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Calling All Gun Nuts Please Help Identify This Antique Pistol.
Jaysun (vanity) | 12/23/2004 | Jaysun

Posted on 12/23/2004 9:03:18 PM PST by Jaysun

Any help that you guys can provide in identifying this little revolver would be greatly appreciated. I can provide additional pictures if anyone feels that may be helpful. Here’s what we know about the gun:

My uncle found this gun in the wall of a house that was being torn down in Waco, Texas. The house was believed to be about 50 years old at the time, which makes the pistol around 100 years old (assuming it was placed there when the house was built). Other than that, I have no other history on the gun.

It’s a 7 shot and the caliber appears to accommodate .22 short rounds. The barrel is 5.5” long. The gun is marked with a factory number 110298 on the frame at the front side of the grip. The two-piece wooden grip has the number 298 on each piece. The cylinder has the number 98 on it. The words “SCOUT MODEL” are on the top of the pistol as shown in the picture. There are no other markings. This gun feels very small in the hand; the trigger is pretty close to the grip.

It looks like it could be a Colt to me, but I can’t find an exact match. Some have speculated that it might have been issued to a Texas Ranger, but that’s just wishful thinking so far. I have a sizable number of antique guns and this is the only one we can’t identify. Thanks again for your help and comments.
-Jaysun








TOPICS: Arts/Photography; Chit/Chat; Education; History; Hobbies; Local News; Military/Veterans; Miscellaneous; Outdoors; Reference; Society; Weird Stuff
KEYWORDS: antique; bang; banglist; factorygrips; gun; loadinggrooveclue; pistol; revolver; scoutmodel
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To: Jaysun

Like I say I'm away from my text on the subject but it's a H&R clone of the IJ IMHO or a variant made earlier. Also any clean sharp edges or rounded ones could be the result of a hammer monkey refinishing it .

I'll look tomorrow evening for ya when I get home.....Stay safe !


21 posted on 12/23/2004 9:58:09 PM PST by Squantos (Be polite. Be professional. But, have a plan to kill everyone you meet. )
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To: Swordmaker
I just replied to Squantos on this same subject, so please see post 20 when you get a chance. I have an Iver Johnson that was ordered from Sears and Roebuck at the turn of the century. It's a .22 "Supershot", but as I explained to Squantos, this pistol is considerably smaller than any of the Iver Johnson's I've ever seen. It's very simplistic. For example, there is no "firing pin" in the traditional sense, it's built into the hammer on this gun. The "Scout Model" is unusual and keeps throwing me off.
22 posted on 12/23/2004 9:59:38 PM PST by Jaysun (DEMOCRATS: "We need to be more effective at fooling people.")
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To: Jaysun; Squantos

ok....scout model inscribed on topstrap.

7 shot .22 (something...short obviously)

selective DA unlike suicide specials right?


hmmmmm....I agree...not a Colt....never seen that frame on a Colt.


Flaydermans at hand....bet you've already tried that.


23 posted on 12/23/2004 10:11:41 PM PST by wardaddy (Quisiera ser un pez para tocar mi nariz en tu pecera)
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To: Swordmaker; Squantos
Here's the pistol in question next to one of my Iver Johnsons. While it isn't the exact same model as the one that you pictured, the frames and cylinders are shaped the same. Maybe this will help.


24 posted on 12/23/2004 10:16:14 PM PST by Jaysun (DEMOCRATS: "We need to be more effective at fooling people.")
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To: Jaysun

I think what you have is a Model 1900 Iver Johnson .22 Revolver built for a reseller like Sears and Roebuck or Montgomery Wards who may have specified the "Scout Model" designation. The lack of cylinder fluting is consistent with that model; the checkering on the grips is Iver Johnson's signature design for that period. Iver Johnson made minor changes in their guns almost yearly while the overall design remained basically the same.

The high serial number indicates a maker who has been around for a long time who made a lot of guns. Iver Johnson was founded in 1874 IIRC.

The three digit number is the "drawer number" used in the gun assembly shop to assure that all the matching parts for a specific gun are kept together during the manufacturing process.

Your gun is probably the 6" model... be sure to measure the barrel to the cylinder, not the frame.


25 posted on 12/23/2004 10:17:47 PM PST by Swordmaker (Tagline now open, please ring bell.)
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To: Jaysun

As ya state the 100 year old home etc and the fact one is a top break makes me think your smaller revolver is the IJ or an IJ clone from around the turn of the century......The top break IJ has all the "signatures " to suggest Iver Johnson or an H&R clone of it.....tomorrow.

Stay safe !


26 posted on 12/23/2004 10:20:42 PM PST by Squantos (Be polite. Be professional. But, have a plan to kill everyone you meet. )
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To: wardaddy
I've looked at the flaydermans guide until I'm blue in the face wardaddy. I'm at a total loss. I'm far from an expert, just like to collect old guns. You guys are much more informed in this matter than I am, so I'm sure we'll have our answer soon enough.
27 posted on 12/23/2004 10:21:02 PM PST by Jaysun (DEMOCRATS: "We need to be more effective at fooling people.")
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To: Jaysun
Here's the pistol in question next to one of my Iver Johnsons. While it isn't the exact same model as the one that you pictured, the frames and cylinders are shaped the same. Maybe this will help

Iver Johnson made both top-break and solid frame .22 revolvers. Your top-break model is not comparable. What caliber is your top-break?

28 posted on 12/23/2004 10:22:02 PM PST by Swordmaker (Tagline now open, please ring bell.)
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To: Jaysun

the fact that the wheelgun in question is not a topbreak bugs me....one is much more likely to find 100+ year old H&A, H&R, IJ, F&Ws S&W etc in topbreak.....especially in small caliber ....except Colt.

If I were in Union City TN, I'd waltz into DGW and pull up yer pic for Jamie and I bet he would know pronto....as would the folks at AntiqueGuns.com


29 posted on 12/23/2004 10:27:34 PM PST by wardaddy (Quisiera ser un pez para tocar mi nariz en tu pecera)
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To: Swordmaker
Jaysun's .22 is round barreled . The IJ 1900 is beveled.

HR, Hopkins Allen, F&W and IJ all had that same look....cheap suicide specials...most were DA only....one can buy one today for 150 bucks NIB pre-1899 on Antiqueguns.com....no JBT paperwork either.

30 posted on 12/23/2004 10:34:23 PM PST by wardaddy (Quisiera ser un pez para tocar mi nariz en tu pecera)
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To: Swordmaker
Iver Johnson made both top-break and solid frame .22 revolvers. Your top-break model is not comparable. What caliber is your top-break?
R The top-break is a .22, it's a 22 "supershot" ordered from Sears sometime around 1900. What I was attempting to point out was the portion of the frame at the bottom of the top-break pistol. It's much more square in both your picture and my top-break picture than my mystery pistol.
31 posted on 12/23/2004 10:50:44 PM PST by Jaysun (DEMOCRATS: "We need to be more effective at fooling people.")
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To: enigma825; Jaysun
Looks like a very close comparison here Jaysun at least on the factory grips....which means something ....it probably is an H&R but older and not fluted and a few other diffferences...

H/R Trapper Model

course this barrel is beveled too...hmmmm.....those are fairly unique grips it seems

wtf....I'm back to guessing again

32 posted on 12/23/2004 10:51:09 PM PST by wardaddy (Quisiera ser un pez para tocar mi nariz en tu pecera)
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To: wardaddy

Wardaddy, the 2 1/2" and 4 1/2" barreled IJ 1900s had Octogon Barrels. The 2" 4" and 6" models had round barrels. They were also available with hard rubber grips as seen in your picture or with walnut "western" style grips with the diamond checkering.

It was also available in .22, .32S&W and .38S&W. Naturally, the higher calibers required larger frames.

Although it was 30 years ago, I was a California Court system qualified expert in antique firearms and their values. I managed two gun shops.

There are several 1900s for sale with auction bids of under $60 and a couple with "buy it now" prices of around $75.


33 posted on 12/23/2004 10:53:59 PM PST by Swordmaker (Tagline now open, please ring bell.)
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To: wardaddy; Swordmaker
I think you're on the right track Swordmaker. Look at the similarities in this IJ 1900 that I found on the net. Aside from the grips and the barrel, they're identical. If indeed this was a pistol sold by Sears, the barrel and grips could have been ordered differently. That still leaves me with the "Scout Model" writing. Also, I wonder if the IJ 1900 models were marked IJ anywhere? My pistol says nothing of the manufacturer.


34 posted on 12/23/2004 10:57:56 PM PST by Jaysun (DEMOCRATS: "We need to be more effective at fooling people.")
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To: Swordmaker

You're right.

I think.


35 posted on 12/23/2004 11:04:29 PM PST by wardaddy (Quisiera ser un pez para tocar mi nariz en tu pecera)
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To: Jaysun
The thing is that the grips are numbered and match the other numbers on the gun...

Dang it, time for bed. Hey, it's Christmas Eve! Merry Christmas folks!

Here's another theory.....Perhaps this weapon is part of a limited edition special run by some obscure manufacturer. Send a pic into Guns Magazine they have folks who can ID it, be sure to send all the other info, too.

36 posted on 12/23/2004 11:14:29 PM PST by ExSoldier (Democracy is 2 wolves and a lamb voting on dinner. Liberty is a well armed lamb contesting the vote.)
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To: neverdem
". I'll guess it's a Harrington and Richardson. Merry Christmas!

I'll go along with that but the wood grips are not the originals.

37 posted on 12/23/2004 11:23:35 PM PST by blackbart.223
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To: blackbart.223
I'll go along with that but the wood grips are not the originals.

The grips are numbered and match the numbers on the frame and cylinder. Maybe it was a special order. The pictures are a bit misleading because I had just taken the grips off and didn't put them back in place very well.
38 posted on 12/23/2004 11:30:16 PM PST by Jaysun (DEMOCRATS: "We need to be more effective at fooling people.")
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To: Travis McGee

Dear Travis,
As you probably know, this is the Christmas Holy Days Season.
It is a time of gift giving... AND receiving.

It is a time when I come up with ideas of things that I want family and friends to give me, in celebration of our Lord's birth...

For that reason, Mrs. Paulson restricts my browser so I cannot view, or download pictures of.....

revolvers
semi automatic pistols
single shot antique anythings at all
nice new shot guns
hunting rifles of any caliber
either semi or single shot
links to ammo sales on line
deals on antique or current military items of any nature
including knives over three inches, bayonette or survival pieces
gun cabinets
gun racks
reloading equipment
gun safes
powder sales
primer sales


THANK YOU FOR PINGING ME TO THIS VERY CRITICAL THREAD....
The filter settings do NOT block free republic threads...
However, she WILL know, because IF I talk about any of the above, in my sleep, and I already know, that I will be the recipient of a dark dirty lump of coal instead of a nice warm pair of woolen boot socks.

Thanks Travis.
I will apparently now be receiving, my yearly LUMP of coal.
AGAIN...

rofl.


39 posted on 12/23/2004 11:35:45 PM PST by Robert_Paulson2 ("allahu akhbar..." the call to murder?)
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To: Jaysun

What caliber is the weapon? I can't tell from the photo.


40 posted on 12/23/2004 11:36:10 PM PST by blackbart.223
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