For Any Residual Paulbots Who Think It Would Be Cute to Vote Libertarian Today...

Reaganite Republican ^ | 06 November 2012 | Reaganite Republican

[Reaganite Republican]

The only effect you're going to have -if any- is to hand 

the election to Obama on a platter- unforgivable

Randy Barnett @ Wall Street Journal (highlights mine):

As a young libertarian, I was very enthusiastic about the formation of the Libertarian Party. I proudly cast my vote for Roger MacBride for president. I attended the 1975 national convention in New York that nominated him. 

But, while I am as libertarian today as I was then, I have come to believe that the Libertarian Party was a mistake.

The reason is simple. Unlike a parliamentary system in which governments are formed by coalitions of large and small parties, our electoral system is a first-past-the-post, winner-take-all one in which a winning presidential candidate just needs to get more than 50% of the vote. This means each contending "major" party is itself a coalition that needs to assemble enough diverse voting groups within it to get to 51%. Hence the need to appeal to the so-called moderates and independents rather than the more "extreme" elements within. 

To the extent that a third party is successful, it will drain votes from the coalition party to which it is closest and help elect the coalition party that is further removed from its interests. The Libertarian Party's effort will, if effective, attract more libertarian voters away from the candidate who is marginally less hostile to liberty, and help hand the election to the candidate who is more hostile to liberty...

Some have defended the LP by saying it is an expressive outlet for political libertarians, as distinct from more intellectual or policy types. Here too the LP has been counterproductive. 

By drawing libertarian politicos from both major parties, the LP makes these parties less libertarian at the margin than they would otherwise be...

Some of you have excuses for staying home, but unless you’ve been crippled by some burdensome medical condition, there is no excuse for not going to the polls and pulling the lever for Romney.

Randy Barrett explains in a WSJ column why 
voting Libertarian this year is counterproductive.

If you don’t know where your polling place is, what the hours are, or what the ballot looks like, this helpful link will get you what you need....

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WSJ   The Other McCain  About.com   Accordion Guy 

[GlockThe Vote]

I voted for RP in the primary - today Romney Ryan

FUBO!

anyone claiming to be a libertarian yet knowingly aiding obama needs a beating.

[napscoordinator]

Oh, I remember my teachers indoctrinating us re. how great Jimmy Carter was going to be, I was twelve at the time.

lol. We had a mock election in school that year. I was in sixth grade so I was 12 as well (born in 1969). Anyway, I was all ready to vote for Reagan, but the pretty girl voted for Carter so I changed my vote....didn’t have a clue about either one of them or even what Republican or Democrat was, but I sure as hell knew what a beautiful girl was and if Carter was good for him, he was good for me....stupid youth things.

[Claud]

As I understand the democratic process, my vote is MY vote. Not yours. Not the party’s.

[OneWingedShark]

The opposite is true ~ you need to go after THOSE WITHIN who I believe he tagged as "more extreme elements" . The reason is if they don't show up you don't win because you cannot make up for their absence with nearly non-existent independents or, yeccchhh, moderates!

So then, would you agree with the statement: “In striving to make the party appeal to everyone, the party can only succeed in appealing to no-one; by standing for nothing it only attracts those who will fall for anything.”

[entropy12]

I personally know a few people who support Ron Paul. One of my frequent golf buddy voted for him in 2008. This year he voted Green party. Other few I know are fervent libertarians.

This is only anecdotal...but the common thread I observe is they are not very successful financially. Other than they seem to be good people, especially my golfing pal.

[TejanoJim]

I am a Libertarian but in this election, there is no way I would stay at home or vote Libertarian. There is way too much on the line to do that. Obama must be defeated at all costs.

[Claud]

Second - your insulting attitude towards those of us who have Libertarian sympathies, especially with regard to our impossible fiscal situation, is more likely to repel voters than attract them.

Seriously! This is a tough election that demands tough choices...and you are so right about this board being flagrantly anti-Romney a few months ago.

I'm not blaming anyone for voting whichever way they do, and I pray God I will celebrate Obama's leaving office with all of you tonight.

But the problems that most of us see with a Romney election won't go away. They are MUCH more preferable to the disaster of 4 more years of Obama, but they are still there and they *are still a threat to the existence of this Republic*.

[muawiyah]

The party must first appeal to virtually all its coalition partners in some serious way before engaging in the general election. That means the candidates must be acceptable ~ if a candidate is not acceptable to one or more of your larger identifiable coalition partners, you will lose.

You do not need to appeal to anyone outside your coalition partners ~ the reason is that among politically motivated folks, who can be expected to vote, they are NOT going to switch and vote for the other guy.

Your best source of new voters is among the 90 million adults who don't vote. Your worst source of new voters is among the other major coalition party's members.

The italicized statement you posted would not be a way to win elections because, as it turns out, when you stand for nothing, appeal to no one, and imagine you can win anything, you will be amazed every time you try it! We won't be amazed however.

[dfwgator]

But the problems that most of us see with a Romney election won't go away. They are MUCH more preferable to the disaster of 4 more years of Obama, but they are still there and they *are still a threat to the existence of this Republic*.

One thing at a time, let's get Obama out first, then we'll cross that bridge with Romney.

[Claud]

I understand that and I agree with you 100%. Get Obama out first.

[i_robot73]

Why, yes, conforming to the (R) plantation has not done so well in the past, but, by golly, it’ll work THIS time.

But, just to make the rest of the (R) group happy, let’s cast aside our principles and (still, holding our noses) vote for ABO. At least we get OUR NE liberal guy in office.

Why, on the 1st day, w/ Boehner and McConnell, they’ll repeal all extra-Constitutional laws/Depts and start to follow the Constitution as they’ve swore to do (before).

Why not berate the Libertarians on this board, it’s not like the (R)’s NEED them anyway, right?! So, who cares WHOM they vote for?

Different plantation, but same slave owners. I’ll eat crow when I see a dept. shut down, laws rescinded and/or a budget surplus, but I’m not holding my breath.

[muawiyah]

Did he just say the Romney supporters were labeled "Mittbots"?

I don't recall labeling them that ~ it's pretty obvious what they are ~ as with the Paulbots, Bushbots, Obamabots ~ there are the Mittbots.

These petty battles over nomenclature will be won eventually ~ but I think this one is a pretty good one. It allows us to easily differentiate between True Conservatives and Mittbots, and GOP-e ~ after all the GOP-e aren't even real Republicans ~ and to a degree that is a situation that should be of serious concern to all of us.

At 7 PM EST, all the Mittbots in my book come back to life as MITTBOTS ~ the Obamabots turn into LOSERS.

Anyone got a problem with that?

[muawiyah]

7 PM EST today ~ the bridge is crossed and the battle re-engaged!

[Smokin' Joe]

About 95% of real Conservatives reject the Paulista dialogue totally.

Did you make that statistic up just now, or did you pull it from some warm dark orifice where it has been festering?

If "Conservatives" reject limiting the Federal Government to it's Constitutionally authorized functions, then I guess I ain't one.

[ThinkingBuddha]

I still think Ron Paul would have been the best bet for America’s future. His principles are more in line with our constitution and our founding fathers than any candidate in recent history.......even Reagan.

However, I hold my nose and support Romney; Obama’s go to go!!!!

[muawiyah]

you can’t sit there and cherry pick Libertarian beliefs ~ and say, ‘so there’. you guys have so much incompatible baggage, that one little item just doesn’t get you over the 5 % compatibility level.

[Claud]

Right. Imagine a coalition that would elect Romney....now a different fight like about homosexuality or abortion or slashing the budget. You may have to lose some folks in the original coalition and pick others up.

[NoLibZone]

The DNC worked hard for Virgil and still no joy.

[NoLibZone]

any 3rd party presidnet will have to buy twice as many votes.

Top down will never work.

[muawiyah]

With Romney and that crowd in power we probably can't hold the Republican coalition together if any of those major issues are raised.

Romney will need to go along with the greater part of the party on those questions, or he'll suddenly find himself the head of a quite small party.

I think the first efforts have to be to go after the appointees he comes up with. Any of them unwilling to slash their agency's budget should be opposed. That's where you get control of the budget ~ right there in the agencies where the people work who 'do budget' every year.

Given his inclination to always appoint Democrats to the judiciary, we'll need to stop him in the Judiciary committee, which means we need to hop on that problem immediately ~ presuming the Republicans win control of the Senate, the seniormost Republican, Orin Hatch, is going to have to PROVE his Social Conservative inclinations ~ we don't want any of that 'I don't want to push my personal beliefs on the barbarians around me' nonsense. Hatch has to come across regarding Committee Chairmanships or we lose the judiciary to another long period of fascist pig domination!