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Dinosaur Shocker (YEC say dinosaur soft tissue couldn’t possibly survive millions of years)
Smithsonian Magazine ^ | May 1, 2006 | Helen Fields

Posted on 05/01/2006 8:29:14 AM PDT by SirLinksalot

Dinosaur Shocker

By Helen Fields

Neatly dressed in blue Capri pants and a sleeveless top, long hair flowing over her bare shoulders, Mary Schweitzer sits at a microscope in a dim lab, her face lit only by a glowing computer screen showing a network of thin, branching vessels. That’s right, blood vessels. From a dinosaur. “Ho-ho-ho, I am excite-e-e-e-d,” she chuckles. “I am, like, really excited.”

After 68 million years in the ground, a Tyrannosaurus rex found in Montana was dug up, its leg bone was broken in pieces, and fragments were dissolved in acid in Schweitzer’s laboratory at North Carolina State University in Raleigh. “Cool beans,” she says, looking at the image on the screen.

It was big news indeed last year when Schweitzer announced she had discovered blood vessels and structures that looked like whole cells inside that T. rex bone—the first observation of its kind. The finding amazed colleagues, who had never imagined that even a trace of still-soft dinosaur tissue could survive. After all, as any textbook will tell you, when an animal dies, soft tissues such as blood vessels, muscle and skin decay and disappear over time, while hard tissues like bone may gradually acquire minerals from the environment and become fossils. Schweitzer, one of the first scientists to use the tools of modern cell biology to study dinosaurs, has upended the conventional wisdom by showing that some rock-hard fossils tens of millions of years old may have remnants of soft tissues hidden away in their interiors. “The reason it hasn’t been discovered before is no right-thinking paleontologist would do what Mary did with her specimens. We don’t go to all this effort to dig this stuff out of the ground to then destroy it in acid,” says dinosaur paleontologist Thomas Holtz Jr., of the University of Maryland. “It’s great science.” The observations could shed new light on how dinosaurs evolved and how their muscles and blood vessels worked. And the new findings might help settle a long-running debate about whether dinosaurs were warmblooded, coldblooded—or both.

Meanwhile, Schweitzer’s research has been hijacked by “young earth” creationists, who insist that dinosaur soft tissue couldn’t possibly survive millions of years. They claim her discoveries support their belief, based on their interpretation of Genesis, that the earth is only a few thousand years old. Of course, it’s not unusual for a paleontologist to differ with creationists. But when creationists misrepresent Schweitzer’s data, she takes it personally: she describes herself as “a complete and total Christian.” On a shelf in her office is a plaque bearing an Old Testament verse: “For I know the plans I have for you,” declares the Lord, “plans to prosper you and not to harm you, plans to give you hope and a future.”

It may be that Schweitzer’s unorthodox approach to paleontology can be traced to her roundabout career path. Growing up in Helena, Montana, she went through a phase when, like many kids, she was fascinated by dinosaurs. In fact, at age 5 she announced she was going to be a paleontologist. But first she got a college degree in communicative disorders, married, had three children and briefly taught remedial biology to high schoolers. In 1989, a dozen years after she graduated from college, she sat in on a class at Montana State University taught by paleontologist Jack Horner, of the Museum of the Rockies, now an affiliate of the Smithsonian Institution. The lectures reignited her passion for dinosaurs. Soon after, she talked her way into a volunteer position in Horner’s lab and began to pursue a doctorate in paleontology.

She initially thought she would study how the microscopic structure of dinosaur bones differs depending on how much the animal weighs. But then came the incident with the red spots.

AdvertisementIn 1991, Schweitzer was trying to study thin slices of bones from a 65-million-year-old T. rex. She was having a hard time getting the slices to stick to a glass slide, so she sought help from a molecular biologist at the university. The biologist, Gayle Callis, happened to take the slides to a veterinary conference, where she set up the ancient samples for others to look at. One of the vets went up to Callis and said, “Do you know you have red blood cells in that bone?” Sure enough, under a microscope, it appeared that the bone was filled with red disks. Later, Schweitzer recalls, “I looked at this and I looked at this and I thought, this can’t be. Red blood cells don’t preserve.”

Schweitzer showed the slide to Horner. “When she first found the red-blood-cell-looking structures, I said, Yep, that’s what they look like,” her mentor recalls. He thought it was possible they were red blood cells, but he gave her some advice: “Now see if you can find some evidence to show that that’s not what they are.”

What she found instead was evidence of heme in the bones—additional support for the idea that they were red blood cells. Heme is a part of hemoglobin, the protein that carries oxygen in the blood and gives red blood cells their color. “It got me real curious as to exceptional preservation,” she says. If particles of that one dinosaur were able to hang around for 65 million years, maybe the textbooks were wrong about fossilization.

Schweitzer tends to be self-deprecating, claiming to be hopeless at computers, lab work and talking to strangers. But colleagues admire her, saying she’s determined and hard-working and has mastered a number of complex laboratory techniques that are beyond the skills of most paleontologists. And asking unusual questions took a lot of nerve. “If you point her in a direction and say, don’t go that way, she’s the kind of person who’ll say, Why?—and she goes and tests it herself,” says Gregory Erickson, a paleobiologist at Florida State University. Schweitzer takes risks, says Karen Chin, a University of Colorado paleontologist. “It could be a big payoff or it could just be kind of a ho-hum research project.”

In 2000, Bob Harmon, a field crew chief from the Museum of the Rockies, was eating his lunch in a remote Montana canyon when he looked up and saw a bone sticking out of a rock wall. That bone turned out to be part of what may be the best preserved T. rex in the world. Over the next three summers, workers chipped away at the dinosaur, gradually removing it from the cliff face. They called it B. rex in Harmon’s honor and nicknamed it Bob. In 2001, they encased a section of the dinosaur and the surrounding dirt in plaster to protect it. The package weighed more than 2,000 pounds, which turned out to be just above their helicopter’s capacity, so they split it in half. One of B. rex’s leg bones was broken into two big pieces and several fragments—just what Schweitzer needed for her micro-scale explorations.

It turned out Bob had been misnamed. “It’s a girl and she’s pregnant,” Schweitzer recalls telling her lab technician when she looked at the fragments. On the hollow inside surface of the femur, Schweitzer had found scraps of bone that gave a surprising amount of information about the dinosaur that made them. Bones may seem as steady as stone, but they’re actually constantly in flux. Pregnant women use calcium from their bones to build the skeleton of a developing fetus. Before female birds start to lay eggs, they form a calcium-rich structure called medullary bone on the inside of their leg and other bones; they draw on it during the breeding season to make eggshells. Schweitzer had studied birds, so she knew about medullary bone, and that’s what she figured she was seeing in that T. rex specimen.

Most paleontologists now agree that birds are the dinosaurs’ closest living relatives. In fact, they say that birds are dinosaurs—colorful, incredibly diverse, cute little feathered dinosaurs. The theropod of the Jurassic forests lives on in the goldfinch visiting the backyard feeder, the toucans of the tropics and the ostriches loping across the African savanna.

To understand her dinosaur bone, Schweitzer turned to two of the most primitive living birds: ostriches and emus. In the summer of 2004, she asked several ostrich breeders for female bones. A farmer called, months later. “Y’all still need that lady ostrich?” The dead bird had been in the farmer’s backhoe bucket for several days in the North Carolina heat. Schweitzer and two colleagues collected a leg from the fragrant carcass and drove it back to Raleigh.

AdvertisementAs far as anyone can tell, Schweitzer was right: Bob the dinosaur really did have a store of medullary bone when she died. A paper published in Science last June presents microscope pictures of medullary bone from ostrich and emu side by side with dinosaur bone, showing near-identical features.

In the course of testing a B. rex bone fragment further, Schweitzer asked her lab technician, Jennifer Wittmeyer, to put it in weak acid, which slowly dissolves bone, including fossilized bone—but not soft tissues. One Friday night in January 2004, Wittmeyer was in the lab as usual. She took out a fossil chip that had been in the acid for three days and put it under the microscope to take a picture. “[The chip] was curved so much, I couldn’t get it in focus,” Wittmeyer recalls. She used forceps to flatten it. “My forceps kind of sunk into it, made a little indentation and it curled back up. I was like, stop it!” Finally, through her irritation, she realized what she had: a fragment of dinosaur soft tissue left behind when the mineral bone around it had dissolved. Suddenly Schweitzer and Wittmeyer were dealing with something no one else had ever seen. For a couple of weeks, Wittmeyer said, it was like Christmas every day.

In the lab, Wittmeyer now takes out a dish with six compartments, each holding a little brown dab of tissue in clear liquid, and puts it under the microscope lens. Inside each specimen is a fine network of almost-clear branching vessels—the tissue of a female Tyrannosaurus rex that strode through the forests 68 million years ago, preparing to lay eggs. Close up, the blood vessels from that T. rex and her ostrich cousins look remarkably alike. Inside the dinosaur vessels are things Schweitzer diplomatically calls “round microstructures” in the journal article, out of an abundance of scientific caution, but they are red and round, and she and other scientists suspect that they are red blood cells.

Of course, what everyone wants to know is whether DNA might be lurking in that tissue. Wittmeyer, from much experience with the press since the discovery, calls this “the awful question”—whether Schweitzer’s work is paving the road to a real-life version of science fiction’s Jurassic Park, where dinosaurs were regenerated from DNA preserved in amber. But DNA, which carries the genetic script for an animal, is a very fragile molecule. It’s also ridiculously hard to study because it is so easily contaminated with modern biological material, such as microbes or skin cells, while buried or after being dug up. Instead, Schweitzer has been testing her dinosaur tissue samples for proteins, which are a bit hardier and more readily distinguished from contaminants. Specifically, she’s been looking for collagen, elastin and hemoglobin. Collagen makes up much of the bone scaffolding, elastin is wrapped around blood vessels and hemoglobin carries oxygen inside red blood cells.

Because the chemical makeup of proteins changes through evolution, scientists can study protein sequences to learn more about how dinosaurs evolved. And because proteins do all the work in the body, studying them could someday help scientists understand dinosaur physiology—how their muscles and blood vessels worked, for example.

Proteins are much too tiny to pick out with a microscope. To look for them, Schweitzer uses antibodies, immune system molecules that recognize and bind to specific sections of proteins. Schweitzer and Wittmeyer have been using antibodies to chicken collagen, cow elastin and ostrich hemoglobin to search for similar molecules in the dinosaur tissue. At an October 2005 paleontology conference, Schweitzer presented preliminary evidence that she has detected real dinosaur proteins in her specimens.

Further discoveries in the past year have shown that the discovery of soft tissue in B. rex wasn’t just a fluke. Schweitzer and Wittmeyer have now found probable blood vessels, bone-building cells and connective tissue in another T. rex, in a theropod from Argentina and in a 300,000-year-old woolly mammoth fossil. Schweitzer’s work is “showing us we really don’t understand decay,” Holtz says. “There’s a lot of really basic stuff in nature that people just make assumptions about.”

young-earth creationists also see Schweitzer’s work as revolutionary, but in an entirely different way. They first seized upon Schweitzer’s work after she wrote an article for the popular science magazine Earth in 1997 about possible red blood cells in her dinosaur specimens. Creation magazine claimed that Schweitzer’s research was “powerful testimony against the whole idea of dinosaurs living millions of years ago. It speaks volumes for the Bible’s account of a recent creation.”

This drives Schweitzer crazy. Geologists have established that the Hell Creek Formation, where B. rex was found, is 68 million years old, and so are the bones buried in it. She’s horrified that some Christians accuse her of hiding the true meaning of her data. “They treat you really bad,” she says. “They twist your words and they manipulate your data.” For her, science and religion represent two different ways of looking at the world; invoking the hand of God to explain natural phenomena breaks the rules of science. After all, she says, what God asks is faith, not evidence. “If you have all this evidence and proof positive that God exists, you don’t need faith. I think he kind of designed it so that we’d never be able to prove his existence. And I think that’s really cool.”

By definition, there is a lot that scientists don’t know, because the whole point of science is to explore the unknown. By being clear that scientists haven’t explained everything, Schweitzer leaves room for other explanations. “I think that we’re always wise to leave certain doors open,” she says.

But schweitzer’s interest in the long-term preservation of molecules and cells does have an otherworldly dimension: she’s collaborating with NASA scientists on the search for evidence of possible past life on Mars, Saturn’s moon Titan, and other heavenly bodies. (Scientists announced this spring, for instance, that Saturn’s tiny moon Enceladus appears to have liquid water, a probable precondition for life.)

Astrobiology is one of the wackier branches of biology, dealing in life that might or might not exist and might or might not take any recognizable form. “For almost everybody who works on NASA stuff, they are just in hog heaven, working on astrobiology questions,” Schweitzer says. Her NASA research involves using antibodies to probe for signs of life in unexpected places. “For me, it’s the means to an end. I really want to know about my dinosaurs.”

AdvertisementTo that purpose, Schweitzer, with Wittmeyer, spends hours in front of microscopes in dark rooms. To a fourth-generation Montanan, even the relatively laid-back Raleigh area is a big city. She reminisces wistfully about scouting for field sites on horseback in Montana. “Paleontology by microscope is not that fun,” she says. “I’d much rather be out tromping around.”

“My eyeballs are just absolutely fried,” Schweitzer says after hours of gazing through the microscope’s eyepieces at glowing vessels and blobs. You could call it the price she pays for not being typical.


TOPICS: Heated Discussion
KEYWORDS: crevolist; dinosaur; dinosaurs; evolution; godsgravesglyphs; maryschweitzer; paleontology; shocker
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To: The Ghost of FReepers Past

They are good at ridicule. Good thing I am not a sensitive person. LOL


221 posted on 05/01/2006 12:06:37 PM PDT by mlc9852
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To: Virginia-American

...Fact is, there is no *evidence* that is inconsistent with a created, adaptive biology...

And there never will be. Because *anything* is compatable with a "created biology". That's one of the reasons it's not science - there's no way to test it.

And the *exact* *same* *thing* goes for evolution, in case you are inadvertantly being selective in your criticism.

222 posted on 05/01/2006 12:08:58 PM PDT by GourmetDan
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To: freedumb2003

The Branding of a Heretic
Are religious scientists unwelcome at the Smithsonian?

BY DAVID KLINGHOFFER
Friday, January 28, 2005 12:01 a.m. EST

The question of whether Intelligent Design (ID) may be presented to public-school students alongside neo-Darwinian evolution has roiled parents and teachers in various communities lately. Whether ID may be presented to adult scientific professionals is another question altogether but also controversial. It is now roiling the government-supported Smithsonian Institution, where one scientist has had his career all but ruined over it.

The scientist is Richard Sternberg, a research associate at the Smithsonian's National Museum of Natural History in Washington. The holder of two Ph.D.s in biology, Mr. Sternberg was until recently the managing editor of a nominally independent journal published at the museum, Proceedings of the Biological Society of Washington, where he exercised final editorial authority. The August issue included typical articles on taxonomical topics--e.g., on a new species of hermit crab. It also included an atypical article, "The Origin of Biological Information and the Higher Taxonomic Categories." Here was trouble.

The piece happened to be the first peer-reviewed article to appear in a technical biology journal laying out the evidential case for Intelligent Design. According to ID theory, certain features of living organisms--such as the miniature machines and complex circuits within cells--are better explained by an unspecified designing intelligence than by an undirected natural process like random mutation and natural selection.

http://www.opinionjournal.com/taste/?id=110006220


223 posted on 05/01/2006 12:12:30 PM PDT by mlc9852
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To: DaveLoneRanger
What the hell does a mammal eating a dinosaur have to do with reconsidering evolution?

There are piles and piles of fossils out in the world that show interesting things. None have so far disproven the scientific theory of evolution. All, at this time, support it.

All you have provided me is a neet story on a different type of mammal.

224 posted on 05/01/2006 12:12:48 PM PDT by hawkaw
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To: Chiapet

So simply b/c I ask a few more questions you draw wrong conclusions from my statements, change the subject and fit me for a tin-foil hat? Peace, love, dope...


225 posted on 05/01/2006 12:12:51 PM PDT by BrandtMichaels
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To: mlc9852

How about the garden fairies? Has that been settled, or do we still need to suspend judgement? How about Piltdown Man?
How about Genesis? Shouldn't we have absolute proof of every single word in the Bible before committing ourselves to belief. What about other religions? Are you openminded about them? Do you give them equal consideration?


226 posted on 05/01/2006 12:13:58 PM PDT by js1138 (somewhere, some time ago, something happened, but whatever it was, wasn't evolution)
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To: freedumb2003
Almost all Americans believe in TToE. Really?
227 posted on 05/01/2006 12:14:49 PM PDT by The Ghost of FReepers Past (Woe unto them that call evil good, and good evil; that put darkness for light..... Isaiah 5:20)
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To: SirLinksalot

Amazing.


228 posted on 05/01/2006 12:14:57 PM PDT by hershey
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To: GourmetDan; ahayes
The fact that putrescin is still present is evidence that these fossils *aren't* 'millions of years old', not evidence that there is some unknown condition that would preserve putrescin for 'millions of years'.

Actually it can be tested, is being tested, and will continue to be tested. Its as simple as taking a air sample, examining the matter that the oder is from and determining whether the odor is from the material of a cadaver or something other. Then you might question and explain the odor.

229 posted on 05/01/2006 12:15:20 PM PDT by jec41 (Screaming Eagle)
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Comment #230 Removed by Moderator

To: js1138
I am open-minded about religion. Which one did you have in mind? However, the Bible isn't about "religion", it's about God. But I know your stance and you know mine, so why continue with the discussion? We all know God isn't allowed in public schools so there is no point in arguing. People like you and the ACLU have made sure of that. Good job.
231 posted on 05/01/2006 12:17:02 PM PDT by mlc9852
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To: mlc9852

Do you accept all religions as having equal claims to validity and truth? Yes or no?


232 posted on 05/01/2006 12:19:01 PM PDT by js1138 (somewhere, some time ago, something happened, but whatever it was, wasn't evolution)
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Comment #233 Removed by Moderator

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CrevoSci Threads for the Past Two Weeks

  1. 05/01/2006 Dinosaur Shocker (YEC say dinosaur soft tissue couldn’t possibly survive millions of years)
  2. 04/30/2006 IBM Discovery Could Shed New Light on Workings of the Human Genome
  3. 04/30/2006 Of Dodos and Filmmakers - A Reflection on Randy Olson's Flock of Dodos [Chat]
  4. 04/30/2006 This Could Be Your Oldest Relative . . .
  5. 04/30/2006 'Uniquely human' component of language found in gregarious birds
  6. 04/29/2006 The evolution of intelligent design : ID gets in philosophy classrooms of secular Knox College
  7. 04/28/2006 [Dover] Trial witness discusses evolution [Kenneth Miller]
  8. 04/28/2006 Inspiration versus Evolution [Chat]
  9. 04/28/2006 New Law Allows for Creationism in the Classroom [Mississippi]
  10. 04/28/2006 Salvage prospect for 'junk' DNA
  11. 04/28/2006 UK Government agrees creationism cannot be taught in science
  12. 04/27/2006 Ann Coulter weighs in on Darwinism [Locked]
  13. 04/27/2006 Reverse human evolution plausible, testable, U.S. biologist says
  14. 04/27/2006 Scientists offer 10 basic questions to test your knowledge (high schoolers should be able to answer)
  15. 04/27/2006 Vatican Astronomer Discusses the Harmony Between Science and Faith [Evolution & Cosmology] [Religion]
  16. 04/27/2006 When Do The Monkeys Get To Vote? (Spain's socialist party wants to give monkeys human rights)
  17. 04/26/2006 Author finds New York Darwin exhibit wanting [Religion]
  18. 04/26/2006 Evolution gets busy in the urban lab
  19. 04/26/2006 Fair Fight Over Darwinism and Design in North Carolina [Religion]
  20. 04/26/2006 Hunting fossils and fame: Author to discuss book on scientists and competition
  21. 04/26/2006 Jones talks judicial caution (but not for liberals)
  22. 04/26/2006 Seattle's Discovery Institute scrambling to rebound after intelligent-design ruling [Smoky Back Room]
  23. 04/26/2006 Songbirds May Be Able To Learn Grammar [Chat]
  24. 04/26/2006 The Other ID Opponents [Religion]
  25. 04/25/2006 Scientists Again Debating How Snakes Came to Slither
  26. 04/25/2006 Tiktaalik' Simply Shows God's Divine Design, says Ken Ham [Religion]
  27. 04/24/2006 Kennewick Man Skeletal Find May Revolutionalize Continent's History
  28. 04/24/2006 Rally at Southeast [SE Missouri State U] explores scientific evidence for creation
  29. 04/24/2006 The Theory of Evolution: Judged by Reason & Faith [Religion]
  30. 04/22/2006 Baptists Call for Public School Support
  31. 04/21/2006 Does this evolutionary claim have any legs? (The fish fossil) [Bloggers]
  32. 04/21/2006 Fossil gives clue to big chill [Smoky Back Room]
  33. 04/21/2006 Immunology in the spotlight at the Dover 'Intelligent Design' trial
  34. 04/21/2006 Java Man's First Tools
  35. 04/21/2006 Misplaced Sympathies: Darwin isn't the enemy. Conservatives [should not treat] him as one. [Smoky Back Room]
  36. 04/20/2006 Have Particle Masses Changed since the Early Universe?
  37. 04/19/2006 A Fish With Feet? [Bloggers]
  38. 04/19/2006 Branchless Evolution: Fossils point to single hominid root
  39. 04/19/2006 Scientific Illiteracy and the Partisan Takeover of Biology [Smoky Back Room]
  40. 04/19/2006 Scientists Describe Huge Meat-Eating Dinosaur (Remains Discovered In Argentina)
  41. 04/19/2006 Two-Legged Fossil Indicates Snakes Evolved on Land
  42. 04/18/2006 Darwin is a Problem for Jews [Religion]
  43. 04/18/2006 Fact versus fiction: the recent Ethiopian fossils [Bloggers]
  44. 04/18/2006 We believe in ET, not ID [Darwin, SETI, & ID in one thread!]

These Past Two Weeks in CrevoSci History

  1. 05/01/2004 Darwin-Free Fun for Creationists
  2. 05/01/2003 Cloning to generate organisms, be they mice or humans, is a dead end
  3. 05/01/2001 Possible Key Step In The Origin Of Life Identified
  4. 05/01/2000 NASA shows new 'baby pictures' images of infant Universe [Thread II]
  5. 04/30/2005 Evolution debate turns into debate over intelligent design [farcical 'debate' approaching]
  6. 04/30/2005 National Geographic Gets It Right [Religion]
  7. 04/30/2005 Origin of life: the chirality problem (Creation vs. evolution) [Bloggers]
  8. 04/28/2005 Darwin's Passion for Hunting and Killing [Bloggers]
  9. 04/28/2005 Human/chimp DNA similarity - Evidence for evolutionary relationship? [Bloggers]
  10. 04/28/2005 Intelligent Design and the Mysteries of Life (Video)
  11. 04/28/2005 The Creation Debate II (Vanity) [Bloggers]
  12. 04/27/2005 Discovery of 450 Million Years Old 'Missing Link'
  13. 04/27/2005 Intelligent design: Who has designs on your students' minds?
  14. 04/27/2005 This History Book is Different: It's True - Setting the Record Straight-(American myths & realities)
  15. 04/27/2005 Walking whales, nested hierarchies, and chimeras: do they exist? (Crevo: Whales evolution) 13
  16. 04/26/2005 DNA with Three Base Pairs—A Step Towards Expanding the Genetic Code
  17. 04/26/2005 Evolution debate hits Gull Lake schools (ID Teachers 'academic freedom' under attack)
  18. 04/26/2005 Kansas State Board of Education Taking Up Evolution Debate
  19. 04/26/2005 Man Needs To Know God Created All Things [Religion]
  20. 04/26/2005 The history of the teaching of human female inferiority in Darwinism [Bloggers]
  21. 04/25/2005 Evolution, Creation, and Thermodynamics (Positive additions to DNA don't happen, mates!) [Bloggers]
  22. 04/25/2005 'Intelligent Design: Yesterday’s Orthodoxy, Today’s Heresy' [Religion]
  23. 04/25/2005 Of mice and men — and the monsters in-between (Creation vs. Evolution) [Bloggers]
  24. 04/23/2005 Norman Newell, 96, Scientist Who Studied Dying Species, Has Died
  25. 04/22/2005 Evolution puts state in spotlight [Kansas]
  26. 04/21/2005 Inside the Mind of a Creationist (Hope is Alive in California!)
  27. 04/21/2005 'John P. Marcus, biochemistry' Evidence of design, Creation: DNA (Vanity) [Chat]
  28. 04/20/2005 And the ancient fossil’s name was Nelson
  29. 04/20/2005 Details set for debate on science standards [Evolution in Kansas?]
  30. 04/20/2005 Exceptional whale fossil found in Egyptian desert
  31. 04/20/2005 First light from extrasolar planets (detected)
  32. 04/20/2005 Odd fly uncovers evolution secret [speciation]
  33. 04/20/2005 WSU names intelligent design foe to new professorship
  34. 04/20/2005 Yellowstone Discovery Bodes Well for Finding Evidence of Life on Mars
  35. 04/19/2005 What about carbon dating? (Creation vs. Evolution)
  36. 04/30/2004 Shell Beads From South African Cave Show Modern Human Behavior 75,000 Years Ago
  37. 04/29/2004 Another God That Failed
  38. 04/29/2004 Charred Remains May Be Earliest Human Fires (Israel - 800k yo)
  39. 04/29/2004 Computer experiments are transforming mathematics
  40. 04/29/2004 No evolution for Italian teens
  41. 04/28/2004 Neanderthals Matured Faster Than Modern Man -Study
  42. 04/28/2004 Noah's Ark Found? Turkey Expedition Planned For Summer
  43. 04/28/2004 Study: Neanderthals Grew Up Much Faster
  44. 04/27/2004 Evidence for Creation
  45. 04/27/2004 Stop Teaching Our Kids this Evolution Claptrap! [Pulled]
  46. 04/26/2004 Darwin’s Doubters: Changing Paradigms, Intelligently [Smoky Back Room]
  47. 04/26/2004 Professor Blows New Life Into Ancient Flute (China - 8,000 years old)
  48. 04/26/2004 Study Finds Signs of Life in Ancient Lava
  49. 04/26/2004 Synthetic Life
  50. 04/25/2004 Archaeological Evidence Shows Ancient Coastal Life
  51. 04/25/2004 Rocking The Cradle (Older Than Mesopotamia, Iran?)
  52. 04/24/2004 Noted evolutionary biologist Maynard Smith dies [Smoky Back Room]
  53. 04/23/2004 Creationism Evolves
  54. 04/23/2004 Lack of females may have done in dinosaurs, says study
  55. 04/22/2004 Finding God in the Heavens: Recent discoveries in space can be cause for praise [Religion]
  56. 04/22/2004 Theorist: Darwin Had it Wrong
  57. 04/21/2004 Lack of Females May Have Done in Dinosaurs
  58. 04/21/2004 Scientists conceive mouse with two moms
  59. 04/20/2004 Hemoglobin Ancestors Offer Clues to Earliest Oxygen-Based Life [blow to Intelligent Design]
  60. 04/20/2004 Rock Art Hints At Whaling Origins (6,000 BC)
  61. 04/20/2004 Scientists Win New Battle Over Skeleton (Kennewick Man)
  62. 04/19/2004 Union of Concerned Scientists Charges Bush With Politicizing Science
  63. 04/29/2003 The Dini-gration of Darwinism
  64. 04/28/2003 Lucky discovery uncovers cancer-proof mouse
  65. 04/28/2003 Religion versus science might be all in the mind
  66. 04/26/2003 Group Probes Adaptation of Birds, Flowers
  67. 04/25/2003 Hominid fossils show their age
  68. 04/25/2003 Researchers stake fresh claim to early human ancestry
  69. 04/24/2003 DOJ: State Schools Not in Business of Dictating What Students Should Believe
  70. 04/23/2003 High marks on evolution instruction upset Fair
  71. 04/23/2003 Scientific views of Biblical miracles [Religion]
  72. 04/22/2003 Pseudoscience vs. Snobbery: A Doonesbury lesson.
  73. 04/29/2002 Odds Are Stacked When Science Tries to Debate Pseudoscience
  74. 04/25/2002 From Earth to Mars: a blushing weed
  75. 04/25/2002 Questioning the Big Bang
  76. 04/25/2002 The Myth of the Flat Earth [Religion]
  77. 04/25/2002 Two Carnegie scientists report discovery of human ancestor
  78. 04/24/2002 Tree-climbing with dinosaurs
  79. 04/23/2002 Creationist Site Says: 'Mac Users, You Are Godless Communists!'
  80. 04/23/2002 Neanderthals 'used violence'
  81. 04/23/2002 OBJECTIVE: Creation Education [Religion]
  82. 04/22/2002 OBJECTIVE: Creation Education
  83. 04/21/2002 Cells reprogram in 24 hours
  84. 04/21/2002 The Tower of Babel
  85. 04/20/2002 The Truth for Youth: The Stupidest Comics Ever
  86. 04/19/2002 The Revision of Ancient History - A Perspective
  87. 04/27/2001 Historical Evidence Refuting a 6,000-Year Old Earth (Thread II)
  88. 04/26/2001 Historical Evidence Refuting a 6,000-Year Old Earth
  89. 04/25/2001 How closely related are humans to apes and other animals? [Thread 3]
  90. 04/25/2001 New Dinosaur Fossil Ruffles Feathers
  91. 04/24/2001 Do You Believe in Evolution? Thread Two
  92. 04/24/2001 Evolution vs. Intelligent Design
  93. 04/24/2001 How closely related are humans to apes and other animals? [Thread 2]
  94. 04/23/2001 How closely related are humans to apes and other animals?
  95. 04/21/2001 Study Indicates Europeans Descended From Only Hundreds of Africans
  96. 04/21/2001 WHY EVOLUTION IS WRONG
  97. 04/27/2000 NASA shows new 'baby pictures' images of infant Universe

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234 posted on 05/01/2006 12:19:36 PM PDT by Junior (Identical fecal matter, alternate diurnal period)
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To: js1138

All religions? I can't answer that because I don't know what "all religions" state. Maybe you can help me out here.


235 posted on 05/01/2006 12:20:12 PM PDT by mlc9852
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To: DaveLoneRanger

My rec time is sometimes very limited and always erratic. Mostly I use the page as a personal reference dump to pull out as needed.

I'm glad you found some useful info there, though.


236 posted on 05/01/2006 12:22:09 PM PDT by From many - one.
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To: mlc9852

Do you accept any religion as valid?


237 posted on 05/01/2006 12:22:09 PM PDT by js1138 (somewhere, some time ago, something happened, but whatever it was, wasn't evolution)
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Comment #238 Removed by Moderator

To: mlc9852

They're only synonyms if you use the Humpty Dumpty appraoch.


239 posted on 05/01/2006 12:23:29 PM PDT by From many - one.
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To: Rhadaghast
I'm with ya.

You have mail.

240 posted on 05/01/2006 12:23:45 PM PDT by Manic_Episode (Some mornings, it's just not worth chewing through the leather straps...)
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