Posted on 01/22/2014 6:03:52 AM PST by marshmallow
“Nobody held a gun to their heads.”
A gun? No, they just cut off Catholics’ limbs and heads. With that as a background - in a land where EVERYONE had been Catholic - you can see the threat pretty clearly.
“martyrs”...right. They just want so badly to be scorned upon, misused,abused, reviled, etc. You know, all those things that Israel truly IS. It’s pitiful to see how desperate one group can be to pretend martyrdom. Because they KNOW the opposite of love is NOT hate, it is indifference. And the majority of people just don’t care. And than will NOT do for those who believe they are bringing in the Kingdom for Christ, and they will suffer for His name. The only “suffering” they’re doing is defending their leader as sane.
Criticizing child molesters is bigotry. Thanks for your definition.
“Criticizing child molesters is bigotry. Thanks for your definition.”
Why do Protestants fabricate things like that? I gave no such definition.
Here’s an idea that might fly:
How about if we call the minority of priests who molested and those who covered up for them the worthless @#$#@ that they are, and give a break to the large majority who did not molest or cover up?
It’s funny that they whine about being persecuted when Christ said they would be if they were His followers.
They seem to have a hard time putting into practice the teachings of Jesus found in the Beatitudes that they claim they follow.
“How about if we call the minority of priests who molested and those who covered up for them the worthless @#$#@ that they are, and give a break to the large majority who did not molest or cover up?”
I’m all for that, but as a Catholic I won’t be hard to convince on that score because I know most priests have never harmed a child. The Protestant bigots around here on the other hand just enjoy attacking anything and all things Catholic way too much. It’s really a like a form of pornography that they believe they’re allowed to indulge in. They have no moral qualms about it.
How about if we call the minority of priests who molested and those who covered up for them the worthless @#$#@ that they are, and give a break to the large majority who did not molest or cover up?
It works for me. Problem is all we hear from too many Catholics is that basically, boys will be boys and we all sin and they're human just like the rest of us and everyone else is doing it too so they're not so bad after all, etc, ad nauseum.
Problem is, that kind of sin is not just sin like the rest of us, nobody is perfect kind of sin.
It's a depth of evil and depravity that nobody else tolerates or excuses,so to hear anything that sounds like a defense of those priests or how the Church handled it, is revolting.
The worst accusations are the ones from Catholics who claim the victims are just in it for the money.
Vlad and others;
I doubt if we help our cause much if we call others bigots though - all we do is feed into the problem.
I would like to see a new paradigm where we quit calling each other names and seek to elevate the discussion rather than lower it. (Someone already flamed me today about it not being about me or what I want, so whoever wants to now, don’t bother.
Just because someone else does something does not mean we need to respond in kind. I’ve watched these boards degenerate into some really ugly stuff over the past few years. As Conservatives, we should be able to disagree respectfully.
As I used to tell my teenagers, just because someone drops bait in front of you does not mean you have to snatch it relexively.
Regards
Mom,
appreciate the thought.
Below is something I posted on another thread:
“ref the comment about not being more outraged -
With our mutual background, maybe it helps to frame it like this:
We in the Army know we had (and continue to have) a big problem with sexual harassment/assault. Our command structure covered up and moved offenders (particularly high-ranking ones) around, or retired them with a reduction and a slap. We know that, we hate it, we are doing everything we know to stop it. We have cracked down, trained and retrained our soldiers, prosecuted offenders, but it still happens. We are embarrassed because we are supposed to be better than that.
Seems every time we turn around, the Navy and the Air Force are busting our chops about it, calling us sexual abusers and attackers, giving no credit for the advancements or improvements even though they have their own problems (Lackland AFB, Colorado Springs, Annapolis).
After awhile it does get old, and people tend to want to point out that there is sin in all the houses, not just the Army.
All Catholics know it happened. We WERE outraged, ARE outraged, and continue to be outraged by what happened.
I know of none that are proud of it, and none that want to see one more person abused.
What I WOULD like is for people to do some research on what is now, what the church has done and continues to do to protect kids rather than reflexively attacking.
It’s like a soldier today being continually chastised about Sergeant Major McKinney’s behavior in the 80’s and 90’s”
I wish it had never happened.
It did.
We accept that our church failed.
We acknowledge the fault, and accept the responsibility to see that our innocent are protected, and the guilty punished.
Tell me what else we can do?
I don’t think there’s a person on this board who does not acknowledge that despite the best safeguards in the world, stuff like this is going to happen. And it happens everywhere. Nobody is denying that happens elsewhere either.
People who are determined to commit crimes WILL find some way to do it.
So the fact that it happened, is not really the issue.
The issue is in the documented mishandling of it by the Catholic church. That leaves the Catholic church hierarchy culpable.
The thing that almost everyone objects to is the blame the victim, they’re all lying about it happening, *they’re in it for the money* mentality, the downplaying of it by pointing other fingers with *see, we’re not as bad as ______*, etc.
It all comes across as excusing the seriousness of the crimes and the abuse of power by those in a position of power.
So when a priest molests a child, if he’s the one hearing confessions or handing out communion, what is the molested child supposed to do? The Church does claim that their priests have the power to retain or remit sin. And someone is going to risk crossing the person who they believe holds their eternal destiny in their hands.
These priests represent God to those children and it is the most abominable betrayal of trust imaginable and we’re called haters and bigots for pointing that out?
Additionally, the Catholic church claims to hold the high moral ground, as a lot of churches do, and should be setting the example in dealing appropriately with this kind of stuff. Sadly, the secular world seems to have been setting the bar in dealing with it when it SHOULD have been the Church.
Thank you for your outspoken condemnation of those priests and your admission (rare) that your church failed.
AMEN. So perfectly stated there can be NO excuse for not “getting” what the problem actually IS in the RCC. Of course, that won’t stop many from trying to sweep the real truth under the carpet, but I pray that those who are truly seeking what they cannot yet put into words, will read your post and finally understand the unique position of deceit and hideous abuse of power the RCC holds over its members.
“I doubt if we help our cause much if we call others bigots though - all we do is feed into the problem.”
Correctly labeling bigots does not harm our cause, nor does it aid theirs.
“I would like to see a new paradigm where we quit calling each other names and seek to elevate the discussion rather than lower it.”
No such “elevation” is possible when dealing with anti-Catholic bigots. They will lie. They will misrepresent. It is what they do. Several months ago I actually forced two such bigots to admit they had lied. One of those instances is somewhere in this now ridiculously long thread: http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-religion/3061161/posts?q=1&;page=1#1
These bigots cannot be “dialogued” with for they are liars - as two of them have been forced to admit. No “elevation” of the conversation is possible with such people for they serve Satan and not God. They embrace lying, know they are doing it, and the only thing that stops some of us from calling them liars more often is that it is against the forum rules to call any particular poster a liar - no matter how accurate the label. I have no problem talking to Protestants - and have helped quite a few become Catholics over the years. These people, however, are not just Protestants. They are bigots. They are liars. They are not sincere. They are no honest. They are ignorant but knowledgeable enough to know that they lie.
I’ll send this to you as a private message since there is a chance it will be deleted even though I violated NO FORUM RULES IN THIS POST.
See AbnSarge, this is exactly the sort of thing I am talking about:
“Of course, that won’t stop many from trying to sweep the real truth under the carpet,...”
Honestly, who here is doing that and where is the proof? smvoice’s statement is a complete fabrication, of course, and will never be backed up with evidence because there isn’t any of it here.
“...but I pray that those who are truly seeking what they cannot yet put into words, will read your post and finally understand the unique position of deceit and hideous abuse of power the RCC holds over its members.”
Unique “position of deceit and hideous abuse of power the RCC holds over its members”?
AbnSarge, how exactly do you propose to “elevate” the conversation with someone who seems so delusional as to claim that the Catholic Church has a “unique position of deceit and hideous abuse of power ...over its members”? How exactly would that conversation work? It’s like conversing with someone who insists 911 was an inside job despite all the evidence. It’s pointless because they’re nuts. When you mention that there have been cases of abuse within Protestant sects - even with longstanding coverups - which shows there is no “unique position of deceit and hideous abuse of power” on the part of the Catholic Church, you’ll be accused of “making excuses” or of “not getting it”. Facts DO NOT MATTER TO THESE PEOPLE. Bigotry has nothing to do with facts. Even if there had never been a single case of abuse anywhere in the Catholic Church in her entire 2,000 year history, these usual suspects would still be here posting against Catholic beliefs, Catholic practices, Catholic doctrines, Catholic people, Catholic history, and so on. They’re bigots. It’s what they do.
Bernardin is dead.
He’ll never be behind bars. He is below 6 feet of dirt, however.
You really need to invest in a mirror, vlad. Evidence is given every day. You just choose to ignore it. Sweep it under the rug. They are called excuses. And it’s what pawns do in order to defend the indefensible. You appear to be an anti=protestant bigot. But poor you, will never see. You’re too busy playing a “victim” of “holy wars”. Get over it. Get a Bible and read it if you want to discuss truth. Whining will get you no where.
“You really need to invest in a mirror, vlad.”
Already have one, thanks.
“Evidence is given every day.”
Nope. Not for what you’re claiming.
“You just choose to ignore it. Sweep it under the rug.”
Nope. Now you’re just making stuff up. Anti-Catholics have to resort to lying.
“They are called excuses.”
I didn’t make any.
“And it’s what pawns do in order to defend the indefensible.”
No one here is defending the indefensible - except for the Protestant anti-Catholics who are making excuses for their bigotry.
“You appear to be an anti=protestant bigot.”
No. I pity Protestants and know Protestantism is a deception, but there is no bigotry there. I, for instance, never lie about Protestants or Protestantism while anti-Catholics must by necessity resort to lying, distortion and misrepresentation.
“But poor you, will never see.”
I see just fine.
“You’re too busy playing a “victim” of “holy wars”.”
I’ve never been a victim of any holy war. Quite frankly none of you are able to victimize me in the least.
“Get over it. Get a Bible and read it if you want to discuss truth.”
I have Bibles, dozens of them, and I read them frequently. I probably know the Bible better now than you ever will.
“Whining will get you no where.”
Then stop doing it. I will continue to point out the truth even if you keep whining against it.
It sure seems like my post struck a nerve. No surprise there. Your rant won’t change anything either.
So does Satan.
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