Skip to comments.Unearthed Aryan cities rewrite history
Posted on 10/04/2010 12:15:28 AM PDT by Palter
BRONZE Age cities archaeologists say could be the precursor of Western civilisation is being uncovered in excavations on the Russian steppe.
Twenty of the spiral-shaped settlements, believed to be the original home of the Aryan people, have been identified, and there are about 50 more suspected sites. They all lie buried in a region more than 640km long near Russia's border with Kazakhstan.
The cities are thought to have been built 3500-4000 years ago, soon after the Great Pyramid in Egypt. They are about the same size as several of the city states of ancient Greece, which started to come into being in Crete at about the same time.
If archeologists confirm the cities as Aryan, they could be the remnants of a civilisation that spread through Europe and much of Asia. Their language has been identified as the precursor of modern Indo-European tongues, including English. Words such as brother, guest and oxen have been traced back to this prototype.
"Potentially, this could rival ancient Greece in the age of the heroes," said British historian Bettany Hughes, who spent much of the northern summer exploring the region for a BBC radio program, Tracking the Aryans.
"We are all told that there is this kind of mother tongue, proto-Indo-European, from which all the languages we know emerge.
"I was very excited to hear on the archeological grapevine that in exactly the period I am an expert in, this whole new Bronze Age civilisation had been discovered on the steppe of southern Siberia."
She described driving for seven hours into the steppe grasslands with chief archeologist Gennady Zdanovich. "He took me to this expanse of grass; you couldn't tell there was anything special. Then, as he pointed to the ground, suddenly I realised I was walking across a buried city," she said.
"Every now and again you suddenly notice these ghostly shapes of fortresses and cattle sheds and homes and religious sites. I would not have known these had he not shown them to me."
The shape of each of the cities, which are mainly in the Chelyabinsk district, resembles an ammonite fossil, divided into segments with a spiral street plan. The settlements, which would each have housed about 2000 people -- the same as an ancient Greek city such as Mycenae -- are all surrounded by a ditch and have a square in the middle.
The first city, known as Arkaim, was discovered in 1989, soon after the soviet authorities allowed non-military aerial photography for the first time.
The full extent of the remains is only now becoming apparent. Items that have so far been dug up include many pieces of pottery covered in swastikas, which were widely used ancient symbols of the sun and eternal life. The Nazis appropriated the Aryans and the swastika as symbols of their so-called master race. Ms Hughes believes that some of the strongest evidence that the cities could be the home of the Aryans comes from a series of horse burials.
Several ancient Indian texts believed to have been written by Aryans recount similar rituals. "These ancient Indian texts and hymns describe sacrifices of horses and burials and the way the meat is cut off and the way the horse is buried with its master," she said. "If you match this with the way the skeletons and the graves are being dug up in Russia, they are a millimetre-perfect match."
All the Indo-European languages, that is. Not Semitic (Hebrew, Arabic) or Sino-Tibetan languages:
Of interest ping.
I never knew the origin of the swastika. Back in the days of these Arayans, the swastika meant something entirely different and I’m sure much more benign.
One of those trunks, below the slavic languages, says “Islamic”. I am confused.
The type of horse is the Akhal-teke. This is an ancient breed used as a war horse - having great stamina and speed.
The breed was kept pure by Turkomen tribes who live east of the Caspian Sea.
I have heard about these grave sites only they’ve been referred to as “Scythians”.
But I thought science had determined there was no “cohesive” group of “Aryan” peoples sharing a common culture/language?
Oops...guess these discoveries and the recent proving of the “Aryan Invasion Theory” through genetics forced mainstream science to change their stance...for the nth time.
Soft science is caught in a trap of its own making...namely, the curse of education. It seems that the more you think you know, the less you’re willing to admit you don’t know. Everything has to have an elaborate theory, an explanation, no matter how small the find. The large majority of social scientists have a hard time simply saying...we don’t know.
Yeah, when 5,000 “Aryans” rode into India, killed the men and took the women as wives...I’m sure the swastika banner they brought with them was considered extremely benign.
You admit you don’t know the origin of a symbol (until recently), but you’re giving lessons on what that very symbol meant to ancient peoples, friend and foe? Ok, Professor.
Thank, that explains it. Hopefully that will be corrected someday, or pretty soon, we will have jihadis claiming that they have given us our language.
I didn't know this either. But do are you really comparing some ancient battle to the horror of the Holocaust? Perhaps someone needs a lesson on perspective.
The entire argument that there was any conflict between the Aryans who settled India, and the natives who were pushed into the fringes of the Indian landmass, is controversial.
No record of a violent demise of the Indus Valley Civilisation exists. Not to mention, current evidence points to ecological factors for the destruction of that highly-developed civilisation. No mention of war with natives have been recorded in Hindu scriptures. Most wars detailed are of those between Aryan kingdoms.
>Indus Valley Civilisation
One of the Great Historical Sadnesses attributable to “modern” Pakistan is the virtual lack of interest in further significant research into the subterranean layered ruins below the current sites of Harappa, MohenjoDaro and others.
PreIslamic don’t count, don’tcha know?
They used to showcase Buddhist shrines in the NW to European tourists, but I believe that is kaput now due to jihad.
>sacrifices of horses and burials
In her fiction novel, The King Must Die, Mary Renault, a scholar of Ancient Greece describes a horse ritual sacrifice in Greece that is eerily similar to ancient Aryan/Vedic practices.
>the swastika meant something entirely different and Im sure much more benign.
It still does, not only in India, but also in Nepal and in the Buddhist societies of SE Asia.
In the West, the Nazi association reigns supreme.
The American “indians” also had the swastika. It is a simple enough symmetrical design to be independently designed around the world, I’m sure.
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But if you believe in Panspermia, the process where the more people breed the more room they need, you understand as they spread they took their traditions with them. Worldwide. But unscrupled people always pop up and twist these traditions into some perversion for their own nefarious purposes. Kinda sorta like when I was a little kid and we had Christmas. But now we have The Holiday Season. ;-)
I have books many, many years old which trace the Celtic and Germanic people to the Russian steppes.
Same goes for proto-Indoeuropean languages.
The term “Ayran” does not appear widely in my soures.
Iranians like to call themselves “Ayrans” to distinguish themselves from Arabs.
Hitler and fellow travellors refered to “Ayrans.”
“I don’t know” - the response of an honest scholar.
So Islam and communism create similar outcomes, no?
quibble, panspermia refers to the seeding of life (or its components) from space; the word you’re looking for is probably diffusion.
Pakistanis are basically delusional. They now try to insist that they are not Indian at all but the descendents of Arabs who came to India — the Arabs of course laugh at this and at them. They also, quite contradictorily try to say that they are “pure” Aryans, while Indians are descendents of Dravidians (and completely forgetting that Dravidians ARE Caucasians). Pakis are brain-dead idiots — the disease causing the vacuum between their ears is islam.
The crazy pakis also forget that their land was as you point out, once Greco-Bactrian, Indo-Greek and mostly Buddhist before the Moselm slime came and forcibly converted or killed many.
the only whites who get a pass on this are oddly...the Indians...curry, not Creek
i watched that rehashed who came to America first on NatGeo and they were about ready to do a circle jerk over Polynesians in Chile or even Baja or all those hilarious claims about Chinese junks from some 1700s map that was “copied”....they swear
and it made them cry to even admit the only proved (so far) pre Columbus was Erikson....sort of a footnote
i actually went on some sites about that topic...being curious by nature...sites all teeming with anti-white bigotry....they dismissed Clovis-Solutrean theories as white supremacy yet were ready to endorse Polynesian chicken bones and sweet taters as gospel..yo
i know some of yall here are really all over this stuff...blam, civ, cronos(still here?) but today..damn...how do ya weed thru all the crap
i’ll stick with my 1958 Britannica for now thanks..
nice...someone who actually reads and left bias at the thread door
The Clovis-Solutrean hypothesis could have happened — but then again, those peoples were not Indo-Europeans but the predecessor (or “original” Europeans). I don’t agree with anyone dismissing it off-hand
well, firstly, to claim any "race" as best or worst is stupid in my opinion
then you say this:
The Chinese of course, had their own race
so Cronos, are u stupid ...your own words...
you just exemplified on this very thread why I take any modern anthropology talk with a grain of salt.
First you dismiss the concept of race.
The you proceed to explain how Caucasians were a myriad spanning from Celts to the Sub-Continent and so forth as though that is news and that Egyptians were sorta negroid...that is disputed except in the brief Nubian rule.
And then you claim the Chinese are their own race and explain away SubSaharan negroid race's poor civilizations development as just so much topography...how convenient...ditto tropical Amerinidians.
You have an agenda here and it ain't objective science. Your explanations are for one thing just as I claimed in my first post which you dismissed.
There is no doubt in my mind as exemplified by your post that many in this field whether as scientists or observers are in it to prove precisely what I stated in my first post. Dilute Caucasian history and promote alternatives to pump up other accomplishments to civilization or to excuse why some lagged.
This sort of redress basically permeates everything in the culture and is just as dishonest as some old whites are superior thinking textbook would have been.
Those who say race does not matter or is nonexistent are being dishonest with themselves...it matters very much to them and your post to the contrary of your purported intent does just that.
There are plenty of reasons some races have a higher mean civilizational development than others and it's instructive to study that....I wish folks actually did that.
I will give you last word since this argument can be an easy Never Ending Story and unprovable
Sure, but it is ironic and quite the coincidence that on two continents, thousands of miles apart, the same symbol, albeit simple, as you say sprang up.
But simplicity works, witness the cross in Christianity.
And in Islam, the sword!
Cool thread bump.