Posted on 12/06/2006 12:25:00 PM PST by Cagey
When winter hits, my car gets parked, and I primarily drive my 4x4 truck. I always have at least a .22 rifle in there, a CB radio (wit side-band), a big first-aid kit, a camp axe (smallish double-bit), bow saw, pulaski, bucket, and shovel, fishing pole and gear, not to mention alot of tools, Hi-lift jack and spare parts in the sawbox, and an Oklahoma credit card (nice for getting gas out of the tank if you need to). Oops, don't forget TP...
I have a pre-rigged belt I use for hunting that stays in there all winter long- lite-weight survival/1st aid, .357 (revolver is best), large hunting knife, tommy-hawk, pouches with waterproof matches, flint, compass, magnifying lense dry tinder, and etc...
There is also a smallish backpack with MRE's, top-ramen, candy-bars, coffee, snuff, tinned meat (spam, vienna sausage), and various other dry foods... in a pinch there's five days worth, which could be stretched to 10 if there is dire need...
There are also a set of bear-paws, gators, 2 sets of Carhardts (uppers and lowers), one set I use, and the other set are rolled up in a giganto-zippy water-proof bag. One of the biggest problems in a winter setting is keeping dry. Extra winter gear is awsome, so you have something to wear while drying the other at a fire. There's probably 6 or 7 various layers too, fleece or down vests, hoodies, plus spare sets of gloves, hats, and snow-pack liners, etc which kinda migrate into the truck, a spare set of snow-packs, 4 of the old army wool blankets, and army surplus sleeping bag w/ cold weather liner, and two big blue tarps.
Believe it or not, all that stuff fits nicely behind the seat (with the exception of the saw-box type stuff). Just pack it in there in the fall, and haul it out in the spring.
I can tell you from experience, that the stuff you recommend is better than nothing, but is far too little for an extended stay in winter.
You might consider me over-prepared, but I have been caught in the woods several times, and twice had to leave the truck and walk out, once with a buddy that was mighty happy I had spare gear laying around.
Do not plan for a nite or two... plan for disaster. If you are only out a couple days, it will be very comfortable. If the worst happens, at least you can make a play.
-Bruce
Oh, give me a break.
You're just trying to provoke.
He is sinless, and we are sinners.
You're quite welcome and I'm delighted if you've found them to be helpful :-)
My husband and I travel quite often on very remote roads in the Smokies in the winter, and also in other remote areas. . so, we need to do more preparation.
The mere fact that you are even thinking of advance preparation for untoward circumstances places you far ahead of the vast majority of the population.
We have a bunker at home in case of a disaster,
WOW! That's wonderful! The Stoat Cave has a basement which I keep stocked with emergency supplies and equipment but I wouldn't exactly call it a 'bunker'.
but our van isn't optimum.
Nothing short of a fully staffed Hyatt Regency with in-suite internet would really be 'optimum' (in my view), but the mere fact that you have a vehicle so marvelously versatile as a van allows you many options that people with little cars simply don't have. When things get dicey, you will look to the heavens and thank your lucky stars that you didn't follow the PC lemmings and bought a vehicle based exclusively upon gas mileage ratings. If you want to keep your van and you find yourself driving in snow up to 4" every now and then, you may wish to at least consider this option. (unless you and your husband truly enjoy putting on and taking off your tire chains) It's quite popular among East Coast and Midwest emergency services providers, and can be put on a vehicle as small as an F-150 series truck chassis, so if you have a true fullsize van it may be possible to fit these on your vehicle. The next time your husband has to get out of the car and put on the chains, you may wish to inquire with him as to whether he might prefer to stay in the nice, warm and toasty cab with his mug of cocoa and just flip a switch instead :-).
I read often where people suggest mostly things like candy for an emergency bag. If people are stranded for days or weeks, those little hard candies could begin to look sort of skimpy.
I wouldn't recommend this, and not because candy is skimpy. If you are truly in an emergency situation and your body is being underfed and overstressed, coupled with the very real chance that you or someone else is injured, you don't want to be feeding them or yourself a bunch of sugar which will cause your heart to race, and then cause your metabolism to go lower than before. You need protein, and I assure you that when you are in a really bad spot, those icky-looking Lifeboat rations or MRE's that you bought at the survival equipment store will look awfully good, and they will keep you going a whole lot better than eating a bunch of sugar when your body is already severely overstressed and/or injured..
Not everyone likes sardines, kippers, high nutrition bars and things like that, but if one gets hungry enough, they are cheap, compact and very densely nutritious.
Very true. Just be careful to monitor any canned goods carefully and toss them if the cans show any sign of swelling at all....this indicates that the contents have gone bad and will give you botulism if eaten.
Lots of folks have great success with organizing their cupboard as a larder, in that they dramatically overstock everything first, and then arrange similar items front-to back on shelves. Anything consumed is taken from the back and immediately replenished from the front (or vice-versa), and so this keeps a constantly rotating and always fresh food supply on hand, while maintaining a large overstock in the event of worldly troubles..
A couple of clothing items that come to mind. I've heard that one loses a huge amount of body heat through the top of the head,
Very true.
so a heavy toboggan and scarf or other would be a good idea to have in the car in winter traveling.
True. Knit wool for a hat is great because wool keeps warm even when wet.
Also, mittens instead of gloves, because in mittens, the fingers are kept together and hold more warmth inside the mittens than gloves.
I've owned some awfully warm and heavy-duty gloves. A disadvantage of mittens is that they aren't any good if you have to manipulate things, such as things under the hood. If you only have mittens on hand then hubby will take them off to work on the engine and then his hands will get cold.
Also, just an idea - a big red "X" cut from colored plastic and folded in an emergency kit could be used to place on top of the car (or on the ground nearby), especially in the snow, where it would be easy to spot from the air by searchers.
Sounds good, but also consider things that are visible at night such as emergency beacons and strobes. Be wary of using flares, as lost hikers have used these to get noticed and have started forest fires. They were found, but the people who found them weren't happy at all and arson is not something that most people want on their resume..
Any other ideas?
A multi-fuel backpacker's stove (you can siphon gas from your van's tank in a pinch and use it to melt snow for water or to cook "whatever")
Investigate the fun hobby of Ham Radio. It's something that you and your husband can do together and it may save your lives. No, you don't have to learn Morse code or have advanced electronics knowledge. If there's a 'cataclysmic' event, the Hams will be happily chatting away while cellphone-only users will be without communications. Cellphone coverage is going to typically be poor in remote areas anyway, even under the best of conditions...
The specific lists of items submitted by posters on this thread are great, and if you augment that with First Aid training and common sense, you will be far ahead of about 99% of the population :-)
PORTLAND, Ore. - A timeline of the Kim family's trip and the search for them, according to law enforcement officials.
Nov. 17: James and Kati Kim and their two daughters leave San Francisco in their family car for Seattle.
Nov. 24: The Kims leave Seattle for Portland.
Nov. 25: The Kims have dinner at Roseburg and leave around 9 p.m., planning to take Highway 42 to the coast, but miss the turnoff. They take Bear Camp Road, planning to take it to the coast. At 10:30 p.m., the Kims spot signs warning that winter conditions might make driving difficult. They turn back and end up on a side road about 15 miles north of Bear Camp Road.
Nov. 26: Around 2 a.m. the Kims are running out of gas. They stop at a forked intersection and call for help on their cell phone, but are unable to get service. It rains and snows all day. The Kims start up their car for heat.
Nov. 27: It snows all day. The Kims try to stay warm by running the heat in the car, but only periodically to conserve gasoline.
Nov. 28: The Kims remain in their car. It snows and rains all day.
Nov. 29: Weather starts to clear. The Kims start fires with magazines and wet driftwood to stay warm.
Nov. 30: The Kims use a spare tire to start a fire in the afternoon.
Dec. 1: They burn all four remaining tires to signal for help and for heat. The fire burns out in the afternoon. They hear a helicopter, but can't locate it.
Dec. 2: About 7:45 a.m. James leaves the car in search of help. He builds a fire for Kati and the children, and says that he will return by 1 p.m. The Kims think the town of Galice is 4 miles away. It is about 15 miles away. James sets out for Galice, walking on a road for about 5 miles before turning off down the Big Windy Creek ravine.
Dec. 2: Kati Kim sees and hears a helicopter but fails to get its attention. James Kim doesn't return in the afternoon.
Dec. 4: 1:45 p.m. A helicopter searcher spots Kati Kim and her children at their family car. They are taken to Three Rivers Community Hospital and released in good health.
Dec. 5: Search and rescue personnel find clothes identified as those of James Kim, arranged in a pattern that may have been intended to give searchers clues to his whereabouts.
Dec. 6: The body of James Kim is found at the bottom of Big Windy Creek. He had walked a little over 10 miles, but his body was only about a mile from the car.
---
Compiled by AP Editorial Assistant Typh Tucker
Mullah Omar, is that you?
I even try to maintain an emergency bag in Mrs. Atos car for everyday city driving. That kit is augmented for a few modern urban concerns... 1 adult and 2 child gas masks... unfortunately.
The Northwest offers a muriad of dangers, however, than everyone, everwhere here must be prepared for everyday. Terrorist attacks are a new one. Earthquakes, Volcanic Eruptions and Tsunami's are another real possibility. Any major one of those could isolate one from services for days at a moment's notice. After the Nisqualmie quake in Seattle, I was sufficiently spooked enough to keep my family prepared, both at home and in the car.
Being from Texas myself, I wasn't prepared for conditions in Washington. I think most respect the North Cascades, however. Now that I live in Oregon, I see that newcomers/visitors are driven (literally) into a false sense of confidence. People die here so frequently its disturbing. Moreso, it seems in Winter. Stories like the Kim's are all to frequent this time of year. There have been four or five of them this year already. The others had happier endings, however.
In fact, the Coastal Range seems most often to be more dangerous than even the Cascades. When you live here, you learn quickly and with luck, the easy way. Even the hard way from time to time is better than not having the chance to learn from your mistakes. In fact, I think Krakauer's "Into The Wild" should be recommended reading for anyone moving into a wilderness State.
In Texas, the deadliest thing to be concerned with was driving into a Flash Flood. But here, you could put your entire family in danger by simply taking a wrong turn on a dark mountain highway... ending up in a natural labyrithn where the minotaur is sheer isolation in the midst of a veritable ocean of geologic wrinkles.
How did that come about?
Have you even read the thread? Someone originally asked if Mr. Kim was a Christian. It looks like that offended someone on the thread.
It's a reasonable question for a Christian to ask if another person was a Christian, especially after they have died. If they were Christians, it gives us comfort to know that we will see them in heaven. That is part of our faith.
Thanks for your reply.
Being from Texas myself, I wasn't prepared for conditions in Washington. I think most respect the North Cascades, however. Now that I live in Oregon, I see that newcomers/visitors are driven (literally) into a false sense of confidence. People die here so frequently its disturbing. Moreso, it seems in Winter. Stories like the Kim's are all to frequent this time of year. There have been four or five of them this year already. The others had happier endings, however.
One of the biggest mistakes that city folk make is to assume that "services" are always available. The reliance on cell phones is a good example. If one is in a high mountain pass, it is quite likely there is no cell service- Up here where I live, it is a fact of life. Our valley floor has great coverage, but it gets spotty just a few miles out of town, and goes away once one gets over the top of the first range of mountains.
A good CB is still a necessity in the backwoods. CB with sideband is even better, as one can usually ride skip easier than getting radio waves over-the-hump, and sideband has about 3x the power of AM.
On one of my adventures, I lost the fuel pump on my truck. I was about 20 miles off the blacktop. That night I caught skip on lower-sideband ch 16 and talked to a guy in Florida who called my father on a land-line. My father then called one of my buddies, who actually drove out with the part. Needless to say, the cell was "out of range" the whole time.
That particular time is quite a lesson in another way: People figure they will be able to stay in the car and run it from time to time to get heat. Obviously, in my situation, the truck was stone-cold. I was in knee-deep snow with temp in the low teens, and I am sure it dropped below zero that night.
As it was, I was sitting pretty- I had the tools I needed to harvest usable wood for a fire, used my tarps to build a makeshift tent, had chicken terriaki for dinner, and fried spam w/ macaroni and cheese for breakfast. I did use the truck's radio for company, having found an AM radio station.
BTW, within hours of leaving that spot, another 12" of snow came down. If things had gone differently, I would have wound up walking out, or would have required a chopper to lift me out.
But I was ready for that too, I had the calories available, and the equipment I needed to survive two or even three nights on the trail in reasonable safety.
PS: Another necessity I failed to mention is at least a tin cup, available at any camping supply or army surplus. I have a camp kitchen kit, so I have that covered... But some sort of container that can be used to cook with, and sustain heat from an open fire...
-Bruce
"Two years in the military would go a long way to preparing Americans for survival situations"
In general the military doesn't teach survival, only in some specialties and elite units is there survival training.
Thanks for more ideas. - My husband and I are in our early 60's, and just getting in better shape (especially me, he cuts and splits his own wood and has had military training as well, is in better shape than I am) would be helpful, I'm sure. - His work takes him, and sometimes both of us, down backroads in very remote areas where traffic is sparse to none; it's just part of the job and enjoyable except for the risks. We see no way we even want to quit working and sit in a rocking chair, so we take our chances - but we can make more preparations for the vehicle.
One of the supplies we always carried was 6 to a dozen flares. They will start a fire in a hurry and when you hear a helicopter or fixed wing aircraft, set another off. Most likely they will see the plume of red smoke.
We also used to carry an extra gallon of gasoline in the trunk on really bad days. I'm not sure it is too safe, but it did get the car going again so that we were able to get to a gas station.
You're quite welcome :-) I hope that they might be of some help.
- My husband and I are in our early 60's, and just getting in better shape (especially me, he cuts and splits his own wood and has had military training as well, is in better shape than I am) would be helpful, I'm sure. His work takes him, and sometimes both of us, down backroads in very remote areas where traffic is sparse to none; it's just part of the job and enjoyable except for the risks. We see no way we even want to quit working and sit in a rocking chair, so we take our chances - but we can make more preparations for the vehicle.
It's great that you are thinking and planning ahead for unforeseen unpleasantness. Even though I'm in my mid-forties and am in pretty good shape, I am going to be putting automatic tire chains on to the stoatmobile. which is a full-size van. I have conventional chains, but the automatic ones are great for those times when I would really prefer to not put regular chains on (which is most of the time). I also don't like the feeling of cars going by so awfully close when I am pulled over on the side of the road and working on a wheel.
It's really never too late to get some basic First Aid knowledge. It will give you the confidence of knowing what to do when difficult situations arise and, like Ham radio, it's something that you and your husband can learn together.
Good luck to you, and I'm sure that with your forethought and some minimal training you should do just fine.
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