Welcome to the California Wine Country! Home of the finest wines in the WORLD!!
Posted on 01/28/2003 5:05:12 PM PST by PierreEsbaillart
I am very shocked by the current propaganda against France and, in a minor extent, Germany and the EU, which is developing on the American web and media. As we are some "old Europe" countries, let me tell you that some elements of this propaganda remind me of the atmosphere that existed between European peoples of 1914-18 : the Frenchman is the USA's Jew, the traitor, the coward, which plants knives in the back. These are paranoid ideas. Bush has declared "you are with us or you are against us"… your enemies are "evil's axis"… A deeply thought political theory which reminds me of older simplistic speeches. Believe the experience of "old Europe", who knows a lot about the matter, and is not proud of it : your war has already begun, you're under propaganda, and rational arguments don't prevail any more.
France was on the Gulf ten years ago, when Irak invaded its neighbour, and when the coalition was covered by the UN to free Kuwait.
According to the NATO alliance, France made clear during the first hours after the 11th September that it was ready to respect its engagements if necessary.
But with the future Anglo-Saxon crusade against Bagdad, things are very different. The OTAN was a defensive alliance against the Pact of Varsovia. To be an ally of the USA doesn't mean to give its allegiance to the USA. It means, in case of aggression by another state, that solidarity becomes effective. Irak has not yet attacked anyone. NATO should have nothing to do with "preventive wars".
Can't you all simply understand this : as you are so powerful, rich, and influent, it's more courageous for France to refuse to engage in this war. There will be retaliation against France for such an attitude. To send a few planes in the Gulf and drop a few bombs, just like the UK or Italy, would have been so simple for France.
French people are not the stupid blind nationalists that your propaganda is pretending they are. French people know they have lost their weight in international politics. But they don't want to abandon their sovereignty to an other organisation than the European union. Is it so scandalous that they want to be free and independent ?
Well, it's true that "we are not with you". Because this is not a war for Irak's freedom and democracy. This is not even a war against terrorism ; this war will create thousands of new terrorists full of hate for America. A government only makes war for its own interest. This war is for the Iraki oil, and to be more independent of Saudi Arabia, the country of the 11th September terrorists, where Al Qaida money comes from. It's a war to completely change the Middle-East and so the world-wide energetic map. I find logical for the USA to defend their interests. The powerful countries have always acted like this. It's cynic and amoral, but, somehow, "natural". But stop talking about democracy, and the Good against Evil. This is not Starwars. This is not a Tolkien's story.
S. Hussein is a dictator, he has massacred and tortured. He probably owns and surely has owned chemical and biological weapons. But what about Libya, Iran, North Korea, China in Tibet, Russia in Chechnya, Israel in Palestine, etc… ? If democracy in Irak is the aim, why does it become urgent right now ? Were the Afghans free when the Talibans were installed to stabilise a country where pipe-lines had to go through ?
France is a traitor, France is isolated - isolated with the rest of the world except the OTAN. That's what your leaders need to make you believe because they don't want you to know that you have mainly a simple Anglo-Saxon coalition. OTAN : approximately 20 countries with the new eastern members - less France, Germany, and Benelux. The rest of the world : Asia, Africa, South America, the Middle East… And the rest of the world fears you but it doesn't love you.
Is it so necessary for the USA to crush all possibility of counterbalancing power ? Do they complain about the treason of an ally or the independence of one of their own "satellite countries" ? They have succeeded in being hated by the whole Moslem world - which owns the main oil reserves. Is it so enjoyable that they now need to invective and humiliate the western European countries trying to build their political union ? Do they love so much to be hated ?
To conclude, here's the dream your government is currently destroying by its politics in western Europe - it was made by an "old", "disloyal", "nationalist", "chauvinist" Frenchman (even a bit socialist, what a monster ! …) :
"Un jour viendra où vous, France, vous, Russie, vous, Angleterre, vous, Allemagne, vous toutes, nations du continent, sans perdre vos qualités distinctes et votre glorieuse individualité, vous vous fondrez étroitement dans une unité supérieure et vous constituerez la fraternité européenne, absolument comme la Bretagne, la Bourgogne, la Lorraine, l'Alsace se sont fondues dans la France […]. Un jour viendra où l'on verra ces deux groupes immenses, les Etats-Unis d'Amérique, les Etats-Unis d'Europe, placés en face l'un de l'autre, se tendant la main par-dessus les mers, échangeant leurs produits, leur commerce, leur industrie, leurs arts, leurs génies, défrichant le globe, colonisant les déserts, améliorant la création sous le regard du Créateur."
VICTOR HUGO, 1849.
(The day will come when you, France, you, Russia, you, England, you, Germany, all of you, nations of the continent, without losing your distinct qualities and your glorious individualities, you will melt closely into a superior unity and you will constitute the European brotherhood, absolutely as Brittany, Burgundy, Lorraine, Alsace have melted into France […]. The day will come when we'll see those two huge groups, the United States of America, the United States of Europe, facing each other, offering hand beyond the seas, exchanging their products, their commerce, their industry, their arts, their genius, clearing the globe, colonising the deserts, improving the creation under the look of the Creator.)
I can answer that - the French concept of work is best exemplified by Gustave Flaubert, the author of "Madame Bovary". He stated that he was afraid of learning a practical trade because if he was useful, he would be used.
Rather than being able to lounge in Paris salons and "sling the Bravo Sierra" all day.
Regards, Ivan
Welcome to the California Wine Country! Home of the finest wines in the WORLD!!
The later kings of the Merovingian dynasty were known as the "do-nothing kings." The Fifth Republic seems to have entered its Merovingian stage.
- William Shakespeare, All's Well That Ends Well
My daughter married a Frenchman last summer in SW France in the Lot vallee. We enjoyed small-town life in France immensely. People were very friendly and helpful. My daughter #3 is spending a year there now, perfecting her French.
Nonetheless, I have to say that I share a certain impatience with the French govt lately, I sincerely wonder if the government has even read UN res 1441. The burden has been clearly upon Saddam to demonstrate the manner in which his WMD were destroyed. When Blix said today, "this is not a game of 'catch-as-catch-can,'" I couldn't help but think he was speaking directly to the Elysee. Powell carefully, meticulously, crafted the language of 1441 with the active colaborration of the French. For them now to pretend they don't understand is, indeed, infuriating.
But it won't keep me from visiting France this summer, I can hardly wait!
We are not asking France to help us in any fashion. Just stay the hell out of the way while we and the Brits get the job done.
Attacked them? Heck, he just drove right in.
Backstabbing treachery is a more apt description.
Maybe Saddam will come visit too.
"I am very shocked by the current propaganda against France and, in a minor extent, Germany and the EU, which is developing on the American web and media."
What propaganda? We have quietly watched your actions and listened to your verbose excuse-making and made a decision about the state of affairs that exists between our Country and a couple of our "allies". No propaganda involved. It isnt proaganda for a mathmatician to add 1+1 and say it equals 2. That would be called "reality". Perhaps something is lost in the translation.
"Bush has declared "you are with us or you are against us"… your enemies are "evil's axis"… A deeply thought political theory"
Of course the French and Germans would've rather the President of the United States had said..."you might be with us or you might be against us...who are we to say?" Fortunately for US National Security...the President isnt that sophisticated.
"Believe the experience of "old Europe", who knows a lot about the matter, and is not proud of it."
Yet somehow continues along the path that experience would seemingly warn them against. Again, maybe something is lost in the translation.
"France was on the Gulf ten years ago, when Irak invaded its neighbour, and when the coalition was covered by the UN to free Kuwait."
Yeah so were we. And?
"According to the NATO alliance, France made clear during the first hours after the 11th September that it was ready to respect its engagements if necessary."
Again, and?
"To be an ally of the USA doesn't mean to give its allegiance to the USA."
Is there a point to be made anywhere along this thought process?
"NATO should have nothing to do with "preventive wars""
I havent heard anyone in the US call on NATO to do such a thing.
"Can't you all simply understand this : as you are so powerful, rich, and influent, it's more courageous for France to refuse to engage in this war."
Courage. That is what you want to pin on your lapel as cover for cowardice? Okay, fine....you guys are courageous. Anything else you want?
BTW: Are you starting to sense some American detachment here? Much akin to a boyfriend growing tired of his exgirlfriend's attempts for reconciliation. We've moved on.
"French people are not the stupid blind nationalists that your propaganda is pretending they are."
Eitherway...who cares?
"French people know they have lost their weight in international politics."
Good for you....who cares?
"But they don't want to abandon their sovereignty to an other organisa..."
Look we gotta go. Bye.
No, dont call.
The Nazi flag flew on the Eifel tower last century, I guess the Crescent Moon flag will fly over it this century.
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