Posted on 01/06/2010 5:41:28 PM PST by RobinMasters
Contrary to the claims of critics of citizens who demand Barack Obama produce evidence of his presidential eligibility, newspaper birth announcements in Hawaiian newspapers in 1961 did not necessarily indicate a baby was born in the state.
As WND reported, Glenn Beck ridiculed the so-called birther movement on his nationally syndicated radio show Monday, pointing to identical birth announcements published in the Honolulu Advertiser and the Honolulu Star-Bulletin as evidence Obama was born in Hawaii and, therefore, is a natural-born citizen as required by the Constitution.
Beck, and two colleagues, mocked "birthers" for purportedly believing a wild conspiracy in which Obama's parents, knowing he would someday be president, "preemptively" collaborated with two separate newspapers to publish phony announcements stating he was born in Hawaii.
(Excerpt) Read more at wnd.com ...
It’s a complicated and confusing subject for us non-legal types. Easy to make mistakes.
The author doesn’t know what is talking about. If Obama’s mother was an American citizen, he is a “natural born” citizen no matter where he was born.
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Ding, ding, ding. WRONG!
www.obamacrimes.com has this to say:
Renewing an Indonesian Passport after the age of 18 is an affirmative act, as you are swearing allegiance to another Country. Soetoro/Obama renewed his Indonesian Passport when he traveled to Pakistan, that is why he had to stop in Indonesia first. Remember, in 1981, Dunham was divorcing Soetoro in Hawaii and was not in Indonesia. Obama/Soetoro admits to traveling to Indonesia first and then onto Pakistan. Soetoro/Obama claims in his book “Dreams from my father” that he stopped in Indonesia to visit his mother. But again, his mother was not in Indonesia, she was in Hawaii with Maya, divorcing Lolo Soetoro. In addition, the State Department has stated in response to a FOIA request that they do not have a U.S. Passport application on file for Barack H. Obama.
Despite the above however, Indonesia required Obama/Soetoro to do a bit more upon his 18th birthday. In fact the Indonesian law gives until the age of 21. Soetoro/Obama would have had to sign an Affidavit relinquishing his Indonesian citizenship and said Affidavit had to be sent to the Indonesian Government before reclaiming any U.S. citizenship he may have once held.
When it comes to the citizenship of individuals in other countries, we are prevented from interfering, Hague Convention 1930. Speaking of Indonesia, during the late 60’s all the way up until 2006 Indonesia did not allow dual citizenship. In 2006 they changed their laws to permit dual citizenship, however, Indonesia has had its battles with enforcing their new law permitting dual citizenship.
With this said, from the research we have done, it appears that Soetoro became an Indonesian citizen. When Soetoro/Obama was approximately four (4) years old his parents divorced and thereafter, Soetoro/Obama’s mother, Stanley Ann Dunham, married Lolo Soetoro, a citizen of Indonesia. Evidence points to the fact that Lolo Soetoro either signed a government form legally “acknowledging” Soetoro/Obama as his son or “adopted” Soetoro, either of which changed any citizenship status Soetoro/Obama had to a “natural” citizen of Indonesia.
At the time Barry Soetoro was in Indonesia, all Indonesian students were required to carry government identity cards or Karty Tanda Pendudaks, as well as family card identification called a Kartu Keluarga. The Kartu Keluarga is a family card which bears the legal names and citizenship status of all family members.
Soetoro/Obama was registered in a public school as an Indonesian citizen by the name of Barry Soetoro and his father was listed as Lolo Soetoro, M.A. Indonesia did not allow foreign students to attend their public schools in the late 1960’s or 1970’s, and any time a child was registered for a public school, the child’s name and citizenship status were verified through the Indonesian Government. See Constitution of Republic of Indonesia (Undang-Undang Dasar Republik Indonesia 1945), Chapter 13, Law No. 62 of 1958 (all citizens of Indonesia have a right to education). The Indonesian school record, indicates that Soetoro/Obama’s name is “Barry Soetoro;” his nationality is “Indonesia” and his father “Lolo Soetoro, M.A. There was no way for Soetoro/Obama to have attended school in Jakarta, Indonesia legally unless he was an Indonesian citizen, as Indonesia was under tight rule and was a Police State. See Constitution of Republic of Indonesia (Undang-Undang Dasar Republik Indonesia 1945), Law No. 62 of 1958. These facts indicate that Obama/Soetoro is an Indonesian citizen, and therefore he is not eligible to be President of the United States.
Under Indonesian law, when a male acknowledges a child as his son, it deems the son, in this case Soetoro/Obama, an Indonesian State citizen. See Constitution of Republic of Indonesia, Law No. 62 of 1958 concerning Immigration Affairs and Indonesian Civil Code (Kitab Undang-undang Hukum Perdata) (KUHPer) (Burgerlijk Wetboek voor Indonesie).
Furthermore, under the Indonesian adoption law, once an Indonesian citizen adopts a child, the adoption severs the child’s relationship to the birth parents, and the adopted child is given the same status as a natural child and the child takes the name of his step-father, in this case, Soetoro. See Indonesian Constitution, Article 2.
The Indonesian citizenship law was designed to prevent apatride (stateless) or bipatride (dual) citizenship. Indonesian regulations recognized neither apatride nor bipatride (stateless or dual) citizenship. Since Indonesia did not allow dual citizenship; neither did the United States (since the United States only permitted dual citizenship when ‘both’ countries agree); and since Obama/Soetoro was a “natural” citizen of Indonesia, the United States would not step in or interfere with the laws of Indonesia. Hague Convention of 1930.
As a result of Soetoro/Obama’s Indonesian “natural” citizenship status, Soetoro/Obama could never regain U.S. “natural born” status, if he in fact he ever held such, which we doubt. Soetoro/Obama could have only become “naturalized” if the proper paperwork were filed with the U.S. State Department, after going through U.S. Immigration upon his return to the United States; in which case, Soetoro/Obama would have received a Certification of Citizenship indicating “naturalized.”
We are informed, believe and thereon allege Obama/Soetoro was never naturalized in the United States after his return. Soetoro/Obama was ten (10) years old when he returned to Hawaii to live with his grandparents. Soetoro/Obama’s mother did not return with him. Therefore, it appears that she did not apply for citizenship for Soetoro/Obama in the United States. If citizenship for Soetoro/Obama had been applied for in 1971, Soetoro/Obama would have a Certification of Citizenship. If Soetoro/Obama returned in 1971 to Hawaii without going through U.S. Immigration, today he would be an “illegal alien” – and obviously not able to serve as President, but also his term as a United States Senator from Illinois for nearly four (4) years was illegal. We further believe Soetoro might have reentered the United States at age ten (10) by showing a copy of his Hawaiian Certification of Live Birth, which he received when his birth was registered in Hawaii.
In addition, we have been unable to locate any legal documents wherein Soetoro’s name was legally changed from Barry Soetoro to Barack Hussein Obama. Soetoro/Obama’s silence on these issues is deafening and his refusal to release such records to prove that none of this occurred results in his status as Acting Commander in Chief at best, and a willful action on his part to deceive the American People and the Armed Forces of the United States so that he may wield power that is in non-compliance with the United States Constitution.
I know. Somewhere I had heard that the Man’s citizenship is what is transferred to the baby. I had also heard that the wife’s citizenship was determined by the husband. Turns out this is not completely true. The baby part is, but the wife part isn’t.
Nope. To be a natural born citizen of any country you need two parents that are citizens of that country. Obamas father was Kenyan and a British subject.
Obama may be a citizen but he is not NBC. The only time natural born citizen is mentioned for elective office is the qualifications for Pres and V Pres.
For ANY other office one only needs to be a citizen ala Ahnold.
My question was to another poster that believes that he is a Natural Born Citizen even though his father was never a US citizen.
So I want to know if the sexes were reversed would he still have the same opinion on this issue.
You’ve made an important point: we don’t know much of anything about Obama’s background or his family. Almost everything we’ve been told is his story — and we know how honest and straightforward The One is, don’t we? Open and transparent, eh?
Other than some evidence that Stanley Ann and the child were in Washington state in the late summer/fall of 1961, there are no known witnesses or evidence as to her whereabouts from the fall of 1960 until she returned to Hawaii with a child in 1962.
No evidence of a pregnancy, or a birth. No reason, other than his word, that Obama was born in August, 1961. No evidence that the parents were legally married or that Obama Sr. is the boy’s biological father.
Nothing.
Throw out everything you’ve been told or read. List only those facts that can be backed up with evidence.
There’s not much there. What is there, the stray document or picture, often contradicts the story he’s told us or raises more questions. Lots of inconsistencies.
It’s a tantalizing and frustrating puzzle, and I, as a patriotic American, resent it. This guy has gone to great lengths to hide his past from us, and that is wrong.
Wrong — and likely to backfire one of these days. There are too many people looking, and too many loose ends, and someone, somewhere, who knows.
I think you are the stupid nut!
Oh were Ben Ladens's children (didn't know he had any) born in the US? If so they may run but good luck on being elected.
Not so Captain. I have a COLB (Certificate of Live Birth) just like Prez 0bama. Mine was issued at the US Consulate in Frankfurt, Germany. I can assure you I wasn't born at the Consulate. I was born at a military hospital in Germany, and I have the US Army paperwork to prove it. However, under the Status of Forces Agreement in NATO countries my real/true birth certificate is German. I was born on German soil, therefore my registered birth certificate is German.
Now, for the second part of your statement. Because I was born in a country that recognizes dual-citizenship, before I could enlist in the USAF I had to get a Social Security number, to get that I had to declare allegiance to one country or the other (USA/Germany). The only way for me to declare allegiance to the USA was to go through INS and apply for citizenship. Yep, both my parent were born in the US (WI & IN). Yes, my father was active duty stationed in Germany at that time. And finally, yes I do have a US Certificate of Citizenship (and I know what a nightmare it is to get one.)
While I was active duty (recently retired) I ran into more than five other servicemember, former GI brats like myself, who also went through the same mess.
So, bottom line is that this COLB with Barrack Obama's name on it doesn't mean a darn thing to me, I want to see the registered birth certificate.
- Traveler
So the folks in Kenya were estatic about his birth..... but we conclude this is false. So the folks in Honolulu have still not stepped forward to exclaim they were there and even helped in the ward he escaped from
I studied the whole birther thing for a while.
For me the newspaper birth announcement was a major stumbling block.
On the other hand, Obama spent a million or two fighting the release of his birth certificate.
My guess is there is something else to hide other than where he was born.
Jedidah said: It’s a complicated and confusing subject for us non-legal types. Easy to make mistakes.
So you are saying that you are a legal expert? Then explain this, why was it before the 1922 marriage act, women followed the condition/citizenship of the male aka father, then husband?
What happened is that this act of 1922 left American women who married foreigners in a precarious situation as they were now considered foreigners themselves, thus in 2 later congressional acts, it was changed and thus the dual citizen was born per the courts, but it was never recognized or made law by any statute passed by Congress. Here’s the historical breakdown of US citizenship from our country’s founding.
http://constitutionallyspeaking.wordpress.com/2009/07/25/bringing-the-constitution-into-the-21st-century/
I said “us non-legal types.”
You can conclude anything that you like. A President has to be NBC to qualify and Obama is not Constitutionally eligible.
Do you still stand behind your comments of which you had no legal basis to make? Do you wish to correct your mistake or have you legislation i have yet to uncover that refutes my findings?
You see I have compiled much more since I originally posted that article in July and as of yet, not one Obama supporter has been able to refute my evidence.
Also, I do not educate on mere hearsay. I actually study & educate myself before writing & speaking, something more should be doing before their erroneous comments are forever archived in the ‘Internet’.
Patlin —
I am confused. You seem to think that you have some argument with me, and I truly don’t know what you’re talking about.
Do you think I’m an Obama supporter?
I read the link in your e-mail and found it very interesting. After reading it, I feel sure that we are on the same side.
If you have a bone to pick with me, you’re going to have to be more specific, because I don’t understand.
Shhh, you’re interrupting the obamanoids while their protecting admin Mod is monitoring FR. They have only a limited amount of protected time each day. She doesn’t work round the clock.
ping!
http://constitutionallyspeaking.wordpress.com/a-congressional-natural-born-citizen-parts-i-ii-iii/
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