Is Socialism's True Father - Satan?

Canada Free Press ^ | Kelly O'Connell

[Olympiad Fisherman]

Could Karl Marx and other foundational socialists, like Proudhon and Bakunin, have had a soft-spot for Lucifer? Would it even make sense to suggest anti-religious, godless persons could still salute Satan? This article is a brief investigation into whether socialism has any claim to fame as an ideology of not just atheists, but even diabolically minded people ...

[ClearCase_guy]

GK Chesterton and Hillaire Belloc (and others) promoted Distributism which is neither socialism nor capitalism but is based on Christian thinking.

I don't know enough to be either for it or against it, but I know that socialism has certainly failed and (frankly) when I look at America as we approach a truly global economy, I wonder if capitalism might also be a failure. Our workers are trying to compete with Chinese peasants who earn $5 a day and who expect no benefits and who are willing to die at 50 and live alongside polluted rivers. Under a capitalist system, American workers will not succeed against competition like that. We will simply have no jobs and/or no decent standard of living.

At the very least, Distributism is worth a look.

[Bryanw92]

>>At best, a claimant would have to prove lineage back to the original owner of said plot, and after several generations of dividing it amongst the heirs, the amount of land someone could legitimately (re)claim would end up as a token amount.

I don’t think it would have been divided amongst the heirs. They tended to give all to the firstborn son.

[Colonel Kangaroo]

Land was the major component of wealth in a pre-industrial society. The message is clear, God's ideal was that there be no perpetual rich or poor class, not that there be a forced income leveling within the fifty years.

[NoGrayZone]

No, you’re correct. They are all equally bad. I think things just happen to get worse when people start combining them.

[x]

Not so much Lucifer as Prometheus, the Titan who stole fire from Zeus and gave it to mortals.

Check out Marx's doctoral dissertation with its draft preface that closes:

Philosophy, as long as a drop of blood shall pulse in its world-subduing and absolutely free heart, will never grow tired of answering its adversaries with the cry of Epicurus:

"Not the man who denies the gods worshipped by the multitude, but he who affirms of the gods what the multitude believes about them, is truly impious."

Philosophy makes no secret of it. The confession of Prometheus:

"In simple words, I hate the pack of gods"
[Aeschylus, Prometheus Bound]

is its own confession, its own aphorism against all heavenly and earthly gods who do not acknowledge human self-consciousness as the highest divinity. It will have none other beside.

But to those poor March hares who rejoice over the apparently worsened civil position of philosophy, it responds again, as Prometheus replied to the servant of the gods, Hermes:

"Be sure of this, I would not change my state
Of evil fortune for your servitude.
Better to be the servant of this rock
Than to be faithful boy to Father Zeus."
[Ibid.]

Prometheus is the most eminent saint and martyr in the philosophical calendar.

Alinsky's dedication of Rules for Radicals to Lucifer is in the same tradition.

Whether you want to take Alinsky literally or translate Marx's Prometheus as Lucifer is something people will argue about for a long time without coming to any certain resolution.

[353FMG]

Of the total number of people murdered in the 20th century, both civilian and military, by far the largest percentage were victims of the communist/socialist ideology.

[Colonel Kangaroo]

I think a great danger to our long-term prosperity and even freedom is a tendency for capitialism to degenerate into a crony capitialism which will destroy our early American ideal of equality of opportunity. The presence of the dangers of "crony capitialism" suggests that there may be a tradeoff between the benefits of unlimited property rights and equality of opportunity.

It's hard to compete against slave labor. But long run, I have some big doubts over the ability of the Chinese to forever keep their people so under the thumb.

[PGalt]

Very interesting/informative article. Thanks for posting.

Very interesting/informative thread. Thanks to all posters.

From “The Law” Frederic Bastiat 1801-1850...

“Above all, if you wish to be strong, begin by rooting out every particle of socialism that may have crept into your legislation. This will be no light task.”

DEFUND socialist collectives, foreign and domestic.

DEPOPULATE socialists and RINOS (Republicans Implementing Nuances Of Socialism) from Congress.

http://cpc.grijalva.house.gov/index.cfm?sectionid=71&sectiontree=2,71

[JoeFromSidney]

At the very least, Distributism is worth a look.

Take a good hard look at it. It would take tyranny to establish it, and tyranny to maintain it. It doesn't just say no one should be rich, it would actively prevent anyone from becoming rich.

[jafojeffsurf]

Quick answer is YES!

Great read on Liberalism, which speaks about faith, real world, and Satan’s involvement in Liberalism. written over a century ago yet sounds just like today’s conversations in so many ways. Check out pages 86-92 for quick definitions on the Symptoms of Liberalism.

http://catholicharboroffaithandmorals.com/What%20is%20Liberalism%20New.html

[Olympiad Fisherman]

Thanks Alex,

There is no question that Calvinism provided the theological framework for progress and economic development that the west has taken for granted and distorted. Calvinism set aside both pagan hesitations and even some Catholic backwardness that kept an artificial religious order not subscribed by the Bible. Furthermore, not all of God’s blessings are heaven related.

[Olympiad Fisherman]

Read Ezekiel 28:12-17 and Isaiah 14:12-14. Is Ezekiel talking about the king of Tyre or of Satan? Is Isaiah talking about the king of Babylon or Satan? How about Genesis 3 - are we talking about the serpent or Satan?

[Olympiad Fisherman]

Thanks - yes - take a look at this particular article from Gulagbound written a few months back - http://gulagbound.com/17741/the-absurdity-of-karl-marxs-dialectical-fundamentalism/. Another good article written by the same author can be found here - http://www.theignorantfishermen.com/2010/06/secular-fundamentalism-profane-prophecy.html.

[madison10]

He is according to Bill Ayres.

[Olympiad Fisherman]

Nature’s Economy in the Old Testament

• God is Creator/Owner of Nature (Gen 1; Ps 50)
• Polytheism & Idolatry & Nature Worship were Forbidden (Ex 20:1-5; Deut 4:15-19; 2 Hos 4:12-13; Jer 2:20; Ezk 6:13)
• Nature was Made for Man to Rule, Guard & Cultivate (Gen 1:26-28; 2:15; 9:3; Ps 8)
• The World is Designed to be Filled with Population (Gen 1:26-28; 9:1)
• Animals are to be Cared for (Gen 6; Ex 23:19; Prov 27:23)
• Freedom Under the Rule of Law is Assumed (Exodus; Deuteronomy)
• The Natural World is to be Farmed & Mined for Human Development (Deut 8:1-20)
• Agricultural & Financial Blessing Based on Disciplined Obedience to God (Deut 28; Proverbs)
• Private Property is to be Protected by Redemption Rights (Lev 25:23-34; Prov 23:10-11; Deut 23:24-25)
• Mosaic Economy Extolled the Virtues of Small Business & International Trade (Proverbs 31:10-31)
• Making Wealth Provides Opportunity for Generosity (Prov 31:20)
• Diversify Portfolio Portion for your Protection (Eccl 11:2)
• Credit Economy & Debt was Frowned upon – but Not Illegal (Lev 25:1-22; 35-38; Deut 23:19-23)
• Charging Interest was Illegal for Hebrews – but not for Aliens (Ex 22:25; Deut 23:19-20)
• Aliens Living in the Promised Land are to be Treated Well (Lev 19:34)
• Hebrews were Forbidden to Develop Idolatrous Practices of the Multicultural World around them inside the Promised Land (Deut 12:1-4; 2 Kings 17:7-18; )
• Oppression was Forbidden (Deut 24:14)
• Biblical Wisdom is Better than Riches (Prov 20:15; 23:4-5)
• Being Generous to the Poor was not Government Welfare – but was Expected of Private Individuals – Poor People had to Work (Lev 19:10; 23:22; Isa 58:7-12)
• Government Welfare was Frowned upon (Num 11:1-6)
• Do not be Partial to the Poor Simply Because they are Poor (Ex 23:3)
• Poverty is an Unfortunate Fact of Life (Deut 15:1-11)
• Thorns & Thistles Result from Farming as Pollution is also a Natural By-Product of Making Wealth (Gen 3:17-19; Prov 14:4)
• The Election of Kings Invites Oppression (1 Sam 8:1-22)
• Kings are Subject to the Mosaic Law just as any other Citizen (Deut 17:14-20)
• Division of Powers Between King, Priest and Prophet was assumed (2 Sam 12:1-15; 2 Chron 26:16-23)

[Pilgrim's Progress]

“Blessed is the nation whose God is the LORD” (Psalm 33:12)

I wonder, is the LORD still the God of America? or has he been forgotten?

Does conservatism stand true to biblical truth? If not, is politics enough to save our country?

[Olympiad Fisherman]

See post 35!

[Olympiad Fisherman]

See post 35!

[Olympiad Fisherman]

See post 33 and the good articles posted there. Comte was also a progressive.

[King Moonracer]

Could Karl Marx and other foundational socialists, like Proudhon and Bakunin, have had a soft-spot for Lucifer

Karl watched most of his kids die from disease and malnutrition while he drank, smoked cigars, and plotted in a windowless tenement with his fellow imps. No devil there....