural caused fires to play their natural ecological role within the wilderness. This reduces the risk and consequences of a wildfire within or excaping from wilderness. This will produce many benefits including those mentioned in the question.

Why do you allow a fire to burn the wilderness and ruin the beauty? Wilderness is a place where the natural forces dominate the landscape and where human influence does not interfere. Natural fire, lightning, is a natural process that will define the landscape and ecological processes. It is fire that created the beauty and diversity in the first place.

Does Smokey Bear know about Wildland Fire Use for Resource Benefits? Smokey Bear has always had the message "Prevent Wildfire". What Smokey has been telling us is to prevent the human-caused fires. Nine out of 10 ignitions are Human-caused. Lightning is a type of ignition that we cannot prevent. In the wilderness, fire plays an important ecological role in sustaining healthy forest ecosystems.

---

Now, does anyone have any questions to why Grampa Dave was saying when this fire first started, "The Floristry Service was standing by outside of the Wilderness Area and letting it burn as per their directives."

Does anyone have any doubt that the Green Jihadists are more dangerous to Americans than their buddies the al Qaeda Terrorists. Archie Bunker labeled these Green Jihadists as al Qaeda tree huggers. He was right on target.

[Grampa Dave]

Would you go to this link and download this data re the Kalmiopsis Wilderness and their love affair with lightening or natural fires on your spare hard disk.

I have a feeling that this will disappear like that other data you downloaded, did indeed disappear. (Kalmiopsis Wilderness Natural Fire Agenda Plan/tactics)

Auntb, you are interested in this. This is clear and clean and without the troublesome PDF files. Please show this to your friends who are concerned about these so called natural fire agendas. I have bookmarked it on my computer for future references.

[Grampa Dave]

I off line for awhile. Please post any up dates or comments about this Green Jihadist fire that has consumed the Kalmiopsis Wilderness.

Then spend a few minutes reading about their natural fire agenda for this former wilderness area. (Link to Green Arsonists Kalmiopsis Wilderness Agenda)

Just make sure that you don't have any hammers or sharp objects near you when you read about their burning agenda:

Symbol of Green Jihadist Arsonists!

[AuntB]

You are the best!!! That wind was whipping up last night...it made it nice here and got some smoke out, but we knew those fires would just roar. I want to go up there so bad...but I'd be down with poison oak for a year!

[Grampa Dave]

One of the worse cases of poison oak I ever got in Kali was being down wind of a small fire that was burning in some oaks and a big patch of Poison Oak. I was miserable and had to get a steroid shot and a followup with oral steroids.

So what do you think of this link: (Link to the Burn Baby Burn Agenda in our wilderness areas)

This is the logo of the Green Jihadist, who believe in Rural Cleansing with "Natural Fire" Green Jehadists's Rural Cleansing Tool

[Granof8]

Were you acquainted with Mike Fitzgerald, a former Curry County Commissioner, now deceased, who attempted to educate the public about the enviro agenda?