Posted on 03/13/2019 6:40:19 AM PDT by Antoninus
In 1 Thess 4:13-17 where is JESUS coming from? And GOD is bringing WITH HIM those who have died in Christ, where are they being brought from since they are coming WITH JESUS?
You cant tell the difference tween Romes Mary and Christs mother??
Sad
Where is He bringing them to??
Who are the dead in Christ that are coming UP out of a tomb??
HE is bringing the SPIRITS of those in Christ with JESUS from Heaven to the air above the Earth (not to ground). These SPIRITS are given new bodies, so they are bodily being raised first. Then, we who are alive and remain at the coming of the Lord will join these raised, in the clouds, to meet the Lord IN THE AIR.
“You assume I misunderstand the Catholic notion of purgatory.”
Your own words indicated you misunderstand it. I assumed nothing.
“Does The Holy Spirit go to purgatory in your catholiciism steeped reasoning??”
And that in itself indicates you don’t understand the doctrine of Purgatory.
I find it HARD to get the above from what is actually written.
1 Thessalonians 4:16-17 King James Version (KJV)
16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:
17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.
Can we not read that Christ DESCENDS and the dead RISE??
There are no SPIRITS to be found here DESCENDING with Jesus.
When do those in verse 17 get the new bodies??
I feel that many of us Prots are no better than Catholics in some matters.
Many are born into a Christian family and learn the 'bible' from a certain denominational viewpoint. Learning the 'truth' in countless Sunday School lessons and numerous sermons; thus being unable to actually READ the Scriptures for ourselves and discern what is inscribed on those pages we claim are so dear.
THIS is why I post LOTS of Scripture when trying to get a teaching across; hoping it can speak for itself, and thereby not having to 'explain' what the words 'really' mean.
THIS is why I am such a stickler for words, for phrases, for sentences and for entire paragraphs.
Others in these threads are delving even deeper at times; wanting us all to try to understand what the GREEK says, or Hebrew, or ancient customs...
14 But continue thou in the things which thou hast learned and hast been assured of, knowing of whom thou hast learned them;
15 And that from a child thou hast known the holy scriptures, which are able to make thee wise unto salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus.
16 All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:
17 That the man of God may be perfect, thoroughly furnished unto all good works.
(Sorry Catholics; but TRADITION is NOT mentioned in verse 16.)
No; what it 'indicates' (to me) is that he's wanting to know YOUR version of what you think Rome teaches about 'purgatory'.
You realize the only reason we have scriptures is because of tradition and CATHOLIC Church councils, right? So then, in your book, and deemed by you, without any authority, the scriptures are in error. Gotcha.
The Vatican is a country. WHOM, specifically, are you saying “claims that the apostles meant the exact opposite of what they wrote”? Secondly, how do you know your interpretation is any better?
Why are you relying on Goff as the authority? What makes him so?
Where did the words of the apostles come from?
Did your Bible and the interpretation of it that you believe exist before 100AD?
Funny that. Does your Bible not rely on an Old Testament?
So 400 years later someone twists the texts to come up with the doctrine of purgatory? No thanks. Anyway this pope missed the boat. There is no mention of praying to Mary to get one out of the nonexistent purgatory... so he cant be Roman Catholic anyway.....
By whose authority do you interpret this biblical passage to mean it as you write? Why does your interpretation trump others?
So you are divinely inspired?? Wow.
Haha. Crass propaganda from a guy acting like a walking Jack chick tract. That’s rich!!
Heretics go to hell, not purgatory.
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