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Big freeze plunged Europe into ice age in months
European Science Foundation ^ | November 30, 2009 | AlphaGalileo

Posted on 12/02/2009 9:26:07 AM PST by SunkenCiv

William Patterson, from the University of Saskatchewan in Canada, and his colleagues have shown that switching off the North Atlantic circulation can force the Northern hemisphere into a mini 'ice age' in a matter of months. Previous work has indicated that this process would take tens of years.

Around 12,800 years ago the northern hemisphere was hit by a mini ice-age, known by scientists as the Younger Dryas, and nicknamed the 'Big Freeze', which lasted around 1300 years. Geological evidence shows that the Big Freeze was brought about by a sudden influx of freshwater, when the glacial Lake Agassiz in North America burst its banks and poured into the North Atlantic and Arctic Oceans. This vast pulse, a greater volume than all of North America's Great Lakes combined, diluted the North Atlantic conveyor belt and brought it to a halt.

Without the warming influence of this ocean circulation temperatures across the Northern hemisphere plummeted, ice sheets grew and human civilisation fell apart.

(Excerpt) Read more at alphagalileo.org ...


TOPICS: Astronomy; Science
KEYWORDS: bybycanada; catastrophism; creation; evolution; glaciation; globalcooling; godsgravesglyphs; iceage; iceagenow; itsgonnasnow; nomorecanadians; notbyfirebutbyice; science

1 posted on 12/02/2009 9:26:08 AM PST by SunkenCiv
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To: 75thOVI; aimhigh; Alice in Wonderland; AndrewC; aragorn; aristotleman; Avoiding_Sulla; BBell; ...
IOW, someone reiterates how a minor cooling event caused by an overall warming up, and it's big news again. :')
 
Catastrophism
 
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2 posted on 12/02/2009 9:27:38 AM PST by SunkenCiv (https://secure.freerepublic.com/donate/__Since Jan 3, 2004__Profile updated Monday, January 12, 2009)
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To: StayAt HomeMother; Ernest_at_the_Beach; 1ofmanyfree; 21twelve; 24Karet; 2ndDivisionVet; 31R1O; ...

· join list or digest · view topics · view or post blog · bookmark · post a topic · subscribe ·

 
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To all -- please ping me to other topics which are appropriate for the GGG list.
GGG managers are SunkenCiv, StayAt HomeMother, and Ernest_at_the_Beach
 

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3 posted on 12/02/2009 9:29:16 AM PST by SunkenCiv (https://secure.freerepublic.com/donate/__Since Jan 3, 2004__Profile updated Monday, January 12, 2009)
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To: SunkenCiv

So then we really should do something about Global Warming.

Specifically, we should tape Al Gore’s mouth shut before the bile flowing from it reaches the Atlantic and dilutes the North Atlantic conveyor belt causing a mini ice age.


4 posted on 12/02/2009 9:30:34 AM PST by DannyTN
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To: SunkenCiv

There is nothing like Lake Agassiz today so I’m not too worried. No chance Greenland will melt in one day.

——glacial Lake Agassiz in North America burst its banks and poured into the North Atlantic and Arctic Oceans.-—


5 posted on 12/02/2009 9:31:32 AM PST by DManA
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To: SunkenCiv
It only took one day in the movie The Day After Tomorrow.


6 posted on 12/02/2009 9:34:18 AM PST by Yo-Yo
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To: SunkenCiv

Well there is only one thing to do...we must all buy SUVs and warm the planet.


7 posted on 12/02/2009 9:36:24 AM PST by for-q-clinton (If at first you don't succeed keep on sucking until you do succeed)
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To: SunkenCiv

Like all climate change, this was probably man made. No doubt someone pulled his finger out of the dike.

At George Bush’s order.


8 posted on 12/02/2009 9:36:33 AM PST by wildbill (You're just jealous because the Voices talk only to me.)
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To: Yo-Yo
I'll be here!

9 posted on 12/02/2009 9:44:26 AM PST by Kartographer (".. we mutually pledge to each other our lives, our fortunes, and our sacred honor.")
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To: SunkenCiv

I have a fear of the climate, and that fear is that in the move to reverse “globul warming” scientists will purposely upset the balance by injecting substances into the atmosphere, placing “blankets” on ice, and unknown other things triggering extreme cooling. If they can trigger a couple of volcanos, it would probably be enough to destroy crops for several years, causing massive starvation. MAN, in his ultimate wisdom, is a babbling idiot, God save us from ourselves.


10 posted on 12/02/2009 10:00:34 AM PST by runninglips (Lame-stream media, ignoring the stories that are too important to cover)
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To: SunkenCiv
I have a fear of the climate, and that fear is that in the move to reverse "globul warming" scientists will purposely upset the balance by injecting substances into the atmosphere, placing "blankets" on ice, and unknown other things triggering extreme cooling. If they can trigger a couple of volcanos, it would probably be enough to destroy crops for several years, causing massive starvation. man in his ultimate wisdom, is a babbling idiot.

God save us from ourselves.

11 posted on 12/02/2009 10:01:22 AM PST by runninglips (Lame-stream media, ignoring the stories that are too important to cover)
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To: SunkenCiv

...please happen during the Copenhagen climate change summmit!


12 posted on 12/02/2009 10:13:15 AM PST by americanophile ("For unto you is born this day in the city of David a Savior, who is Christ the Lord.")
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To: SunkenCiv
human civilisation fell apart.

Um, not to be picky, but exactly how much "civilization" could we be talking about here? This happened almost 13,000 years ago.

I mean, this is hardly the ransacking of the Alexandria Library.

13 posted on 12/02/2009 10:35:05 AM PST by wbill
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To: runninglips
that fear is that in the move to reverse “globul warming” scientists will purposely upset the balance

You ain't alone in that one. I figured that all it would take is some rich idiot that "Means Well" and "Needs to do SOMETHING" to really screw things up.

I think that the worst of that danger is past, enough people are getting a clue....for now. We'll see what comes down the pike next generation.

14 posted on 12/02/2009 10:37:42 AM PST by wbill
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To: SunkenCiv

I’ve heard if the gulf stream slows down or stops, Europe with look alot more like Siberia!


15 posted on 12/02/2009 11:09:11 AM PST by djf (Maybe life ain't about the doing - maybe it's just the trying... Hey, I don't make the rules!)
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The author's name is strangely appropriate:
Unearthing a Cold Snap
by Henry Fountain
Now a team of scientists, writing in the journal Nature, estimate that more than 100 trillion cubic meters of cold, fresh water -- more than the current volume of the five Great Lakes -- was released into the Labrador Sea when the ice dams, remnants of the Laurentide Ice Sheet that covered much of northeastern North America during the last Ice Age, melted about 8,200 years ago. Average temperatures in Western Europe fell by about 6 degrees Fahrenheit, while Greenland suffered a 15-degree drop. And this wasn't just a brief climatic event: it persisted for two to four centuries. They say that flooding caused by the melting of ice dams in two huge glacial lakes in the Hudson Bay region disrupted ocean currents that contribute to atmospheric warming in Europe. Evidence for the flooding includes sediments that once underlaid the glacial lakes that were found 800 miles away, carried by the water (which probably flowed for a year as the lakes drained).

16 posted on 12/02/2009 11:35:49 AM PST by SunkenCiv (https://secure.freerepublic.com/donate/__Since Jan 3, 2004__Profile updated Monday, January 12, 2009)
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"Sensational" Archaeological Find
Sveriges Radio
November 28, 2009
The Polar ice cap during the last Ice Age might not have been as extensive as previously thought, according to archaeologists looking at the remains of human settlements in the north of Sweden.

People may have lived in the northern region of Tornedalen as far back as 11,000 years ago, according to Olof Ostlund, speaking to the Norrlandska Socialdemokraten newspaper.

The 2 settlements were found in the area around Kaunisvaara, where a new mine is about to be built. Carbon dating of the finds show that they are much older than previously thought, and mean that previous theories that the area would be covered by the huge polar ice cap are wrong.

"We will now have to re-think our theories on how people migrated to northern Sweden and northern Norway. They didn't get here from the south via the coasts, the finds in Kaunisvaara make this very clear", Ostlund told the newspaper.
Swedish archaeologists celebrate ancient find
The Local
November 29, 2009
People lived in the Torne River Valley on the border with Sweden and Finland some 11,000 years ago... The settlement, found near Pajala in the far north of Sweden, are the oldest known find in the county of Norrbotten, according to the archaeologist Olof Ostlund. The find was uncovered when archaeologists were searching for ancient remains in the area around Kaunisvaar near Pajala where a new mine is set to open, according to a report in local newspaper Norrländska Socialdemokraten.

"Now the pages in the National Encyclopaedia regarding inland ice can be torn out and burned," Ostlund told the newspaper...

"I had been expecting old dates. But when I saw that the first numbers were very high I felt immediately that this was bingo. When the second number was five figures - I felt faint," Ostlund explained to news agency TT.

He was surprised that the find was so old and compared it to another settlement located nearby in Kangofors five years ago. That settlement had been used 10,000 years ago...

Ostlund compared the new discovery to the find in Voullerim in the middle of the 1980s of 6,000 year-old stone age shelters. Then the assumptions regarding the history of the pre-history of Norrland were revalued to take into account that people had actually lived there.

17 posted on 12/02/2009 11:41:57 AM PST by SunkenCiv (https://secure.freerepublic.com/donate/__Since Jan 3, 2004__Profile updated Monday, January 12, 2009)
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The Cycle of Cosmic Catastrophes: Flood, Fire, and Famine in the History of Civilization The Cycle of Cosmic Catastrophes:
Flood, Fire, and Famine
in the History of Civilization

by Richard Firestone,
Allen West, and
Simon Warwick-Smith


18 posted on 12/02/2009 11:42:14 AM PST by SunkenCiv (https://secure.freerepublic.com/donate/__Since Jan 3, 2004__Profile updated Monday, January 12, 2009)
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To: wbill

“exactly how much “civilization” could we be talking about here?

We don’t exactly know. A lot of it was on the coasts, which are now under under water.
There may have been a lot going on in the areas not covered by ice.

“Five kilometres off the south-east coast of India, submerged at a depth of 23 metres beneath the murky, shark-infested Waters of the Bay of Bengal, an ancient man-made structure sits on the bottom of the sea.
The structure is U-shaped, like a huge horseshoe; its periphery measures 85 metres and its walls are about 1 metre thick and 2 metres high.”

http://www.amazon.com/Underworld-Mysterious-Civilization-Graham-Hancock/dp/1400049512/ref=ntt_at_ep_dpt_4#noop


19 posted on 12/02/2009 11:52:14 AM PST by happygrl (Hope and Change or Rope and Chains?)
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To: SunkenCiv

The draining of big, ancient fresh water lakes created a lot of different features on this planet.


20 posted on 12/02/2009 12:52:01 PM PST by wolfcreek (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lsd7DGqVSIc)
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To: SunkenCiv; muawiyah; blam; Nervous Tick
Either of you ever read the book, NOT BY FIRE, BUT BY ICE - I happened to pick it up one day at the library, and afterwards found out that the author had been interviewed lots of times on Coasttocoast AM. He also has a website, pretty interesting:

http://www.iceagenow.com

I never bought into the Global Warming Hoax, but after reading this book, I became concerned about the global COOLING going on.

I once heard the author say that experts had called him and told him that IF an ice age did begin that there would be HUNDREDS of stories of snow, which would turn to ice, in places like Manhattan.

What would happen to Canadians if an Ice Age did occur??

21 posted on 12/02/2009 4:58:27 PM PST by hennie pennie
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To: hennie pennie

>> What would happen to Canadians if an Ice Age did occur??

They’d be cold, eh?

Haven’t read the book, thanks for the tip, I’ll look into it.


22 posted on 12/02/2009 5:09:20 PM PST by Nervous Tick (Stop dissing drunken sailors! At least they spend their OWN money.)
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To: hennie pennie

People in the future will ask “what Canadians”.


23 posted on 12/02/2009 5:45:11 PM PST by muawiyah (Git Out The Way)
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To: SunkenCiv
The "ice cap" over North American advanced and retreated in different places for different amounts of time during the last period of glaciation.

You really have to assume something similar happened in Europe and Asia.

24 posted on 12/02/2009 5:48:26 PM PST by muawiyah (Git Out The Way)
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To: Nervous Tick
I believe it is in his book, NOT BY FIRE, BUT BY ICE, but perhaps it was during a radio interview that he said that IF an ice age DOES begin, that it starts with gentle sleet which turns to snow.

And then it snows.

And keeps snowing. And snowing.

It doesn't stop snowing.

Eventually the 100s upon 100s of feet of snow, covering everything, turns to ICE.

Apparently the first edition of his book brought out critics in droves and many of them severely criticised the cover which was an illustration of houses covered with snow which stretched up some 30-40 feet.

But while the critics acused him of sensationalism, experts wrote him and complained that the 40 feet of snow was all wrong, and that in fact, the day that it started snowing and never stopped, that it would snow HUNDREDS OF STORIES OF SNOW before it stopped snowing.

I never admitted to anyone that I'd read this book, because we are surrounded by True Believers in the Global Warming Hoax.

25 posted on 12/02/2009 6:55:49 PM PST by hennie pennie
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To: muawiyah

I’ve found it quite interesting that say, a hundred miles south of one of the Ice Age glaciers, that it was temperate - it wasn’t frigidly cold as one might expect.


26 posted on 12/02/2009 6:57:47 PM PST by hennie pennie
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To: hennie pennie
Three things would have controlled what you saw in the last glacial period:

(1)Your altitude. The higher you went the colder it would be and the more persistent any glacier formation would be.

(2) Your latitude. The latitudes closest to the poles would be about 4 to 6 degrees F cooler than they are now YEAR ROUND. This would make any glaciers more persistent, and more precipitation would come as snow or ice than as rain.

(3) How close you were to the North American Ice Sheet. That ice sheet was plastic ~ ice flows ~ so it would regularly intrude into regions South, East and West of the central cold core areas. If the region happened to have a desert climate the glacier would simply sublimate away on the margins. If the region happened to have a temperate wet climate, the glacier would melt on the margins, and on the bottom. In the vicinity of Indianapolis, Indiana for most of the last glacial period there was no ice but you could travel 25 miles North of Monument Circle and there'd be the face of an ice sheet 2 miles deep.

It was as busy melting the last day of its existence as it was the first day it got that far South.

The reason is that the area from the confluence of the Great Lakes in the North down to about Bloomington, Indiana is the narrowest thermocline on Earth. During the period of glaciation it was a bit narrower. You could travel from Paducah Kentucky on the Ohio where it was as temperate as modern St. Saint Marie to Kokomo Indiana where it was more like today's Baffin Island.

We know that the ice age climate Southwest of Indianapolis was desert-like ~ all you have to do is check out the depth of the iron dust inside the caves. Still, Mastadons (Columbians in fact) ate hardy just East of the desert ~ I presume the grass grew quite well from the water pouring off the glacier to the North. Once you got over to the Ohio State line it was nothing but wind blown loess for the next 250 miles. South into Kentucky and Tennessee there'd be great grasslands that extended more or less to the Appalachians, and then South to the Gulf Coast plain. East of the mountains there was a great grassy plain stretching out into what is now the ocean for about 200 miles ~ and as far, in spots, as 500 miles. This area extended up to modern Nova Scotia. Parts of that area were never covered by ice by any of the last 20 glaciations even though sea ice extended as far South as New York City all the way to Spain!

27 posted on 12/02/2009 7:18:56 PM PST by muawiyah (Git Out The Way)
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To: hennie pennie

:’) I don’t think he knows what he’s talking about anyway, so...


28 posted on 12/02/2009 8:37:14 PM PST by SunkenCiv (https://secure.freerepublic.com/donate/__Since Jan 3, 2004__Profile updated Monday, January 12, 2009)
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To: DManA; SunkenCiv; All

Just because there is nothing like Lake Agassiz today, doesn’t mean there is nothing to worry about. One of the risks of global warming is the total summer melting of the Arctic ice cap. Normally as the Gulf Stream flows north, it hits freezing weather, and the surface water freezes. This concentrates the salt below it making the water heavier so it flows to bottom of the ocean and moves back toward to Equator. This is called the North Atlantic Oscillation, NAO, or North Atlantic Deep Water, NADW. You can Google those terms for more details. Thus, no arctic ice, no significant freezing, and the NAO grinds to a halt. No warm water for the British Isles or Europe. Do you realize how much further north they are than we are.

At any rate, I think the Firestone Book that Sunken Civ has made us aware of is more likely the answer, although I think it could have caused a significant impact on Lake Agassiz too. This book hypothesizes a major boloid strike(s) in North America at the same time, wiping out the megafauna and the Clovis culture. Also there was another big outflow of Agassiz around 8,400 years ago, which may also have had a worldwide inpact


29 posted on 12/02/2009 10:17:09 PM PST by gleeaikin
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To: gleeaikin

I was talking about the North Atlantic Oscillation by implication in my post. It took an extraordinary event, not likely to occur today, to knock it out in the past.


30 posted on 12/03/2009 6:49:10 AM PST by DManA
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To: gleeaikin

I was talking about the North Atlantic Oscillation by implication in my post. It took an extraordinary event, not likely to occur today, to knock it out in the past.

In any event it looks like the poles are nice and frigid for now.


31 posted on 12/03/2009 6:50:22 AM PST by DManA
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To: DManA; All

Do you have a good site for arial photos of arctic ice over time. While I do tend to believe the Firestone scenario, I also feel we need to be very aware of the NAO danger in the absence of adequate arctic ice. We have had a long sunspot minimum, but if in fact there is an approximate 88 year sunspot cycle, along with the 11 and 22 year cycles, then the next sunspot maximum could reproduce the effects of the Great Depression droughts and heat. If there is more arctic ice now than a few years ago, I hope it is permanent, and not just an artifact of the minimum which could be temporary.


32 posted on 12/03/2009 10:30:30 AM PST by gleeaikin
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To: SunkenCiv

Well there is that proverbial ‘hockey stick’ ready to play a game. Now who will be used as the puck?


33 posted on 12/03/2009 10:34:19 AM PST by Just mythoughts
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To: SunkenCiv

This vast pulse, a greater volume than all of North America’s Great Lakes combined, diluted the North Atlantic conveyor belt and brought it to a halt.


It is NEVER one thing, is is ALWAYS several things coming together at once..................


34 posted on 12/03/2009 10:35:06 AM PST by PeterPrinciple ( Seeking the truth here folks.)
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To: gleeaikin

Thanks gleeaikin. And you’re right, western Europe is very far north, its habitability largely dependent on the Gulf Stream.

There’s no “global warming” though, merely the Earth’s natural climate, which is dependent on solar output, and is 100 percent natural 100 percent of the time. :’)


35 posted on 12/03/2009 7:30:47 PM PST by SunkenCiv (https://secure.freerepublic.com/donate/__Since Jan 3, 2004__Profile updated Monday, January 12, 2009)
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To: Just mythoughts

I can’t tell you that right now. Say, have you any problem with extreme cold and being smacked into a net?


36 posted on 12/03/2009 8:07:17 PM PST by SunkenCiv (https://secure.freerepublic.com/donate/__Since Jan 3, 2004__Profile updated Monday, January 12, 2009)
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To: PeterPrinciple

:’) That’s FR in a nutshell.


37 posted on 12/03/2009 8:07:32 PM PST by SunkenCiv (https://secure.freerepublic.com/donate/__Since Jan 3, 2004__Profile updated Monday, January 12, 2009)
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