Posted on 11/18/2022 3:42:35 PM PST by ebb tide
Re Islam:
Them too.
I was thinking more of liberal demicrat Marxist douchebag pieces of communist mule sh!t, but yeah, the muzzies too. But I kind of think they’re being misled too.
Fair question. IF you knew God as our Creator, then you would know He created us to have a relationship with Him. Sin separates us from Him because He is perfect and without sin. The sacrifice of animals would have been appalling to Adam and Eve because the animals were their friends/pets. It was necessary to show them how horrible sin is. The act of sacrifice was to show they owed God their allegiance and loyalty.
Well, now I see why you have dubbed yourself BipolarBob, and in deference to your plea for a little forgiveness I sincerely extend that to you, but by no metric is this a religious thread, that would discuss reasonably, aspects of religious points of view, cordially, and in good faith (no pun intended), rather this is a thread in response to an arrogant hatemonger who has insulted, and challenged the legitimacy of every non Catholic Christian and Jew, and I will neither TOLERATE nor RESPECT such a vile creature, but would happily FORGIVE him after his sincere REPENTANCE. If vomiting out such tripe, especially to the people found on these pages, including YOU, is not BATSH!T STUPID, I should like to know what might be. As for myself, I have never valued Dignity over TRUTH. I NEVER WILL.
Cordially Yours,
I don’t have a dog in this fight but I don’t think you get to decide for others the derivation of their faith or what they believe. If they honor and recognize the god of Abraham then it’s pretty much beyond argument.
But I guess some folks love argument.
“It was nice while it lasted.”
Whadda ya talkin’ about???
The Philistines, the Babylonians, the Macedonians, the Assyrians, the Romans, the Crusaders, the Inquisitors, as recently as the German Nazis, and Italian Fascists, the Jews survived them ALL, with one hand always tied behind their backs! YOU THINK THIS PISS ANT IS GONNA DO THE TRICK?
BRACE UP M’ LAD, OR LASS, (WHO KNOWS THESE DAYS? ESPECIALLY ON THE NET)...AND GOOD SHABBOS!
Jesus dealt with this issue. In speaking to the unbelieving Jews, Jesus emphasized their need to receive His words as truth and obey His commands. They replied, “We be Abraham’s seed” (John 8:33, KJV). Jesus then rebukes them for plotting ways to murder Him; their stubborn response was again, “Abraham is our father” (verse 39a). At this, Jesus makes a distinction between the physical seed of Abraham and the true, spiritual seed of Abraham: “If you were Abraham’s children . . . then you would do what Abraham did” (verse 39b). The conversation heats up as the Jews for a third time reference their connection to Abraham: “Are you greater than our father Abraham?” they ask Jesus (verse 53). Jesus provokes them further: “Your father Abraham rejoiced at the thought of seeing my day; he saw it and was glad” (verse 56). The Jews’ are incredulous that Jesus would claim to be a contemporary of Abraham, and that’s when Jesus brings the exchange to a climax with a claim to full deity: “Very truly I tell you, . . . before Abraham was born, I am!” (verse 58). In a fury, the Jews attempted to stone Jesus (verse 59), again proving that being the physical seed of Abraham is not enough—they had to be born again (John 3:3). Paul sums up the difference between the seeds of Abraham in Romans 2:28–29: “A person is not a Jew who is one only outwardly, nor is circumcision merely outward and physical. No, a person is a Jew who is one inwardly; and circumcision is circumcision of the heart, by the Spirit, not by the written code. Such a person’s praise is not from other people, but from God.”
Judaism is an Abrahamic faith. God made an unconditional covenant with Abraham. God cannot lie. The promises to Israel- land, seed and blessings by God will be fulfilled after the Tribulation and in the Millennial kingdom. The Church did not replace Israel. The church and Israel are not the same and have different programs. The promises to Israel have been postponed and will not come to fruition until National Israel repents, believes in Christ the Messiah and says “Blessed is He who comes in the name of the Lord”
If I saw wood, I create sawdust. I don't particularly want a relationship with the sawdust.
There is no essential relationship between the creator and created other than the creation itself.
I’ve read the King James Bible from cover to cover but it raised as many questions as it answered.
I’ve also read about the roots of Christianity and how it has been corrupted by those in power.
Jimmy Swaggert’s got nothing on many of the Popes.
Still wrestling with that one.
The “Big Bang” theory leaves me empty and raises just as many questions as religion.
I find it comedical that atheists “know” there’s no god because they have no more proof there isn’t one than believers who insist there is
Both rely on faith and not physical proof.
I wish I wasn’t a fence sitter because I loved to think I would be reunited with loved ones in the afterlife and that there’s more than just living in the present. Seems....selfish.
Wish I could but every generation has muddled what a Christian as Jesus was said to taught his followers to be has drifted and changed from what it meant in the first generation believers.
I try to live as a good Christian but cannot honestly say with conviction I am without doubt and feel like a hypocrite if I say I do.
Being brutally honest. Sorry if that’s too raw.
Agreed. I don't consider either Christian. You shouldn't let their behavior influence your eternity.
The simplest answer is usually the right one. We were created. God wants to have a relationship with us. Sin separates us. He can't tolerate sin. WE have to change. We have to become perfect. We have to do all in our power to meet God on His terms. That means getting on our knees and praying for guidance. That means reading the Gospels (First four books of the New Testament) until we understand what Jesus went through and risked for us.
The life we have here is uncertain. Scary. Chaotic. Heaven is orderly, serene and beautiful. Time does not exist there. All of your questions answered and you will know joy that you have never known here on earth.
Secondly, if such a being created this astounding universe it seems most logical that this creator had a purpose for it all, and that the one who created an systematically ordered universe with all its physical laws - and in which disorder is thereby manifest as an aberration - would not only institute physical laws for man, but also moral laws, which are only the man's benefit when obeyed, and to his detriment when not.
And considering the unique nature of sentient man, with his higher basic innate moral sense and superior intelligence and communicative abilities - and unique sense of deity (no animal has ever been observed building altars or expressly worshiping a god, aside perhaps from his owner) - then it also seems logical that this creator had a special purpose for him, and that if the creator would be in any kind and degree of communicative relationship with any created beings, then it would be man.
In contrast, that this creator is simply a disinterested spectator, watchmaker God, is what is least logical, if at all.
And let me add that the moral objections of recalcitrant railing anti-theists against the God of the Bible manifest ignorance and irrationality, and exceedingly ignorant finite man, who is but a speck in this universe and in the expanse of time and eternity, man must essentially presume omniscience in order to sit in judgment on a omniscient and omnipotent Being, who thus knows what all the effects will be, small and great, not only in this life but for all eternity (which is the final manifestation of God's choices) of even the most seemingly insignificant actions. And can make all ultimately work out for what is Good, in justice as well as in mercy and grace, which the God of the Bible promises to do. (Romans 8:28) Justly punishing those who want sin over what it good, darkness over light, and thus often reject conscience and guilt, and the need for forgiveness from God, and His means of providing it.
Footnotes
See post above. Thanks.
Eliminating Judaism has always been a hallmark of the left. Gentiles are branched into the tree that is Judaism, but we aren’t meant to replace them.
True. I suspect that this thread was posted in response to one in which there was debate on this issue, in which I posted (by the grace of God),
the issue was resolved among devout Jews of the first century who believed:
And he said unto them, These are the words which I spake unto you, while I was yet with you, that all things must be fulfilled, which were written in the law of Moses, and in the prophets, and in the psalms, concerning me. (Luke 24:44)
But thou, Beth–lehem Ephratah, though thou be little among the thousands of Judah, yet out of thee shall he come forth unto me that is to be ruler in Israel; whose goings forth have been from of old, from everlasting. (Micah 5:2)
For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counsellor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace. (Isaiah 9:6)
Who hath believed our report? and to whom is the arm of the Lord revealed? For he shall grow up before him as a tender plant, and as a root out of a dry ground: he hath no form nor comeliness; and when we shall see him, there is no beauty that we should desire him. He is despised and rejected of men; a man of sorrows, and acquainted with grief: and we hid as it were our faces from him; he was despised, and we esteemed him not.
Surely he hath borne our griefs, and carried our sorrows: yet we did esteem him stricken, smitten of God, and afflicted. But he was wounded for our transgressions, he was bruised for our iniquities: the chastisement of our peace was upon him; and with his stripes we are healed. All we like sheep have gone astray; we have turned every one to his own way; and the Lord hath laid on him the iniquity of us all.
He was oppressed, and he was afflicted, yet he opened not his mouth: he is brought as a lamb to the slaughter, and as a sheep before her shearers is dumb, so he openeth not his mouth. He was taken from prison and from judgment: and who shall declare his generation? for he was cut off out of the land of the living: for the transgression of my people was he stricken. And he made his grave with the wicked, and with the rich in his death; because he had done no violence, neither was any deceit in his mouth.
Yet it pleased the Lord to bruise him; he hath put him to grief: when thou shalt make his soul an offering for sin, he shall see his seed, he shall prolong his days, and the pleasure of the Lord shall prosper in his hand. He shall see of the travail of his soul, and shall be satisfied: by his knowledge shall my righteous servant justify many; for he shall bear their iniquities.
Therefore will I divide him a portion with the great, and he shall divide the spoil with the strong; because he hath poured out his soul unto death: and he was numbered with the transgressors; and he bare the sin of many, and made intercession for the transgressors. (Isaiah 53:1–10)
For the life of the flesh is in the blood: and I have given it to you upon the altar to make an atonement for your souls: for it is the blood that maketh an atonement for the soul. (Leviticus 17:11)
And Aaron shall cast lots upon the two goats; one lot for the Lord, and the other lot for the scapegoat. And Aaron shall bring the goat upon which the Lord’s lot fell, and offer him for a sin offering. But the goat, on which the lot fell to be the scapegoat, shall be presented alive before the Lord, to make an atonement with him, and to let him go for a scapegoat into the wilderness. (Leviticus 16:8-10)
Then shall he kill the goat of the sin offering, that is for the people, and bring his blood within the vail, and do with that blood as he did with the blood of the bullock, and sprinkle it upon the mercy seat, and before the mercy seat: And he shall make an atonement for the holy place, because of the uncleanness of the children of Israel, and because of their transgressions in all their sins: and so shall he do for the tabernacle of the congregation, that remaineth among them in the midst of their uncleanness. (Leviticus 16:15-16)
And when he hath made an end of reconciling the holy place, and the tabernacle of the congregation, and the altar, he shall bring the live goat: And Aaron shall lay both his hands upon the head of the live goat, and confess over him all the iniquities of the children of Israel, and all their transgressions in all their sins, putting them upon the head of the goat, and shall send him away by the hand of a fit man into the wilderness: And the goat shall bear upon him all their iniquities unto a land not inhabited: and he shall let go the goat in the wilderness. (Leviticus 16:20-22)
Behold the Lamb of God, which taketh away the sin of the world. (John 1:29)From that time forth began Jesus to shew unto his disciples, how that he must go unto Jerusalem, and suffer many things of the elders and chief priests and scribes, and be killed, and be raised again the third day. (Matthew 16:21)
For as Jonas was thee days and three nights in the whale’s belly; so shall the Son of man be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth. (Matthew 12:40)
Jesus answered and said unto them, Destroy this temple, and in three days I will raise it up. Then said the Jews, Forty and six years was this temple in building, and wilt thou rear it up in three days? But he spake of the temple of his body. (John 2:19-21)
And while they abode in Galilee, Jesus said unto them, The Son of man shall be betrayed into the hands of men: And they shall kill him, and the third day he shall be raised again. And they were exceeding sorry. (Matthew 17:22-23)
And Jesus going up to Jerusalem took the twelve disciples apart in the way, and said unto them, Behold, we go up to Jerusalem; and the Son of man shall be betrayed unto the chief priests and unto the scribes, and they shall condemn him to death, And shall deliver him to the Gentiles to mock, and to scourge, and to crucify him: and the third day he shall rise again. (Matthew 20:17-19; cf./ Mark 8:31, 10:32-34; Luke 9:22; 18:31-32; 24:27,44)
And he said unto them, These are the words which I spake unto you, while I was yet with you, that all things must be fulfilled, which were written in the law of Moses, and in the prophets, and in the psalms, concerning me. (Luke 24:44)
So Christ was once offered to bear the sins of many; and unto them that look for him shall he appear the second time without sin unto salvation. (Hebrews 9:28)
Who gave himself a ransom for all, to be testified in due time. (1 Timothy 2:6)
For when we were yet without strength, in due time Christ died for the ungodly. (Romans 5:6)
For the love of Christ constraineth us; because we thus judge, that if one died for all, then were all dead: And that he died for all, that they which live should not henceforth live unto themselves, but unto him which died for them, and rose again. (2 Corinthians 5:14-15)
In whom we have redemption through his blood, the forgiveness of sins, according to the riches of his grace; (Ephesians 1:7)
And walk in love, as Christ also hath loved us, and hath given himself for us an offering and a sacrifice to God for a sweetsmelling savour. (Ephesians 5:2)
Who gave himself for us, that he might redeem us from all iniquity, and purify unto himself a peculiar people, zealous of good works. (Titus 2:14)
Who his own self bare our sins in his own body on the tree, that we, being dead to sins, should live unto righteousness: by whose stripes ye were healed. (1 Peter 2:24)
For Christ also hath once suffered for sins, the just for the unjust, that he might bring us to God, being put to death in the flesh, but quickened by the Spirit: (1 Peter 3:18)
Herein is love, not that we loved God, but that he loved us, and sent his Son to be the propitiation for our sins. (1 John 4:10)
. Unto him that loved us, and washed us from our sins in his own blood, (Revelation 1:5)
And they sung a new song, saying, Thou art worthy to take the book, and to open the seals thereof: for thou wast slain, and hast redeemed us to God by thy blood out of every kindred, and tongue, and people, and nation; (Revelation 5:9)
Not raw at all! I think you raise questions that the greatest saints have raised. If a Christian is honest he will like Paul admit: "For now we see only a reflection as in a mirror; then we shall see face to face. Now I know in part; then I shall know fully, even as I am fully known." - 1 Cor 13:12
Many Christians have been taught or have falsely concluded that they are saved by their works/behavior.
Is the following scripture a confession we believe in out heart? "For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith—and this is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God." - Eph 2:8
Is the following scripture a confession we believe in out heart? "For God so loved the world that He gave His one and only Son, that everyone who believes in Him shall not perish but have eternal life. For God did not send His Son into the world to condemn the world, but to save the world through Him. Whoever believes in Him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe has already been condemned, because he has not believed in the name of God’s one and only Son." - Jn 3:16,18.
Jesus is our Savior, not the Law, not rules, not behavior.... The spirit that demands we keep the law and produce good behavior to be saved is contrary to the gospel. Salvation is about BELIEF in Jesus the Christ - His work, His life, His death, His resurrection.
If you see yourself falling to sin, you have an advocate in Jesus. Keep coming back to Him requesting deliverance and He will change you over time.
Let me suggest you listen to teachings by Joseph Prince:
https://www.josephprince.org/
May I also add that atheism seems to intimate that the game would be better off without an umpire. It wouldn't take a rocket surgeon to figure out how that would look.
Grace and peace FRiend.
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