Posted on 10/21/2007 11:38:01 PM PDT by My Favorite Headache
I am going to post just a small review of my night with 23 Republicans at the Fox News Orlando Republican Presidential Debate.
Luntz was angry early on before camera's went live when he polled the group to make sure everyone there was undecided. A 21 yr old guy raised his hand and said he was supporting Ron Paul. Luntz absolutely lost it on this kid and said "Why in the hell did you not put that on your questionaire that was e-mailed to you? Why does it not shock me that a Ron Paul supporter would pull this kind of crap?"
"If someone else shows up you are being replaced and out of here...this room is for undecided."
I was originally placed in the second row towards the end of the row next to a man named Fred Hawkins Jr. who is running for Osceola County Commissioner. Luntz asked us a bunch of questions with a camera crew and producers in tow behind him and I was the first to answer. I was the first person to use the word "socialism" and it spread like wild fire.
I said the concept of America voting a socialist like Hillary Clinton as President should be motivation enough for Republicans to get their act together. I reminded Luntz of the Hillary quote saying "This is the same woman who is quoted by the San Francisco Chronicle saying "We will have to take things away for the common good." Luntz had this smirk on his face and he knew I handed him gold.
After 3 segments it was time to go live. By the time you saw what you did at home we had already gone through 3 rounds of questions and I was lighting up the joint with what I call the biggest crisis this campaign.
What do any of these men who are running for President plan on doing to combat the extreme hatred of anyone who is a Republican by the mainstream media and how bad the liberal blogs, Soros, and just about everyone who has some sort of journalistic power slimes Republicans on a daily basis. Who is going to have the spine to stand up to it and how do they plan on doing it when the Bush Administration has been knocked out time and time again with no fight.
WHO IS GOING TO PREVENT THE PERCEPTION THAT REPUBLICANS ARE NOT WAR MONGERING NAZI'S WHO ARE OUT FOR OIL COMPANIES AND THE RICH?
Luntz definitely told us through his polling and research that as of today Hillary Clinton will win in a landslide. He was putting all of his money on her. I said you are going to go broke. He said Republicans are too disorganized and the focus group proved that.
I said not it does not. I said if you want to see motivation and organization? Put Hillary Clinton against any Republican and you will see Republicans vote like you have never seen before, the alternative is too grave. Whether we can stand it or not Republicans will do everything in their power to elect anyone else but Clinton.
You saw my exchange later on saying we have long memories and do not want to live through that hell again.
The Ron Paul comment I made was simple and sweet and every single person except the Ron Paul supporter all said "perfect" with regards to that remark.
Luntz walks over and says "you are good...you are going down to the front row...keep talking."
We taped about 70 mins worth of discussion. More clips will be aired at 6:20 AM on Fox and Friends First and then 8:20 AM on Fox and Friends. Then more clips from the debate will be aired on tomorrow's Hannity and Colmes as well from 9-10.
I am sure this is when you will see how hardcore it got in there.
I called out the room at the end of it all..when I saw how many people put their hands up that Rudy was the only one who could beat Hillary I said "I am really saddened to see how many people think he is their answer. That is very telling that the fire that was there earlier tonight for all of us agreeing that we want a true Conservative is gone already and that makes me sick as a true Conservative."
To me the top winners tonight were Romney, Huckabee, Thompson, and blech...I hate to say this but Rudy. His night was not that bad but he certainly is not my top choice for President.
I called for a thining of the herd. Paul, Tancredo, and Hunter need to go. They virtually played zero in the room. It was sad because I really like Tom and Duncan and said that if a Republican wins the White House in 2008 they should all be given cabinet posts ASAP.
Except Paul...which who by the end of the night lost his one supporter...the 21 yr old guy who didn't raise his hand when asked if anyone supported him.
Finally...Luntz. A nice guy but can be insulting. When he compared a moderate conservative to a major serious conservative he wanted a show of hands...then he added "When I say major serious conservative I mean you can hear the German Nazi marching bands and get excited", I then said to him "There it is..exactly what I was talking about." Luntz said "Relax I was only joking." I said "I know you were and it is that kind of talk that I am absolutely disgusted by and sick of...sick of it Frank...enough is enough with the nazi conservative comparisons people have got to speak up for conservatives...true conservatives."
That in a short capsule is it. Met some really nice people and we had a discussion at the end of everything and went our own ways.
I thank Luntz for letting me say whatever I wanted to on camera and speak up for Conservatives and letting me call Ron Paul out on global television.
we need to focus of the Top Two of Romney and Thompson.
The Fruitles Five candidates are a waste of time and a distraction at this point.
Giuliani must be stopped as he is the Hillary Clinton in this race. Giuliani IS Hillary. Same views same positions.
The GOP primary will decide the race.
Dump the Fruitless Five.
No Giuliani, NO PROBLEM.
So did Thompson....now he’s trying to weasle out of it (CFR)....saying he made a mistake, yadda, yadda, yadda.
At the 6:20 time, the only mention Thompson got was in terms of Giuliani trashing him on the tort reform issue.
Those presented in that segment were Rudy, McCain, and Huckabee.
Thanks for your Patriotism and Enthusiasm. You represented us well...
Not if the nominee is Giuliani.
If we nominate Giuliani, then we deserve Hillary.
I, for one, will not vote for him.
Actually, that’s not true, and if Duncan was near the top you’d see the disagreements come to the surface.
The Hunter supporters are very vocal, and use very sharp instruments against those who anger them. Since he’s not gaining any traction, nobody else really wants to get pricked or stabbed.
For example, he’s not the best candidate on government spending, he’s not a Fred Thompson on federalism, he doesn’t have the executive, business, or private-citizen experience of Rudy Giuliani or Mitt Romney.
He brings more to the table than most other candidates, but he’s not 100%. Some conservatives would argue with his view of trade policy as well.
I know people have said all this before, but it doesn’t get repeated. Just like people used to occasionally mention Huckabee’s spending and immigraiton stances. But only occasionally, until suddenly he was polling well and getting serious national media. Now every thread mentions all the things that are wrong with him.
Just curious, why did you switch from Fred to Mike?
You done GREAT!
Not all conservatives saw opposing the Dubai ports deal as the “conservative” position. I personally believe our ports would be safer today if that deal had gone through, especially since the deal was for much less than what people screamed about.
We always knew Bush had a moderate view on immigration, he ran on it twice. Who would have thought THAT would be the item he’d push the hardest for, as opposed to social security privatization, where Bush was the more conservative and our “conservative” allies in the house and senate couldn’t carry the water for him, to even get it on the agendan.
Most of his judicial appointments have been top-notch. He tried to put Bolton in the UN. He’s stuck with the war when he easily could have given in. He gave us a wealth of good tax cuts that spurred the economy. He vetoed Embryonic stem cells and the expansion of SCHIPs when a good number of republicans were FOR THOSE. He’s pushed and signed the partial-birth-abortion ban, and to keep tax dollars from being spent for abortions here and abroad.
And he’s been strong with the military.
Look, for now we’ve kept the immigration bill from passing. Sure, it was hard work, but successful.
I’m not happy, but “we” also stopped Dubai and Miers.
So of the things you complained about, none of them amounted to defeat for your position.
So it sure looks like the “lesser of two evils” has been a resounding success. Gore in 2000, with his radically wrong views on Global Warming? Kerry, who attacks the troops, would have lost the Iraq war, repealed the tax cuts, and implented a host of pro-abortion policies?
Bush, the “nightmare” that he has been, is the best argument we have that the “lesser of two evils” is the RIGHT choice.
Interesting points....I notice that each and every of the complaints you have, *ALL* of them were avoided, none of them were implemented, not least of which because the 'outcry from the base and talk radio' was able to sway enough congresscritters to scurry away from them.
So if the base works hard enough, we will be able to keep enough true conservatives home that we can get Hillary elected with enough coattails that she can take a single fingernail and slit the throat of talk radio, etal.
What do you think we'll be able to do? Call in and fill her voicemail with opposition to fairness doctrine, china arms deals, pullout from middle east, nationalizing healthcare, then oil companies, etc?
Yeah, and we'll have what kind of leverage with whom? None?
Sure, if we'd had just let Kerry or Gore win, we'd have Kyoto, a solid-socialist Supreme Court , higher taxes, UN veto on the US military, all missile defense development stopped, etc etc.
Bush=Democrats is pure, unsupportable hyperbole.
On Huckabee, I almost agree with you, but I’m working on the theory now that Fred was the one the MSM pushed to split up the social conservatives, and when they worked they decided to throw another one in to make it even more split.
"What bothers me is the insistence of these dissident conservatives that they are devoted to the legacy of Ronald Reagan, who understood the truth of the old adage, "Politics is the art of the possible." In other words you get what you can and wait for a chance to get the rest of what you want.
"These people think that if they don’t get everything they want they are willing to accept nothing, but that’s not what my father stood for. My father would say if I can get 80 percent or 60 percent or 50 percent of what I’m looking for I’ll take that and I’ll go back later on for the rest of it. "
You could be correct??!! However, the primaries are in our hands. Vote early, vote often, like the democrats.
If I had started to raise my hand when he said "major serious conservative" and then finished his sentence with "german nazi marching bands" I would have punched him in the face. Forget Ann Coulter, it's THAT KIND of TALK that frightens Jews away from the GOP. Hey, a lot of us voted for Clintoon first time around because of Baker's Israel antics, so don't get started push polling with nazi references.
This is what I’ve been fighting. You want to throw Ron Paul out of the party, when on most every issue he’s been a stalwart party loyalist, and a valued vote in the House.
Worse, you want to throw all his supporters OUT OF THE PARTY. “You support Ron Paul, we don’t want your vote”.
If we keep throwing everybody out of the party that doesn’t only support our candidates, we’ll have a 20% party and a democratic super-majority.
We NEED moderate and liberal republicans, AND independents, to vote for OUR candidates in a general election to win.
We won’t get their votes if we call them names, trash them, tell them we think they are all stupid, and then show up on election day and say “nothing personal — won’t you still vote for us?”
I’ve seen REAL conservatives who have voted AGAINST real conservatives simply because of personal slights. Not rational maybe, but its HUMAN.
Attack the candidates’ position on the issues. Let’s stop telling everybody that doesn’t support OUR candidate to go to h*ll, or they will — at least, they will leave OUR heaven, and vote against us out of spite.
BTW, it’s not just you. Many others have shown particular glee running around labelling anybody who doesn’t agree with their candidate as “non-conservatives” (usually they use much more colorful language).
As I’ve said to some, keep going, and when you show up at your next “Republican convention”, you’ll have to bring the refreshments, because nobody else will be there.
I agree. Everyone likes Duncan Hunter. Isn’t he second on the FR poll right now? I was one of those people who said I like Hunter, but I should vote for someone who can win. Well he can’t win if we all have that same attitude. I was torn between Hunter and Thompson mainly because I figured Thompson would have a better chance. But I have made my final decision, my vote will be for Hunter. But he won’t win if everyone has the same “but he can’t win” attitude.
I don’t post much, but I come here to read everyday. We need to vote for someone that we can all agree on, or we will split and lose. How many people have said that they will stay home or vote third party if Rudy gets the nomination? Way too many from what I have read. How many will vote third party or stay home if Hunter or some other true conservative gets nominated? I don’t know, but I guess not too many. We need to stop thinking about who can beat Hillary and start thinking about who the best person is for the job and get behind them.
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