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Outrage as Iraq views UK arms
observer.co.uk ^ | October 13, 2002 | Jason Burke, chief reporter

Posted on 10/13/2002 8:12:17 AM PDT by icantbleaveit

Outrage as Iraq views UK arms

Peace campaigners angered as Saddam's top brass
'rub shoulders' with British firms at weapons bazaar

Jason Burke, chief reporter
Sunday October 13, 2002
The Observer

A British Minister will lead a major sales drive by UK weapons
and military technology firms at an exhibition attended by
high-ranking Iraqi military officials this week.

The news has sparked outrage among arms control
campaigners and groups opposed to military action against Iraq.
'It is absurd that we are gearing up to fight a war against these
people and simultaneously rubbing shoulders with them at an
arms bazaar,' said Martin Hogbin of the Campaign Against Arms
Trade.

Around a dozen British firms will be displaying equipment such
as tanks, thermal imaging night sights and state-of-the-art air
defence missiles at the exhibition in Amman, Jordan. Machine
tools that could be used to produce weapons will also be on
show. The government-run Defence Export Services
Organisation will also have a stall.

Promotional material for the Sofex military fair boasts that
Saddam Hussein is sending an official delegation. Sultan
Hashim Ahmad, the Iraqi Defence Minister, attended the last
Sofex. Sudan, Syria, Libya and Iran - all listed as sponsors of
terrorism by the US State Department - are also expected to
attend.

'It's an appalling example of double standards. Where there is a
buck to be made, we're there,' said Andrew Bergen, spokesman
for the Stop the War Coalition, which campaigns against military
action against Iraq.

In the Eighties the UK and US supplied Iraq with millions of
pounds' worth of military equipment. Baghdad used British
companies to procure 'dual-use' machine tools to make
ammunition. Even though the UK had imposed an embargo on
'lethal equipment', the Conservative Government let the sales
proceed.

The Ministry of Defence confirmed last week that Lord Bach, the
Defence Procurement Minister, would be attending the fair.
'Sofex allows the UK defence industry to demonstrate its
product range to a number of potential overseas customers very
effectively,' said an MoD spokesman.

There is no suggestion that the British firms are doing anything
wrong. 'We exhibit there. The Government decides what we can
sell to whom,' said a spokesman for the American military
aviation giant Lockheed Martin, whose British arm is attending
the fair. Lockheed Martin makes the Longbow 'fire-and-forget'
and the Hellfire 2 anti-tank missiles. Both would be expected to
play a key role in any attack on Iraq.

Some senior industry figures, however, have expressed surprise
at the British presence. 'Are we there to show the Iraqis what we
are about to drop on them?' one asked. Exhibition organisers list
Raytheon, the American company which makes the long-range
Cruise missiles that experts predict would spearhead any US
bombardment of Iraq, among companies at the fair. Vickers, the
UK arms company which makes the Challenger, the Army's
main battle tank, will also be exhibiting.

Sales by British firms are carefully vetted, but other nations are
less rigorous. The Russian state arms export corporation,
Rosoboronexport, which will be at Sofex, provided Robert
Mugabe's regime in Zimbabwe with 21,000 AK-47s and eight
attack helicopters.

A Romanian firm which offered banned anti-personnel mines for
sale at an arms fair in the UK three years ago, will exhibit, as
well as Vazovski, a Bulgarian company, which makes grenade
launchers, missile and anti-aircraft systems. Vazovski small
arms were shipped to Unita rebels with false 'end-user'
certificates in the late Nineties.

Britain has always had a tradition of military co-operation with
Jordan and the strong representation of UK companies at the fair
is being seen as an expression of support for the government of
King Abdullah. The Jordanian economy benefits hugely from
trade with Iraq. Any military operations will have a massive
impact in the kingdom.

The Middle East has long been a good market for British
weapons firms. According to recent Foreign Office figures, the
UK licensed arms exports worth £1.4 billion to the Middle East
and North Africa between January 1999 and December 2001.


TOPICS: Breaking News; Editorial; Foreign Affairs; Government; News/Current Events; United Kingdom
KEYWORDS:
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To: Demidog
You're buying all kinds of leftwing propaganda...that's why I said you are 'siding with the left'. Kinda self-explanatory. We occupy Afghanistan and it is for the purpose of getting a gas pipeline built into the Caspian sea.

You really believe that? Unreal.

161 posted on 10/13/2002 9:15:54 PM PDT by EternalVigilance
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To: COB1
What I'm trying to bring to the general debate is the fact that our intelligence gathering departments know a helluva lot more about what is going on that we do, and that's the way it should be.

When Reagan bombed Libya, he went so far as to burn his own intelligence in order to show to the American people that the attack was justified. He showed the cards. The reason Bush and the State department aren't showing their cards is because they have no cards.

162 posted on 10/13/2002 9:16:10 PM PDT by Demidog
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To: EternalVigilance
You really believe that?

It's not a matter of belief. Belief requires no evidence. The FACT is that the US has new bases in Afghanistan, Turkmenestan, Pakistan and Uzbekistan.

The action in Afghanistan was leaked 4 months before 9/11 even occurred. These are actual facts. You don't have to believe them and I don't care if you do because I know them to be true.

163 posted on 10/13/2002 9:21:14 PM PDT by Demidog
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To: Demidog
The action in Afghanistan was leaked 4 months before 9/11 even occurred. These are actual facts. You don't have to believe them and I don't care if you do because I know them to be true.

And you accuse me of acting on blind belief? LOL...Wow!

164 posted on 10/13/2002 9:26:41 PM PDT by EternalVigilance
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To: Beenliedto
WHO in power, to use your words, is going to benefit? Prove to me how President Bush will MAKE MONEY? I am so tired of people like you flinging baseless accusations around about President Bush. What you and others like you intend to do, is elect another Democrat as President. I don't want another Clinton. I don't want another Democrat as anything. Take your third party politics and, well, enough already. :)
165 posted on 10/13/2002 9:29:02 PM PDT by Letitring
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To: EternalVigilance
And you accuse me of acting on blind belief?

Yes. You can't substantiate a single claim. Do you dispute that the US has new bases along the pipeline route?

166 posted on 10/13/2002 9:32:23 PM PDT by Demidog
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To: Demidog
You substantiate the belief that we were ready to go into Afganistan before 9-11 to establish a gas pipeline, and then I will explain to you how those bases you describe were obtained AFTER 9-11, to support the war in Afghanistan.
167 posted on 10/13/2002 9:36:31 PM PDT by EternalVigilance
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To: Letitring
WHO in power, to use your words, is going to benefit?

Both Bush and Cheney have major interests in energy companies. Enron and other major companies loaned the Bush campaign the use of their aircraft during the Florida fight. They donated alot of money to the Bush campaign otherwise.

You've heard of political payback haven't you? The reward occurs after the administration leaves office. Always does. Look at how many ex-Senators and Congressman are lobbyists for industries that courted them while they held office. Furthermore, in this case, the Caspian pipeline was a pipe-dream for all intents and purposes due to the instability in the region, namely Afghanistan. While I would never claim that 9/11 was staged in order to facilitate the Afghanistan nation-building occurring now, it is quite obvious that the results are favorable to those who thought the pipeline all but impossible.

In fact, I don't think the administration would stage such an event given their obvious belief that the American public will fall for outright lies as justification for going to war with Iraq.

In fact, the action in Afghanistan was already planned prior to the events of 9/11. The press in India had reported that Afghanistan was to be invaded as early as July of 2001.

9/11 simply saved the administration some lame excuses to draw from. As it was, there still wasn't any justification for invading Afghanistan (Al Quaeda is NOT Afghanistan nor is Afghanistan Al Quaeda).

168 posted on 10/13/2002 9:41:21 PM PDT by Demidog
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To: Demidog
My God, where do you people come from? Don't answer that. I really don't want to know. No, I don't know that Enron contributed any MORE money to the Republicans than they did to the Democrats. Do you? If so, prove it. Post facts and figures, please. I do know it cost Dick Cheney TONS of money to run for office. He SOLD more stock and options than most of us will ever see, just to avoid a conflict of interest. I do know the Bush administration refused to bail out Enron, inspite of CLINTON's people (citigroup) asking it be done. I do know Clinton's people are in stock fraud, insider trading, stock manipulation, up to their anti-American necks. I do know the people who vote against our own oil exploration are mostly Democrats. Some of the SAME Democrats who recently visited IRAQ, and slammed America while there. What stock in energy companies do Bush and Cheney own? Provide source, please.
169 posted on 10/13/2002 9:50:05 PM PDT by Letitring
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To: EternalVigilance
You substantiate the belief that we were ready to go into Afganistan before 9-11 to establish a gas pipeline

So then you concede that there are bases all along the pipeline route even in nations where there have been no terrorist camps which target the US.

Good.

Read this.

http://www.indiareacts.com/archivefeatures/nat2.asp?recno=10∓ctg=policy

This article was published June 26th 2001.

http://www.janes.com/security/international_security/news/jir/jir010315_1_n.shtml

This one in March of 2001.

Janes is pretty reliable I'd say. You can knock them if you'd like but you probably wouldn't have any takers.

I will explain to you how those bases you describe were obtained AFTER 9-11, to support the war in Afghanistan.

Some built by the bin Laden construction company. At any rate, we were performing joint excercises in Uzbekistan and Kazakhstan in 1997 and 1998. Interestingly enough this coincided with the acquisition of oil and gas contracts by US companies.

I don't think I've laid this all at Bush's feet. He's merely continuing plans that were started back in his father's administration (if not before then) continued during the Clinton administration and perhaps now completed under his administration. This isn't some evil plan hatched by Bush. It's the continuation of an interventionist policy that doesn't serve the interests of the American people but does serve the interests of some big oil companies who've managed to negotiate contracts with countries in a very unstable region.

170 posted on 10/13/2002 9:56:45 PM PDT by Demidog
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To: Letitring
What stock in energy companies do Bush and Cheney own? Provide source, please.

You apparently haven't watched the news. Cheney sold his shares before declaring I believe. And the FEC keeps the details of campaign donations. It's documented fact that Lay and Enron were big contributers.

171 posted on 10/13/2002 10:00:10 PM PDT by Demidog
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To: Demidog
Just produce the facts then, okay? I'm tired. I'll argue with you tomorrow. Goodnight.
172 posted on 10/13/2002 10:07:30 PM PDT by Letitring
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To: Demidog
Enron contributed to both democrats and republicans. This isn't over. We will talk tomorrow. :)
173 posted on 10/13/2002 10:09:14 PM PDT by Letitring
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To: Demidog
Your links do nothing to prove that the bases in those countries were simply to make the acquisition of an oil pipeline possible. You are rewriting history with a totally biased spin.

So then you concede that there are bases all along the pipeline route even in nations where there have been no terrorist camps which target the US.

Well, of course they exist...but your timeline, and the motives you ascribe for their establishment are highly suspect.

We have bases in dozens of countries that 'have no terrorist camps which target the US'. Why? Because they are strategically placed NEAR countries which bear us ill-will. Duh.

Just because a duck is near the hen's nest, that doesn't prove that it laid a chicken egg.

174 posted on 10/13/2002 10:12:13 PM PDT by EternalVigilance
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To: EternalVigilance
Well, of course they exist...but your timeline, and the motives you ascribe for their establishment are highly suspect.

It's not my timeline. What's suspect is why the US had targetted Afghanistan before the 9/11 attacks. That they had is established fact.

175 posted on 10/13/2002 10:22:15 PM PDT by Demidog
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To: Demidog
Yeah, we knew it was a breeding ground for terrorists long before 9-11...but that still doesn't make your case...not even close.
176 posted on 10/13/2002 10:28:34 PM PDT by EternalVigilance
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To: icantbleaveit
This war is about stopping trash Saddam and people like you from replacing the only valuable money in the world with politicians and "freedom" of expresson such as making fake paper money and other evil hypocritical political statements.
177 posted on 10/14/2002 12:22:17 AM PDT by lavaroise
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To: EternalVigilance
Ironically those betraying America will never see indeed Saddam or arabs as people who betrayed America. Marxists abound on FR too, the war is here.
178 posted on 10/14/2002 12:24:14 AM PDT by lavaroise
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Comment #179 Removed by Moderator

To: patrioticduty
The jihadists didn't need Iraq to pull off September 11th

Oh, really? And where do think they got the anthrax? Do you think they brewed it up in a cave? Get real. No bunch of loonies living in a cave dreamed up 9/11. This one has Saddam's fingerprints all over it.

180 posted on 10/14/2002 1:32:06 AM PDT by The Great Satan
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