Posted on 12/21/2001 5:11:00 AM PST by blam
Early Christians hid the origins of the Bethlehem star
13:15 21 December 01
Marcus Chown
A US astronomer claims he has found the first mention of the star of Bethlehem outside the Bible. The reference is in a 4th-century manuscript written by a Roman astrologer and Christian convert called Firmicus Maternus.
Photo: Bridgeman Art Library
Michael Molnar, formerly of Rutgers University in New Jersey, is the originator of the idea that the star of Bethlehem was not a spectacular astronomical event such as a supernova or a comet but an obscure astrological one.
The event would nevertheless have been of great significance to ancient Roman astrologers. After studying the symbolism on Roman coins, he concluded that the "star" was in fact a double eclipse of Jupiter in a rare astrological conjunction that occurred in Aries on 20 March, 6 BC, and again on 17 April, 6 BC (New Scientist magazine, 23 December 1995).
Molnar believed that Roman astrologers would have interpreted such an event as signifying the birth of a divine king in Judea. But he lacked proof. Now he says he has found it, in the Mathesis, a book written by Maternus in AD 334. Maternus described an astrological event involving an eclipse of Jupiter by the Moon in Aries, and said that it signified the birth of a divine king.
No names
"Maternus did not mention Jesus's name," says Molnar. "But Roman astrology was a popular craze at the time and everyone reading the book would have known the reference was to Jesus and that the astrological event was the star of Bethlehem."
So why did Maternus not mention Jesus by name? According to Molnar, early Christians hated pagan beliefs and did not want to justify the Biblical story with astrological mumbo-jumbo. The idea that the stars govern our fate flew in the face of belief in a Christian God as the controlling force in the Universe.
"Being a pagan who had converted to Christianity during his lifetime, Firmicus was torn," says Molnar. "Hence his use of astrology to support the Christian story, but in a veiled way."
According to Molnar, it was essential to early Christians that the true nature of the star be hidden, otherwise theologians would be mired in debate about celestial influences that were not part of Christianity. So they buried the knowledge of the star's astrological roots and in time it was forgotten.
"I take Molnar's work quite seriously," says Owen Gingerich, a historian of astronomy at Harvard University. "Anything he comes up with along these lines has to be considered as being very likely correct."
13:15 21 December 01
Astronomers have detected regular patterns in the so-called afterglow of creation that they say were caused by sound shock waves shortly after the Cosmos was born.
They provide the most precise measurement yet of several of the key parameters that cosmologists use to describe the Universe.
 The early Universe is full of sound waves compressing and rarefying matter and light, much like sound waves compress and rarefy air inside a flute or trumpet  |
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Paolo deBernardis
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Boomerang is an extremely sensitive microwave telescope that was carried by a balloon that circumnavigated the Antarctic in late 1998.
The balloon carried the telescope at an altitude of almost 37,000 metres (120,000 feet) for 10 days. Initial images were published a year ago but since then astronomers have been able to carry out a more detailed analysis.
"The early Universe is full of sound waves compressing and rarefying matter and light, much like sound waves compress and rarefy air inside a flute or trumpet," said Italian team leader Paolo deBernardis.
"For the first time the new data show clearly the harmonics of these waves."
Echoes
Astronomers believe that the Universe was created about 12-15 billion years ago in an explosion called the Big Bang.
The intense radiation that filled the early Universe is still detectable today as a faint glow of microwave radiation known as the cosmic microwave background (CMB) that comes from all directions in space.
Astronomers believe that whatever structures were present at that time would leave their mark imprinted as very faint brightness variations in the CMB.
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The new results show the first evidence for a regularity in the angular sizes on which the pattern is most pronounced.
The presence of these so-called harmonic peaks bolsters the theory that the Universe grew from a tiny subatomic region during a period of violent expansion a split second after the Big Bang.
"Just as the difference in harmonic content allows us to distinguish between a flute or trumpet playing the same note, so the details of the harmonic content imprinted in the CMB allow us to understand the detailed nature of the Universe," said Dr Barth Netterfield, of the University of Toronto in Canada.
Creation 'music'
In their first release of data, in April 2000, the Boomerang team was able to reveal only one harmonic peak.
Now, according to Andrew Lange, of the California Institute of Technology, Pasadena, they can see more.
"Using a music analogy, last year we could tell what note we were seeing - if it was C sharp or F flat," he said.
"Now, we see not just one, but three of these peaks and can tell not only which note is being played, but also what instrument is playing it - we can begin to hear in detail the music of creation."
The images obtained cover about 3% of the sky. The researchers plan another campaign to the Antarctic in the near future, this time to map even fainter images encoded in the polarisation of the cosmic microwave background.
The scientific payoff of such measurements "promises to be enormous", said John Ruhl, of the University of California at Santa Barbara.
"With today's results we know for sure that the music is there and we can interpret it.
"There is no doubt that by listening carefully, and in new ways, we will learn even more."
Your question doesn't qualify as a proof that the Bible is "legend and myth" as Wiley claims it to be.
And posted here on FR: Astronomers hear 'music of creation'
Stars, as in what we see in the sky, don't stand still over single houses. (Yes, they were in a house when the Wise Men visited them. Read the text. (Matt. 2:1-18) Jesus was ~2 years old at the time which is why Harrod ordered the slaughter of children 2 and under.) "Stars", as in angels, are perfectly capable of appearing over a single house. Also, the Wise Men saw the "Star" several times. Astromonical conjunctions, supernova, and the like don't appear and re-appear like that; Angels do.
Miracles rest on testimony, not on scientific analyses. While it is interesting to speculate on how God might have performed any particular biblical miracle, including Joshua's long day, ultimately those claiming to be disciples of Jesus Christ (who authenticated the divine record of the Bible) must accept them, by faith.9 There is not one logical, scientific reason to claim that, given a God powerful enough to create a universe in six days, Joshua's long day 'could not have happened'. Those who balk at this account are almost invariably those who have already rejected 6-day creation through compromise with evolution's fictitious long ages, and have thus rejected the authority of the Bible.
First published in:
Creation 19(3):35-37
June-August 1997
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'And it came to pass, as they fled from before Israel, and were in the going down to Beth-horon, that the Lord cast down great stones from heaven upon them unto Azekah, and they died...Then spake Joshua to the Lord in the day when the Lord delivered up the Amorites before the children of Israel, and He said in the sight of Israel, Sun, stand thou still upon Gibeon; and thou, Moon, in the valley of Ajalon. And the sun stood still, and the moon stayed, until the people had avenged themselves upon their enemies. Is not this written in the book of Jasher?2 So the sun stood still in the midst of heaven, and hasted not to go down about a whole day.'
Many cultures have legends that seem to be based on this event. For example, there is a Greek myth of Apollo's son, Phaethon, who disrupted the sun's course for a day. Since Joshua 10 is historical, cultures on the opposite side of the world should have legends of a long night. In fact, the New Zealand Maori people have a myth about how their hero Maui slowed the sun before it rose, while the Mexican Annals of Cuauhtitlan (the history of the empire of Culhuacan and Mexico) records a night that continued for an extended time.4
Joshua's command to the sun to stand still does not support geocentrism, i.e. the idea that the sun moves around the earth. The Bible uses the language of appearance and observation.6
Today people do exactly the same thing. For example, scientists who prepare weather reports for TV announce the times of 'sunrise and sunset'. In fact, the mention of the moon also standing still seems to confirm both the divine authorship of the account and the fact that it is the earth which moves. Since all Joshua needed was extra sunlight, and most ancients believed the sun moves, not the earth, a human author of a fictitious account would only have needed to refer to the sun stopping.
A rumour surfaces from time to time that scientists 'using computers' at NASA to check planetary positions discovered that a day was 'missing' from history.
This story is an 'urban myth'. The alleged research seems never to have been published — no wonder, because to make such a calculation one would need to know the planets' positions before any missing day, as well as after. This is impossible.
Similar considerations apply to the book Joshua's Long Day, written in 1890 by Charles Totten, purporting to prove that a day went missing, without reproducing his calculations. All such calculations can show only where the sun and moon should have been at any time in the past (based on where they are now, assuming the rates of movements have not changed), not where they actually were.
Suggested answers may be divided into three main categories:
1. Some form of refraction (bending) of the light from the sun and the moon. According to this view, God miraculously caused the sunlight and moonlight to continue in Canaan for 'about a whole day'. Supporters of this view point out:7
1. It was light that Joshua needed, not a slowing of the earth.
2. God promised Noah that 'while the earth remaineth...day and night shall not cease (Genesis 8:22). This could be seen to mean that God promised that the earth would not stop rotating on its axis until the end of human history. (However, it would not seem to preclude a temporary slowing down of the earth's rotation).
3. Some form of light refraction appears to have been what happened in the reign of Hezekiah when the shadow on Ahaz's sundial retreated ten degrees (2 Kings 20:11)—an event that appears to have occurred only in the land of Palestine (2 Chronicles 32:31).
2. A wobble in the direction of the earth's axis of rotation.
This involves a precession8 of the axis of the earth, wobbling slowly so as to trace an 's'-shaped or circular path in the sky. Such an event could have made it appear to an observer that the sun and the moon were standing still, but need not have involved any actual slowing of the rotation of the earth.
One suggestion was that this was caused by the orbits of the earth and Mars being close together on this date.1 One problem is that these authors postulate an ancient orbit for Mars different from its present one, and there is no proof that this ever happened. Other suggested causes have included impacts of asteroids on the earth.
3. A slowing of the earth's rotation.
According to this view, God caused the rotation of the earth to slow down so that it made one full revolution in about 48 hours rather than 24. Simultaneously God stopped the cataclysmic effects that would have naturally occurred, such as monstrous tidal waves. Some people have objected to this on the erroneous assumption that, if the earth slowed down, people and loose objects would fly off into space. In fact, the apparent centrifugal force (tending to throw things off the earth) is only about one-three-hundredth of the gravitational force. If the earth stopped rotating (whether suddenly or not), this outward 'force' would cease and we would actually be held more firmly by gravity.
The earth at the equator moves at about 1,600 km/h (1,000 mph). The velocity needed to escape from the earth's gravity is about 40,000 km/h (25,000 mph). If the earth was spinning as fast as this, we would all fly off into space anyway, regardless of whether the earth stopped suddenly or not!
What about the momentum of people and objects travelling at 1,600 km/h on the earth? Answer: A car travelling at 100 km/h can be stopped comfortably for the occupants in a few seconds; something travelling at 1,600 km/h could stop comfortably for passengers in a few minutes.This scenario need only imply that God slowed the rotation of the atmosphere, oceans, and earth simultaneously to prevent any tidal-wave effect, and any heat build-up inside the earth due to friction from still-rotating liquid layers of the earth's core. And after the long day was over, the whole process would need to start up again.
It is certainly not impossible for God to have done all this, despite representing a major interruption of the natural order of things with respect to the earth set up by God in Genesis 1.
Christianity is a religion of the miraculous—from God's creative acts of Genesis 1 to the wonderful events of Revelation 22. The Bible does not tell us how any of these happen, other than that God wills them to happen and they do. He may use (intensify) some existing natural law (as in Noah's Flood), or all participation of nature may be excluded (as in the Resurrection). Often the miraculous effect lies in the providential timing of natural events (as in God's partition of the Red Sea by a strong wind that blew all night—Exodus 14:21).
Miracles rest on testimony, not on scientific analyses. While it is interesting to speculate on how God might have performed any particular biblical miracle, including Joshua's long day, ultimately those claiming to be disciples of Jesus Christ (who authenticated the divine record of the Bible) must accept them, by faith.9 There is not one logical, scientific reason to claim that, given a God powerful enough to create a universe in six days, Joshua's long day 'could not have happened'. Those who balk at this account are almost invariably those who have already rejected 6-day creation through compromise with evolution's fictitious long ages, and have thus rejected the authority of the Bible.
1.Donald Patten, Ronald Hatch, Lorenc Steinhauer, The Long Day of Joshua and Six Other Catastrophies, Baker Book House, Michigan, 1973 give the date as 'circa October 25, 1404 bc'. Other commentators give a slightly different date, e.g. C.A.L. Totten, July 22, 1443 bc.
2.The book of Jasher (KJV) or Jashar (some modern translations) was an ancient collection of poems written to honour Israel's leaders (cf. 2 Samuel 1:17–27). Joshua's words to the sun (which appear to be quoted from this book) are in poetic form and are printed in this way in most modern Bible versions. This use of poetry here does not invalidate a literal interpretation of the event, any more than those Psalms which describe events in David's life invalidate the literalness of the events they poetically portray. In any case, verse 13b reverts to Hebrew prose to describe what happened in answer to Joshua's prayer.
3.It would have made no sense early on the morning of a battle, with a whole day ahead, for Joshua to have prayed for a lengthening of the daylight.
4.Immanuel Velikovsky, Worlds In Collision, Dell, New York, 1950, p. 61 note 3. See also other historical references to long days or nights in this book.
5.Instead of, for example, using hornets (Exodus 23:28), or confusing the enemy (2 Kings 7:6).
6.In this connection, Henry Morris writes, 'All motion is relative motion, and the sun is no more "fixed" in space than the earth is. ...The scientifically correct way to specify motions, therefore, is to select an arbitrary point of assumed zero velocities and then to measure all velocities relative to that point. The proper point to use is the one which is most convenient to the observer for the purposes of his particular calculations. In the case of movements of the heavenly bodies, normally the most suitable point is the earth's surface at the latitude and longitude of the observer, and this therefore is the most "scientific" point to use. David [Psalm 19:6] and Joshua are more scientific than their critics in adopting such a convention for their narratives.'—Henry Morris with Henry Morris III, Many Infallible Proofs: Practical and Useful Evidences for the Christian Faith, Master Books, Arizona, 1996, p. 253.
7.For example, John C. Whitcomb, 'Joshua's Long Day', Brethren Missionary Herald, July 27, 1963, pp. 364–65.
8.Precession: the motion of the axis of rotation of a spinning body about a line that makes an angle with it, so as to describe a cone.
9. 'To say that "miracles cannot happen" is not a scientific assertion. It is a faith statement on exactly the same level as when a Christian says that "Jesus performed miracles"'—Hugh Silvester, 'Miracles', Eerdmans' Handbook to Christian Belief, Michigan, 1982, p. 90.
RUSSELL M. GRIGG, M.Sc.(Hons), was an industrial chemist before serving 20 years with Overseas Missionary Fellowship. He is now a staff member of Creation Science Foundation.
Obviously, you are not going to answer the questions directly and are going to continue to be evasive in supporting your claims.
Based upon this, I can conclude two things...
1)You have never actually read the Bible for yourself, nor have you ever investigated the truths contained within. If you had actually read the Book, you would be able to tell us what the general theme of the Bible really is.
2) You are not able to support your claim that the Bible is "legend and myth", because you cannot cite any solid proof which proves the Bible to be inacurate. Your arguements are more probably based upon your predisposed position of disbelief. The only attempts you make to discredit the Bible are based upon supernatural events...that is, events that defy naturalistic explainations based upon previously observed natual phenomina.
No other book has sold more copies than the Bible. We have more MMS evidence to authenticate it than ANY other writing of antiquity. No book has changed more lives the the Bible, nor have any other writings offered such hope as the Bible offers. For all the supernatural events described in the Bible, the most profound is the resurrection of Christ. Even today, nobody has been able to explain the facts of the resurrection. This single event stands out as the preemminent miracle of all. The Jews tried to cover it up, the Romans tried to lie about and pay off the witnesses and the atheists today still attempt to explain it away, but the evidence is insurmountable that this man Jesus actually lived, was actually crucified a suffered a horrible death and indeed was dead and that He indeed did rise from the dead.
Mohammed is still rotting in his grave, Budda is still moldering in his tomb, but visitors to the tomb of Jesus still find an empty tomb. Nobody has ever been able to explain where his body is and both the Romans and the Jews had plenty of reason to not have him rise from the dead. Nobody has yet to produce His body.
Of all the miracles in the Bible, the resurrection is the one that is impossible to debunk and because of its solid eveidences, easily makes all the other miracles of the Bible easy to conceive. In any court of law (which was tried at a prominent law school) the evidence for the resurrection is so solid that any jury required to contemplate the evidence, would be forced to return the verdict that He did indeed rise as He said He would.
No historical fact related in the Bible has yet to be refuted by archeology. Not ONE! With every turn of the archeologist's spade, the Bible is proven to be more and more highly accurate.
I say all of this because I once sat in a position similar to yours Wiley. I once disbelieved, but began a steady mountain of studying the Bible and it's claims. Yes, there are parts that confuse me and parts that seem difficult to grasp, but the Bible is the most substanbtiated work of literature on the planet and it's truths are solid.
The biggest proof I have for the claims of Christ is the work He has done inside of me. He has brought me from despair to hope in His believable promises. Very little on this earth can change a man from the inside out, but He has. The physical truth about the Bible convinced me to reach out and trust Him , but His work inside me is what gives me hope. Hope that He is just and loving and forgives me for the ruinous loss that I was. He brought me from the drunk, drug addict with a .357 in my mouth to a man who has hope. As He has fogiven me for so much, He has shown me how to forgive and to love those that seemed unlovable. He has given me new eyes to see the world as He sees it.
I ain't perfect Wiley, but I'm not what I used to be.
The theme of the Bible is a love story about God's desire to create a being that would have the free will to choose to love Him or to reject Him. Man chose to love himself instead (as man usually chooses) of God, but God set about a plan to reconcile man to Himself and to restore that one-on-one relationship that He originally created man for. Someone had to pay the price for our disobedience, but there was no man worthy. So God became a man in the flesh and in time and space. A perfect man, without sin, who could relate to us in all of our temptations and yet He remained sinless and becasue He remained sinless could be that perfect lamb, with out blemish Who could be that atoning sacrifice that would pay the price that we all owed to God for our sin. The perfect Man was Jesus...Immanuel (which means "God with us") and He was obedient to the task before Him, for greater love has no man than this but to lay down his life for his friend.
Wiley, I say all this to share the hope that really is Christmas. The gift givers were the Magi, but the greatest gift that first Christmas was God giving us His Son, to die in our place, so that we could be restored to the Father because Jesus paid the price we could not pay. Just as Jesus had the choice to go the cross, we too have the choice to die to ourselves and go to the Father. This is your choice.
You may reject the Bible if you wish. You may reject the Son if you wish. But please choose wisely, based upon knowing the truth first. The Father desires that you turn to Him and He promises to welcome you freely, bringing nothing, because there's nothing you can bring. Jesus brought it all and paid it all.
Because He loves you that much.
With all that in mind, you now know what I mean when I say "Merry Christmas".
Merry Christmas Wiley. I wish you His very best.
baa (His sheep)
Norman Geisler also has an excellent resource available titled "When Critics Ask", which deals with the apparrent contradictions in the Bible.
Revelation 1:20
The seven stars are the angels of the seven churches
Job 38:4-11
4 Where wast thou when I laid the foundations of the earth? declare, if thou hast F214 understanding. 5 Who hath laid the measures thereof, if thou knowest? or who hath stretched the line upon it? 6 Whereupon are the foundations F215 thereof fastened? or who laid the corner stone thereof; 7 When the morning STARS [emphasis added] sang together, and all the sons of God shouted for joy?
Matthew Henry commentary:
"...when the morning-stars sang together, the blessed angels..."
Jamison, Fausett, and Brown commentary:
"morning stars--especially beautiful. The creation morn is appropriately associated with these, it being the commencement of this world's day. The stars are figuratively said to sing God's praises, as in Psalms 19:1, 148:3. They are symbols of the angels, bearing the same relation to our earth, as angels do to us. Therefore they answer to "sons of God," or angels, in the parallel"
Isaiah 14:13
For thou hast said in thine heart, I will ascend into heaven, I will exalt my throne above the stars of God
It definitely wasn't St. Elmo's fire, because he wasn't cannonized until years later. ;)
BTW, good use of commentaries!
When I feel something bad is going to happen but can't get specifics, then I am frustrated but accept there's nothing I can do about it.
These wise men probably had esp abilities which are not a sin if it's the real deal.
As for me, I bought myself a bag of frankensense and myrrh (sp?) and I love to take a break every day and smell it. Everybody should get themselves a bag of F & M. You will feel a connection to the Holy Land and to the true meaning of Christmas.
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