Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

Skip to comments.

Herman Cain: For low-income families, it’ll be 9-0-9 (for those at or below the poverty level)
Hotair ^ | 10/21/2011 | Tina Korbe

Posted on 10/21/2011 1:13:18 PM PDT by SeekAndFind

Huh? After weeks of repeating 9-9-9 and, in the process, making his bold and original tax reform plan common knowledge, Herman Cain today altered his slogan:

GOP presidential candidate Herman Cain clarified his much talked-about “9-9-9″ tax plan Friday, saying those who fall at or beneath the poverty level would have a different plan: “9-0-9.”

Cain took heat over his proposal, which replaces the current tax code with a 9% corporate tax, a 9% income tax and a new 9% national sales tax. Opponents have argued the middle part of the plan would increase taxes on the poor, who currently pay little to no taxes.

But Cain fired back Friday, saying in a Detroit speech that those paying no taxes now would continue to pay zero taxes under his plan.

“If you are at or below the poverty level, your plan isn’t 9-9-9 it is 9-0-9,” Cain said. “Say amen y’all. 9-0-9.”

Presumably, no income tax for those at or below the poverty level was always a part of Cain’s plan — but that at least was not a commonly known detail of it. Perhaps his new jingle will ease the “political treacherousness” of proposing a flat tax, serving to underscore Cain’s concern for “income inequality” (despite his outspoken opposition to the Occupy Wall Street crowd). But, then, as Ed explained this morning, to propose a flat tax is less a political liability than some would have us think — and Cain’s new cry of “9-0-9″ undoes a little of the magic of the simplicity of his plan.

Cain today also explained his idea to create “opportunity zones.” Under this new element of his plan, in cities facing high unemployment, businesses could deduct a certain amount of payroll expenses (in addition to purchases) from their corporate taxes. That makes sense to me — but Cain’s entire speech this morning in Detroit (a city with the inordinately high unemployment rate of 14.4 percent) suggests 9-9-9, for all that it is emblazoned on the minds of those who have heard it, is subject to change. Political realities have always constrained its possibility (passage would be quite a feat!) — and the fearful prospect opened up by Rick Santorum at the Bloomberg debate a couple weeks ago of a new revenue stream for the federal government to exploit was never its strongest selling point — but nothing hints at its unfeasibility so much as the adjustments Cain seemed to make to it this morning. He’d like those numbers 9-9-9 to be inflexible, but, already, they aren’t. “Say amen y’all. It’s 9-0-9.” “Amen” frequently follows “forever and ever.” That’s clearly not the case here.

Update: A reader e-mailed me to say “opportunity zones” have always been a part of Cain’s plan. Formerly, they were called “empowerment zones.”


TOPICS: Business/Economy; Culture/Society; News/Current Events; Politics/Elections
KEYWORDS: 909; 999; babymamas; brother; caintrain; flashmobs; flipflopper; hermancain; inthezone; opportunityzones; taxinator; taxtrain; uncleruckus
Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first 1-2021-4041-6061-80 next last

1 posted on 10/21/2011 1:13:22 PM PDT by SeekAndFind
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | View Replies]

To: SeekAndFind

Think of the bureaucracy needed to monitor, administer, decide who gets to be, decide what the criteria is for these “zones” whose purpose will be to encourage your job to move to places like Detroit.

insane.

......

The 999/909 plan should die, just on the idea of a new federal tax monstrosity alone.

......

If Cain says he’d sign a flat tax from Congress, then he’d be the perfect candidate.


2 posted on 10/21/2011 1:21:02 PM PDT by GeronL (The Right to Life came before the Right to Happiness)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: SeekAndFind

He’s lost me. Everyone in this country should have a stake in the game, even if it’s only $10.00 a year.


3 posted on 10/21/2011 1:21:02 PM PDT by Boston Tea Party
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: SeekAndFind
Well, Cain is sure trying hard to lose my confidence in him and his capitulation.

Yes; caving to the pressure of losing the "poor" vote, he is tap-dancing. I recognize that low income makes it tough to survive, but, didn't he also say that "if you don't like being low income, look in the mirror"? (or words to that effect)

4th Generation Welfare recipients are NOT gonna vote anything but (D) anyway, and amending his ideas to patronize them by allowing them to afford themselves of existence and benefits of OTHERS is NOT a goo plan at all.

There is NO Conservative Candidate left in the race for the Republicans, for me.

4 posted on 10/21/2011 1:23:31 PM PDT by traditional1 ("Don't gotsta worry 'bout no mo'gage, don't gotsta worry 'bout no gas; Obama gonna take care o' me!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: SeekAndFind

So what happens when you start to earn a few dollars over the poverty level, do just those additional dollars get taxed, or do suddenly get a whammy of a tax on the whole thing?

And if you don’t get a whammy of a tax on the whole thing, does that mean the first poverty-level of income is exempt from the 9% for everyone?

In both cases, I do believe his impact analyses have to be changed to reflect this, no?


5 posted on 10/21/2011 1:25:19 PM PDT by 9YearLurker
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: SeekAndFind

BAD Decision.
The poor need some “skin in the game.” They need to pay their fair share.


6 posted on 10/21/2011 1:26:49 PM PDT by Little Ray (FOR the best Conservative in the Primary; AGAINST Obama in the General.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: GeronL
I think that setting everyone's deduction at the poverty level and then taxing everything else at the same flat rate would make for a fair, equitable, easy-to-administer tax.

If Cain's plan morphed into something like that I would be all for it.

7 posted on 10/21/2011 1:27:12 PM PDT by who_would_fardels_bear
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 2 | View Replies]

To: Boston Tea Party
How many people do you know who buy less than $120 worth of goods in a year? The 9% sales tax on the $120 would come to $10.80. Everyone WILL have skin in the game.

I always assumed there would be some sort of standard deduction per head on the income tax ...

8 posted on 10/21/2011 1:29:53 PM PDT by In Maryland ("If stupidity got us into this mess, why can't it get us out?" - Mark Twain)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 3 | View Replies]

To: who_would_fardels_bear

He needs to dump the sales tax and the zones.


9 posted on 10/21/2011 1:32:11 PM PDT by GeronL (The Right to Life came before the Right to Happiness)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 7 | View Replies]

To: Little Ray
"The poor need some “skin in the game.” They need to pay their fair share."

The poor pay sales taxes, property taxes (either directly or indirectly through higher rents), social security taxes, gas taxes, etc.

We are just as guilty as the left at playing with statistics. When it serves one argument to lump all taxes together we do that. When it serves another argument to focus on just one tax then we do that.

Bully for us.

Arguments we make so that our ideas sound so much better by pretending there is only one tax (the income tax):
1. The top 1% pay over 50% of the taxes
2. 50% of the people pay no tax at all

Arguments we make so that our ideas sound so much better by including all of the taxes we pay:
1. The average American works until June just to pay all of his taxes.
2. Please don't implement a new national sales taxes. We already pay too many taxes as it is.

10 posted on 10/21/2011 1:34:48 PM PDT by who_would_fardels_bear
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 6 | View Replies]

To: 9YearLurker
"So what happens when you start to earn a few dollars over the poverty level, do just those additional dollars get taxed, or do suddenly get a whammy of a tax on the whole thing?"

I don't know about Cain's plan (even he might not know for sure what his plan is) but I would let everybody (even Warren Buffett) claim the poverty level as a tax deduction and then tax everything above that at a flat rate.

That would make the most sense, and would be easy to implement.

However the envious mob will cry out "Oh no, why does Warren Buffett need a deduction? We can't give that rich bastard a deduction."

The correct response would be that with or without the deduction he will pay almost the same amount, and if he wants to be nice he can choose to not take it if he feels like being a wee bit charitable.

11 posted on 10/21/2011 1:40:05 PM PDT by who_would_fardels_bear
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 5 | View Replies]

To: SeekAndFind

Math man has added a 9. Do the math.

9,9-9,9


12 posted on 10/21/2011 1:44:03 PM PDT by ex-snook ("above all things, truth beareth away the victory")
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: SeekAndFind

You just lost me, Herman. I ain’t voting to let bums off of the hook, as usual.


13 posted on 10/21/2011 1:49:14 PM PDT by Scotsman will be Free (11C - Indirect fire, infantry - High angle hell - We will bring you, FIRE)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: SeekAndFind
"Well I said I'm trav'ling on the one after 909 I said move over honey I'm travelling on that line I said move over once, move over twice Come on baby don't be cold as ice."

Beatles "Let it Be". "One After 909". Circa 1970 album./p>

14 posted on 10/21/2011 1:54:36 PM PDT by dancusa (Socialism is a philosophy of failure, the creed of ignorance, and the gospel of envy. W. Churchill)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: SeekAndFind

Yep the first $20K is not taxed....always has been that way so why the surprise?


15 posted on 10/21/2011 1:55:33 PM PDT by chris_bdba
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Scotsman will be Free
"to let the bums of the hook"

The poor pay sales taxes, property taxes (either directly or indirectly through higher rents), social security taxes, gas taxes, etc.

We are just as guilty as the left at playing with statistics. When it serves one argument to lump all taxes together we do that. When it serves another argument to focus on just one tax then we do that.

Bully for us.

Arguments we make so that our ideas sound so much better by pretending there is only one tax (the income tax):
1. The top 1% pay over 50% of the taxes
2. 50% of the people pay no tax at all

Arguments we make so that our ideas sound so much better by including all of the taxes we pay:
1. The average American works until June just to pay all of his taxes.
2. Please don't implement a new national sales taxes. We already pay too many taxes as it is.

16 posted on 10/21/2011 1:55:39 PM PDT by who_would_fardels_bear
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 13 | View Replies]

To: dancusa
Beatles "Let it Be". "One After 909". Circa 1970 album./p>

The 'Reens did a killer cover version of that.

17 posted on 10/21/2011 1:55:54 PM PDT by dfwgator
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 14 | View Replies]

To: dancusa

I’m on the Cain Train.


18 posted on 10/21/2011 1:56:36 PM PDT by dancusa (Socialism is a philosophy of failure, the creed of ignorance, and the gospel of envy. W. Churchill)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 14 | View Replies]

To: 9YearLurker

That’s a good question, and my solution to that would be this:

fix a “poverty level” dollar amount per person. All money earned in the household above the poverty level per person will be taxed at 9%.

So, if poverty level, for example, is set at $4,000 per person, a couple with 2 children would not be taxed on the first $16,000 they bring home.

9% tax on every dollar above that amount.


19 posted on 10/21/2011 1:57:14 PM PDT by Anitius Severinus Boethius
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 5 | View Replies]

To: who_would_fardels_bear

Goody gum drops. Either everyone pays an income tax or no one. No more exemptions or in short order we end up right back where we started.


20 posted on 10/21/2011 1:59:07 PM PDT by Scotsman will be Free (11C - Indirect fire, infantry - High angle hell - We will bring you, FIRE)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 16 | View Replies]


Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first 1-2021-4041-6061-80 next last

Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.

Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson