Military draft should be considered: US war czar

BREITBART ^

[mdefranc]

“Because you have the option of refusing to serve. In slavery, they kill you, or at least that is my understanding. Conscripts are also free to leave the country and renounce your citizenship....” - MSF BU

Judging from the 60’s SS system, you are wrong on all counts.

[perseid 67]

Before we commit more young people to the war effort in Iraq, we need to rid the government of the people who see the military as a huge social engineering laboratory.

Having posted that, if anything else happens we will not have a choice but draft our young. God help us! Our government has never been more elitist or corrupt than it is now.

[familyop]

"No it shouldn’t. We do not need a draft. The army already has enough problems with young recruits thinking the US Army is a social welfare program."

The US Army can turn almost any piece of crap into a good soldier. And court deferments (including deferments from felony cases) continue to happen despite denials by officers.

[MSF BU]

Actually, read Helen Von Damme’s book. Reagan referred to a wartime draft as a necessity. Had we been fighting the Russians, Chinese or North Koreans, we would have been drafting people.

[MSF BU]

Were they killing people who refused to serve? I would have used the model in the fifties.

[cva66snipe]

How many times I gotta say it? The Reagan era buildup proved that we can a military twice the size of today’s without a draft. You’d think these guys with stars on their shoulders would be aware of this.

They are well aware of it. However it has been the policies of every sitting POTUS since Reagan and both parties in congress and senate who have prevented it from ever happening again. The manpower shortage is an artificial one that the mentioned above have purposely created.

Need more troops? Lower enlistment obligations back to 3/3 or 4/6 contracts. Raise the End Troop Strength Levels to a realistic number so those on active duty and reserves do not face deployment burn out. We have not had a decent Sec of Defense since Cap Weinberger nor POTUS for that matter. Cheney as Sec of Def was a big disaster the GOP will never admit to. It's odd that the only two presidents to downsize the U.S. military during time of war are father and son. We need another Reagan and the top four including the maybe run just don't cut it.

Another huge problem is as one poster stated. There is no more room in the Inn. Between the GHW Bush and Clinton closures there is little place left for training. Our military needs rebuilding and only the bottom three in the polls running for POTUS have realistic, logical, and workable answers.

[familyop]

"My son is in charge of the DI's at the MCRD in San Diego. He said that 5% to 7% of the volunteers are physically unfit to the point that they have to let them go.

That said, a draft would probably have at least 25% physically unfit. Too many DUers sit in mommy's basement eating pizza."

My initial training unit (3 months, one-station, combat specialty) lost over 10% to stress fractures and suicide attempts.

[arderkrag]

...you’re in a country that owes its existence to army’s that were often conscripted; and they were very good forces that always ended up winning the ground war. Like it or not.

And?? We used to have slavery, too. Guess it must be a good thing. WOO-HOO OPPRESSION!!!

Point being, what happened in the past is largely irrelevant in many issues such as this. This is the here and now - and we don't need a draft, or slavery, or Puritanism, or any number of things this country used to contain or relied on in the past.

[MSF BU]

"reason if you are going to draft Johnny, you can draft Janey"

Janey has forty percent less upper body strength than Johnny and she typically is only in the military courtesy of grossly reduced height/weight/physical-fitness standards. Johnny can't get pregnant and ask for 14 months off. Ultimately, because only the Army will be getting draftees, John will be the better choice to serve. Jane can volunteer if she wants; I'd prefer she not be given the lower standard tests they now hold her to.

[arderkrag]

Maybe so, but he proved himself wrong to, if that is the case.

[MSF BU]

The reality here and now is that we are fighting against a collection of undisciplined, poorly trained, lazy people. If we are going to fight a competent, sizeable Army again, we the Army will need to have draftees. There are many free (Israel, South Korea, Taiwan, Switzerland) countries that draft their soldiers.

[MSF BU]

Really, how so? Perhaps I missed it at the time (and I was a soldier then) what ground war were we fighting? How many soldiers were being killed per day?

[MSF BU]

I agree with you on this. The first step along those lines is to completely eliminate different standards for women. Same standards for everybody and if anything make them real world, worst case and tougher.

[arderkrag]

There are many free (Israel, South Korea, Taiwan, Switzerland) countries that draft their soldiers.

You keep saying these things that have bearing on the argument at hand.

[NVDave]

I share your assessment, but I think unit cohesion is one of the reasons for our military forces’ level of professionalism, competence and integrity. Drafting idiots, malcontents and subversives could destroy our military cohesion.

That said, I think the military should increase the maximum age for volunteers for various mission specialties. In the increasingly technical military of today, there are plenty of mission specialties where a 40+ year old guy who is able to pass the entrance physical(s) should be allowed to volunteer and, as you say, relieve some of our people on the front lines.

[arderkrag]

You keep saying these things that have bearing on the argument at hand. EDIT: should be "no bearing".

[Vermont Lt]

You missed the part of my post that said put Janey in the non physical jobs that require the 40% higher strength. Or have the contracted all of those jobs out?

[MSF BU]

Draftees are typically short term MOS designees; MP, Infantry, Artillery, Truck Driver etc. Nobody gets drafted into the Navy or Air Force, and we don’t turn draftees into linguists or other time consuming specialties.

[MSF BU]

No, we only draft soldiers, not sailors or airman. Every new soldier needs to be able to perform as an infantryman. I’m not sure that there are really too many MOS’s where you can absolutely or even practically rule out that possibility. If we have another Bastogne or Pusan, everyone needs to be able to fight long term as an infantryman.

[perseid 67]

Everyone always mentions the glowing example of the Israeli women , but Israel does not put their women on the battle feild in the front lines.