You figure that Jews were in China at that time? 
Posted on 08/04/2002 3:00:50 PM PDT by blam
Christian Designs Found in Tomb Stones of Eastern Han Dynasty
[2002-08-02] Studies show that as early as 86 A.D., or the third year under the reign of "Yuanhe" of Eastern Han, Dynasty Christianity entered into China, 550 years earlier than the world accepted time.
When studying a batch of stone carvings of Eastern Han Dynasty (25-220 A.D.) stored and exhibited in the Museum of Xuzhou Han Stone Carvings, Christian theology professor Wang Weifan was greatly surprised by some stone engravings demonstrating the Bible stories and designs of early Christian times.
Further studies showed that some of these engravings were made in 86 A.D., or the third year under the reign of "Yuanhe" of Eastern Han Dynasty, 550 years earlier than the world accepted time of Christianity's entrance into China.
The 74-year-old professor, who is also a standing member of the China Christian Council, showed reporter a pile of photos of Han stone carvings and bronze basins taken by him. He also compared the designs on them with that of the Bible, composed of fish, birds, and animals demonstrating how God created the earth.
Designs on these ancient stones displayed the artistic style of early Christian times found in Iraq and Middle East area while bearing the characteristics of China's Eastern Han times.
The stone carvings, being important funeral objects, are mainly found in four cities, and Xuzhou is one of them. It is reported that by now more than 20 intact Han tombs have been found, from which nearly 500 pieces of engraved stones were discovered.
It is globally accepted that Christianity was first carried into China by a Syrian missionary Alopen in 635 A.D. the ninth year under the reign of "Zhenguan" of the Tang Dynasty (618-907 A.D.).
Some experts once raised doubts that Christianity may have entered China in an early time as the Eastern Han, but lack evidence. Nevertheless, professor Wang's discovery serves to strongly back up the theory and the earlier works of his own. By PD Online Staff Member Li Heng [From: CL2000.com]
I found that study interesting also. (I am still suspicious of DNA studies though)
There were no Jews ~3200 years ago. Another attempt to co-opt history?
(For a much needed history lesson, please take 3 minutes and study the 3-MINUTE HISTORY at my LostTribe Profile. At least it will help you get some dates and definitions straight.)
There were several long and interesting threads here on FR last year (before you joined us) regarding the apparent fraud which was an integral part of several such DNA "studies". The techniques, objectivity and alleged "results" were roundly denounced by world-class DNA scientists.
The common thread which seemed to hlld these "studies" together was the consistant "proving" of what the financial sponsors set out to prove, without regard to scientific integrity.
The Mormons have been around longer than the Jews in your world?
(I have nothing against Mormons, just idiots)
OK, lets do the math. Since Mormonism began ~1830AD or so (I'm told), 1830AD minus 3000 years equals ~1170BC or so (ignoring any numbering probems involved in crossing the year of our Lord 0.) So you must be referring to the year 1,170 BC. (Check my numbers, please. It's getting late.)
Then I said: There were no Jews ~3200 years ago. Another attempt to co-opt history?
In the year 1170 Before Christ the Israelites had returned from vacation in Egypt and were back "home" having a good time disobeying God. They were not Jewish of course. There were no Jews in Egypt either, only Israelites. Moses was not a Jew, but an Israelite.
In 1170 BC the Kingdom of David was still ~170 years away. David was of course not a Jew. There were no Jews in 1,000BC, only Israelites.
After Davids Israelite Kingdom collapsed ~922BC, with nary a Jew in sight, these fueding Israelites split the sheets and formed separate Northern and Southern Kingdoms. No mixture of people would be identified as "Jews" for another 400 years, after the remnant of the Southern Kingdom returned from Babylon.
Well, I could go on with the story, but it's all in the 3-MINUTE HISTORY at my LostTribe Profile, so why don't you mosey on over there and get the rest of story.
Bottom line, (and I won't call you a liar like as you earlier implied about me), you have simply confused the arithmetic. I'm sure it was not another attempt on your part to co-opt history.
Then you sweetly said:
>The Mormons have been around longer than the Jews in your world?
which seems to add nothing but confusion.
>(I have nothing against Mormons, just idiots)
Oh, well. For a good look at a self-made one, check your mirror.
Love and Kisses,
-LT
Very interesting. Thanks for the heads up.
Thank God I can still trust my Glock.
Ha! I hear you.
You figure that Jews were in China at that time?
Where are you seeing the 500 pieces of Han carvings? I clicked on the article source and only saw one. Could the other 499 have such symbols?
Wasn't the New Testament written in Greek, as opposed to Hebrew for the Old Testament? If so, can you identify the word that was translated to "gentile" by James? I'd do it but I don't have access to a Strong's.
Is "goy" a Hebrew word, a Yiddish word, and if Yiddish, was the source Hebrew/Aramaic or some other root, like Germanic? Lots of different roots make up Yiddish.
I think the important part was to "go unto the Lost Sheep of The House of Israel", which of course must be the descendents of the House of Israel.
Perhaps they could, but it would seem to me that, if there was anything specifically about Jesus, that fact would have been prominently mentioned. Since it is not mentioned, I think it is a reasonable assumption that it is not there.
I suppose it is as likely that there were Jews as that there were Christians in the area. It is possible that the Chinese encountered Jewish traders on the Silk Road.
From my youth, I remember reading an article on the front page of the newspaper in Plansk (a Polish shtetl), headlined: "Revolution in China: Good for the Jews."
In light of this new evidence, perhaps I should have taken that headline more literally.
Since story appears in the China Art News I'd suspect they picked the sample included, instead of Prof. Weifan. I would doubt that much of the staff are over-zealous about anything Christian. The Art News may need to publish the find but certainly don't need to publish evidence of the conclusions.
Yes, but Jesus spoke in Aramaic (a language related to Hebrew), not Greek. He would not have said "gentile." The word Jews use that is translated as gentile is "goy," which refers to the nations descended from Noah, as listed in Genesis.
Is "goy" a Hebrew word, a Yiddish word, and if Yiddish, was the source Hebrew/Aramaic or some other root, like Germanic? Lots of different roots make up Yiddish.
Yiddish is not the source of anything. Yiddish is a Germanic language which Jews began to use in Eastern Europe in medieval times. It includes many Hebrew words, one of which is goy. The word goy is Hebrew and it appears in the Hebrew text of the Old Testament.
I think the important part was to "go unto the Lost Sheep of The House of Israel", which of course must be the descendents of the House of Israel.
It could mean that. It could also mean those who have lost faith.
As I stated in another thread, this is meaningless. The word Jew is an English word that came into existence hundreds of years after the fact. In the Hebrew language, there is no distinction between Jews and members of the Tribe of Judah. In the Hebrew language, the "Jews" (Yehudim) came into existence with the birth of Judah, the son of Jacob.
When I interrogate Strong's about the source of "gentile" in Matthew 10:5,6 it gives me this:
HEBREW:
01484 gowr {gore} or (fem.) gorah {go-raw'}
a variation of 01482; TWOT - 331a; n m
AV - whelp 2; 2
1) whelp
Strongs lists two references to the root Hebrew word for "gentile":
Jer 51:38 They shall roar [07580] (8799) together [03162] like lions [03715]: they shall yell [05286] (8804) as lions [0738]' whelps [01484].
Nah 2:12 The lion [0738] did tear in pieces [02963] (8802) enough [01767] for his whelps [01484], and strangled [02614] (8764) for his lionesses [03833], and filled [04390] (8762) his holes [02356] with prey [02964], and his dens [04585] with ravin [02966].
GREEK:
1484 ethnos {eth'-nos}
probably from 1486; TDNT - 2:364,201; n n
AV - Gentiles 93, nation 64, heathen 5, people 2; 164
1) a multitude (whether of men or of beasts) associated or living together
1a) a company, troop, swarm
2) a multitude of individuals of the same nature or genus
2a) the human family
3) a tribe, nation, people group
4) in the OT, foreign nations not worshipping the true God, pagans,Gentiles
5) Paul uses the term for Gentile Christians
Strongs lists 164 references to the root Greek word for "gentile", Matthew 10:5,6 included. I don't see any references to the root being "not being descended from Noah". But, in any case, not being descended from Noah wouldn't mean much, would it? All the Semites, including Jacob were descended from Shem which includes all those who claim the covenant of Abraham. Noah had two other sons, Ham and Japheth, whose descendents don't claim that covenant.
It could mean that. It could also mean those who have lost faith.
I guess "go unto the Lost Sheep of The House of Israel", could mean that, if one were to ignore the plain wording. There was the House of Judah, which was there, in the area, and the House of Israel, which was dispersed by the Assyrians.
All were Israelites. It seems to take quite a bit of labor to interpret it the way you suggest, and very little to interpret it as refering to the lost House of Israel.
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