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Paper reignites hobbit debate
Australian Broadcasting Corporation ^ | Tuesday, 22 August 2006 | unattributed

Posted on 08/22/2006 10:17:42 PM PDT by SunkenCiv

[T]wo of the original Australian discoverers of the hobbit, Professor Peter Brown and Professor Mike Morwood from the University of New England, have lashed out at the researchers, rejecting arguments put forward in the latest paper. Professor Brown also criticises the journal itself for publishing the research.

He says the paper's conclusions are "unsupported by any published evidence" and that the paper makes "misleading comments" about previously published papers.

Australian National University taxonomist Professor Colin Groves, who was not involved in the research, also rejects the PNAS paper.

"Most of their claims of pathology are not substantial," says Professor Groves, who has a paper due out in the Journal of Human Evolution rejecting the microcephaly theory.

Professor Brown says putting aside the scientific argument itself, PNAS should not have published the research because of what he says is the research team's "unethical scientific practice", a claim the authors reject...

Professor Brown also says the material was damaged beyond repair while being studied...

Overall, Professor Brown thinks the conduct of the PNAS authors amounts to bad behaviour.

"I can't think of a more extreme example of unethical scientific practice," says Professor Brown, "For PNAS to reward their behaviour casts aspersions on the journal."

(Excerpt) Read more at ...

TOPICS: History; Science; Travel
KEYWORDS: flores; godsgravesglyphs; hobbit; homofloresiensis; mikemorwood; multiregionalism
There's already been at least one such topic, but this one has more detail, and isn't from one of the more gunfight-y lists. :') No offense is intended toward any FReepers, particularly keepers of the lists. It's a big, huge, gigantic job, and I appreciate all those involved.
1 posted on 08/22/2006 10:17:43 PM PDT by SunkenCiv
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To: blam; FairOpinion; StayAt HomeMother; Ernest_at_the_Beach; 24Karet; 3AngelaD; ...
To all -- please ping me to other topics which are appropriate for the GGG list. Thanks.
Please FREEPMAIL me if you want on or off the
"Gods, Graves, Glyphs" PING list or GGG weekly digest
-- Archaeology/Anthropology/Ancient Cultures/Artifacts/Antiquities, etc.
Gods, Graves, Glyphs (alpha order)

2 posted on 08/22/2006 10:18:02 PM PDT by SunkenCiv (updated my FR profile on Thursday, August 10, 2006.
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Hobbit remains found in Australia
  Posted by presidio9
On General/Chat 10/27/2004 1:51:55 PM EDT · 157 replies · 4,112+ views

Reuters | Wed, Oct 27, 2004 | Patricia Reaney
Scientists in Australia have found a new species of hobbit-sized humans who lived about 18,000 years ago on an Indonesian island in a discovery that adds another piece to the complex puzzle of human evolution. The partial skeleton of Homo floresiensis, found in a cave on the island of Flores, is of an adult female that was a metre (3 feet) tall, had a chimpanzee-sized brain and was substantially different from modern humans. It shared the isolated island to the east of Java with miniature elephants and Komodo dragons. The creature walked upright, probably evolved into its dwarf size because...

Prehistoric dwarf astounds scientists / Island discovery could rewrite human evolution
  Posted by Former Military Chick
On News/Activism 10/28/2004 8:25:14 AM EDT · 51 replies · 1,205+ views

Deseret News | October 28, 2004 | Joseph B. Verrengia
In an astonishing discovery that could rewrite the history of human evolution, scientists say they have found the skeleton of a new human species, a dwarf, marooned for eons in a tropical Lost World while modern man rapidly colonized the rest of the planet. Chris Stringer, director of human origins studies at the Natural History Museum in London, holds a cast taken from a skull that is said to be that of a new species in the evolution of humans named Flores Man. Richard Lewis, Associated Press Chris Stringer, director of human origins studies at the Natural History Museum in...

Do little people go to heaven?: If the 3' tall hominids were rational, did they have immortal souls?
  Posted by Destro
On Religion 11/08/2004 12:37:12 AM EST · 33 replies · 574+ views | 6 November 2004 | Christopher Howse
Issue: 6 November 2004 Do little people go to heaven?If the three-foot-tall hominids of Flores were rational, did they have immortal souls? asks Christopher Howse When they showed on television the cave on the island of Flores where the remains of little people had been found, I felt, I admit, a Yeatsian frisson that the world of politics cannot give. It was not delight at a new branch on the hat-stand of anthropoid evolution, but the thought that in the thick Indonesian rainforest there were (or had been, perhaps as recently as the time when dodos lived) creatures with whom...

Great site for info on aliens and stuff!
  Posted by Jwinters
On General/Chat 11/25/2004 1:28:06 AM EST · 6 replies · 2,217+ views

New York Times | Oct. 28, 2004 | NICHOLAS WADE
Hobbit Sized Race of Humans Found. - Once upon a time, but not so long ago, on a tropical island midway between Asia and Australia, there lived a race of little people, whose adults stood just 3 1/2 feet tall. Despite their stature, they were mighty hunters. They made stone tools to spear giant rats, clubbed sleeping dragons and hunted the packs of pygmy elephants that roamed their "lost world."

Anthropologist Claims Humans, Neanderthals, Australopithecines All Variations on One Species
  Posted by bondserv
On News/Activism 01/03/2005 12:41:39 AM EST · 83 replies · 9,308+ views

Creation-Evolution Headlines | 01/01/2005 | Creation-Evolution Headlines
Anthropologist Claims Humans, Neanderthals, Australopithecines All Variations on One Species† †01/01/2005 According to a news story in the UK News Telegraph, all fossil hominims, including modern humans, Australopithecines, Neandertals and the recent Indonesian ìhobbit man,î belong to the same species: Homo sapiens.† Reporter Robert Matthews wrote about Maciej Henneberg (U of Adelaide) and his argument, based on skull sizes and body weights for 200 fossil specimens, that all known hominim bones fit within the range of variation expected for a single species.† Henneberg made the startling claim in the Journal of Comparative Human Biology, where he said, ìAll hominims appear...

New species may have relatives in next villlage
  Posted by aculeus
On News/Activism 01/12/2005 8:52:22 PM EST · 22 replies · 790+ views

The Guardian (UK) | January 13, 2005 | John Vidal
A growing number of scientists are challenging the sensational discovery last year of a new species of one-metre-tall intelligent humans whose 13,000-year-old bones were said to have been found in an Indonesian cave. According to some leading anthropologists in Australia, Indonesia and elsewhere, Homo floresiensis is not "one of the most important discoveries of the last 150 years" as was widely reported last October, but a pygmy version of modern Homo sapiens with a not uncommon brain disease. Now a leading critic of the Homo floresiensis theory is to send researchers to a village near the cave where the bones...

Bones of contention(Discovery of a new species of human astounds the world,but is it what it seems?)
  Posted by nickcarraway
On News/Activism 01/13/2005 4:08:28 AM EST · 23 replies · 1,592+ views

Guardian (U.K.) | Thursday January 13, 2005 | John Vidal
The discovery of a new species of human astounded the world. But is it what it seems? John Vidal went to remotest Flores to find out If you want to understand human evolution, it may be worth starting with Johannes Daak from the remote village of Akel in the heavily forested centre of the Indonesian island of Flores. Johannes, from the Manggarai ethnic group, reckons he is 100 years old and says he owes his longevity and enduring strength to having only ever known one woman. He says he owes his stature to his ancestors. Johannes is no more than...

'Hobbit' Brain Supports Species Theory
  Posted by 1LongTimeLurker
On News/Activism 03/03/2005 3:57:01 PM EST · 26 replies · 11,721+ views

Yahoo News | 3/3/05 | Joseph Verrengia
Scientists working with powerful imaging computers say the spectacular "Hobbit" fossil recently discovered in Indonesia had distinctive brain features that could justify its classification as a separate ó and tiny ó human ancestor. The new report, published Thursday in the online journal Science Express, seems to support the idea of a human dwarf species marooned for eons while modern man spread across the planet. Detractors of the theory, however, said the computer models were unconvincing. The new research produced a computer-generated model that compared surface impressions on the inside of the fossil skull with brain casts of modern and ancient...

Australian Scientist Disputes 'Hobbit' Findings (Stop evolution lies - petition)
  Posted by Truth666
On General/Chat 03/06/2005 4:19:07 PM EST · 26 replies · 750+ views | March 6, 2005
An Australian academic who has examined the skeletal remains of a three-foot hominid discovered in an Indonesian cave and nicknamed a "hobbit" disputed Friday a report that they represent a new species of human. Professor Maciej Henneberg, head of anatomy at Adelaide University, said he thought the bones found in 2003 on Indonesia's Flores island were simply those of a normal human stunted by a viral disease, microcephaly -- a conclusion rejected in the earlier report by another team of scientists. That team analyzed the find and said the partial skeleton was evidence of a new, dwarf species of human....

Bones of Contention: A bad bill would throttle American archaeology.
  Posted by The Great Yazoo
On News/Activism 04/14/2005 4:24:33 PM EDT · 11 replies · 503+ views | April 14, 2005 | John J. Miller
If a lucky paleoanthropologist ever unearths hobbit bones on federal land, scientists wonít get to study them ó at least not if Sen. John McCain and his allies have their way. Iím not joking about hobbits. Really. You may recall the astonishing reports last year about the discovery of Homo floresiensis, a previously unknown species of human that lived as recently as 13,000 years ago ó more recently than the Neanderthals. And unlike the Neanderthals, who are usually described as nasty and brutish, the Flores people were short. A fully grown adult would have been about the same size as...

Bones Of Contention ('Hobbits' - More)
  Posted by blam
On News/Activism 05/30/2005 7:35:41 PM EDT · 10 replies · 510+ views

Time - Asia | 5-30-2005 | John Stanmeyer
Bones of ContentionIs a small, 18,000-year-old skeleton the older cousin of modern-day Pygmiesóor a new human species? BY SIMON ELEGANT | RAMPASASA JOHN STANMEYER FOR TIMESMALL WORLD: Rampasasa resident Anggalus Jalur, 55, stands just 130 cm tall "In those days we ate our meat raw, like animals." The speaker is Viktor Jurubu, an Indonesian farmer in his 60s, who, in his T shirt and sarong, looks little like the cavemen he's describing. Except for his height, which is about 140 cm. In the world of anthropology, Jurubu's small size is big news because he and his 246 fellow villagers of...

Small Brain Did Not Stop Hobbit Having Big Ideas
  Posted by blam
On News/Activism 09/16/2005 10:05:03 PM EDT · 18 replies · 574+ views

The Telegraph (UK) | 9-8-2005 | Nic Fleming/Roger highfield
Small brain did not stop Hobbit having big ideas By Nic Fleming and Roger Highfield in Dublin (Filed: 08/09/2005) A fossil of a diminutive human nicknamed "the Hobbit" does indeed represent a previously unrecognised species of early Man, according to a new technique that suggests it was a cultured little fellow. Sceptics had argued that the Hobbit, discovered in Indonesia and first announced last year, could have been an individual who suffered from microcephalya, a disorder that limits brain growth. The fossils' discoverers had suggested that the Hobbit was either a pygmy form of a known species or a previously...

More bones of hobbit-sized humans discovered
  Posted by aculeus
On General/Chat 10/11/2005 11:34:12 AM EDT · 84 replies · 1,809+ views

Reuters | October 11, 2005 | By Patricia Reaney
LONDON (Reuters) - Australian scientists said on Tuesday they have discovered more remains of hobbit-sized humans which belong to a previously unknown species that lived at the end of the last Ice Age. Professor Mike Morwood, of the University of New England, in Armidale, Australia, stunned the science world last year when he and his team announced the discovery of 18,000-year-old remains of a new human species called Homo floresiensis. The partial skeleton discovered in a limestone cave on the remote Indonesian island of Flores in 2003 was of a tiny adult hominid, or early human, only one meter (3...

Anthropologists Uncover Ancient Jawbone
  Posted by NormsRevenge
On News/Activism 10/11/2005 12:47:00 PM EDT · 19 replies · 734+ views

ap on Yahoo | 10/11/05 | Joseph B. Verrengia - AP
Scientists digging in a remote Indonesian cave have uncovered a jaw bone that they say adds more evidence that a tiny prehistoric Hobbit-like species once existed. The jaw is from the ninth individual believed to have lived as recently as 12,000 years ago. The bones are in a wet cave on the island of Flores in the eastern limb of the Indonesian archipelago, near Australia. The research team which reported the original sensational finding nearly a year ago strongly believes that the skeletons belong to a separate species of early human that shared Earth with modern humans far more recently...

New finds of human ancestor jumble evolutionary puzzle
  Posted by Crackingham
On News/Activism 10/13/2005 11:12:50 AM EDT · 167 replies · 2,524+ views

Christian Science Monitor | 10/13/5 | Peter N. Spotts
In their study of the evolutionary ladder, scientists have found that modern humans rubbed elbows with some colorful cousins. But few have been as puzzling as a purported cousin unearthed on the Indonesian island of Flores. The partial skeleton, first reported last October, was stunning. Estimated to stand just over three feet tall, it offered the tantalizing possibility that a new species of mini-human lived 18,000 years ago. But some researchers dismissed the find as a pygmy or the result of a physical defect. Now the research team that gave the world the hobbit-like Homo floresiensis has found what it...

Hobbits May Be Earliest Australians
  Posted by blam
On News/Activism 12/07/2005 6:01:40 PM EST · 22 replies · 523+ views

The Australian | 12-8-2005 | Carmelo Amalfi/Leigh Dayton
Hobbits may be earliest Australians Carmelo Amalfi and Leigh Dayton December 08, 2005 THE tiny hobbit-like humans of Indonesia may have lived in Australia before they became extinct about 11,000 years ago. The startling claim comes from archaeologist Mike Morwood, leader of the team that in 2003 uncovered remains of the 1m-tall hominid at Liang Bua cave on Indonesia's Flores island. They believe the pint-size person - known officially as Homo floresiensis and unofficially as the "Hobbit" - was wiped out by a volcanic eruption that spared their Homo sapiens neighbours. Speaking at a public lecture in Perth, Professor Morwood...

Ancient Islanders Get A Leg Up ('Hobbits')
  Posted by blam
On General/Chat 05/16/2006 3:45:36 PM EDT · 12 replies · 535+ views

Science News | 5-16-2006 | Bruce Bower
Ancient islanders get a leg up Bruce Bower From San Juan, Puerto Rico, at the Paleoanthropology Society and Society for American Archaeology meeting Fossils of a humanlike species dubbed Homo floresiensis that lived on the Pacific island of Flores between 18,000 and 12,000 years ago recently grabbed headlines because scientists deduced that this creature stood no more than 1 meter tall and possessed a surprisingly small brain. Nonetheless, H. floresiensis packed considerable weight on its diminutive frame and possessed far stronger legs than people do today, says William L. Jungers of the State University of New York at Stony Brook....

"Hobbit" Humans Were Diseased, Not New Species, Study Says
  Posted by nickcarraway
On General/Chat 05/18/2006 6:00:14 PM EDT · 5 replies · 314+ views

National Geographic News | May 18, 2006 | John Roach
The "hobbit" humans that lived on the Indonesian island of Flores some 18,000 years ago were actually a population of modern humans stricken with a genetic disease that causes small brains, a new study says. The argument is being made by a group of scientists who have analyzed all the scientific evidence presented so far about the evolution of the proposed species Homo floresiensis. The discovery of the hobbit-like humanóso-called for their small statureówas first announced in 2004 after a fossil skull and bones of several individuals turned up on Flores. Preliminary analysis of the remains pegged them as belonging...

Debate on Little Human Fossil Enters Major Scientific Forum
  Posted by Pharmboy
On News/Activism 05/19/2006 6:09:39 AM EDT · 25 replies · 599+ views

NY Times | May 19, 2006 | JOHN NOBLE WILFORD
Ira Block/National GeographicSome scientists say this skull, smaller than those of modern humans, is from a newfound species. Not all scientists agree that the 18,000-year-old "little people" fossils found on the Indonesian island of Flores should be designated an extinct human-related species. Some expressed their opposition in news interviews and informal symposiums, but papers arguing their case were rejected by major journals. snip... In today's issue of the journal Science, researchers led by Robert D. Martin of the Field Museum in Chicago present evidence they say supports their main argument, that the skull in question is not that of...

Indonesia's Hobbits lose their magic
  Posted by Mikey_1962
On News/Activism 05/19/2006 1:18:17 PM EDT · 4 replies · 423+ views

The Age | 5/19/06 | Mikey_1962
NEW report disputes scientists' claims that bones of a dwarf human discovered on an Indonesian island are those of an entirely new human species. The 18,000-year-old bones found on Flores Island in 2003 were given the scientific name Homo floresiensis, and the nickname "Hobbit" after the diminutive figures in J. R. R. Tolkien's novel. Anthropologists from Australia and Indonesia said it was an entirely new human species. The discovery of a new hominid excited scientists around the world. But a group of scientists led by primatologist Robert Martin said in the May 19 issue of Science magazine that the bones...

Homo Floresiensis: tiny toolmaker or microcephalic? (The debate continues)
  Posted by S0122017
On General/Chat 06/01/2006 10:43:39 AM EDT · 5 replies · 144+ views

nature news | 31 may | dude #4352
Old tools shed light on hobbit origins Tiny toolmaker or microcephalic? The 'hobbit' debate continues. Michael Hopkin They may have been tiny, but the hobbits of the Indonesian island of Flores are still the focus of the biggest controversy in anthropology. The latest twist in the tale suggests that these one-metre-tall hominids, with a brain the size of a grapefruit, were the final members of a tool-making tradition stretching back more than 800,000 years. But amid fresh doubts over the species' evolutionary history, the idea that the curious creatures were deformed modern humans refuses to go away. Tools from Liang...

Hobbits don't exist; ancient skeleton not a pygmy human species
  Posted by DaveLoneRanger
On News/Activism 08/21/2006 5:21:11 PM EDT · 13 replies · 497+ views | August 21, 2006 | Penn State
The skeletal remains found in a cave on the island of Flores, Indonesia, reported in 2004, do not represent a new species as then claimed, but some of the ancestors of modern human pygmies who live on the island today, according to an international scientific team. The researchers also demonstrate that the fairly complete skeleton designated LB1 is microcephalic, while other remains excavated from the site share LB1's small stature but show no evidence of microcephaly, since no other brain cases are known. Microcephaly is a condition in which the head and brain are much smaller than average for the...

Paper reignites hobbit debate
  Posted by SunkenCiv
On General/Chat 08/23/2006 1:17:42 AM EDT · 1 reply · 1+ view

Australian Broadcasting Corporation | Tuesday, 22 August 2006 | unattributed
[T]wo of the original Australian discoverers of the hobbit, Professor Peter Brown and Professor Mike Morwood from the University of New England, have lashed out at the researchers, rejecting arguments put forward in the latest paper. Professor Brown also criticises the journal itself for publishing the research. He says the paper's conclusions are "unsupported by any published evidence" and that the paper makes "misleading comments" about previously published papers. Australian National University taxonomist Professor Colin Groves, who was not involved in the research, also rejects the PNAS paper. "Most of their claims of pathology are not substantial," says Professor Groves,...

3 posted on 08/22/2006 10:59:32 PM PDT by SunkenCiv (updated my FR profile on Thursday, August 10, 2006.
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To: SunkenCiv

I find it all "Hobbit" forming, LOL!

4 posted on 08/23/2006 6:55:53 AM PDT by Anne of DC (Boycott all Bush-bashing threads!)
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To: SunkenCiv
They found a partial skeleton in a cave and have concluded from that partial skeleton it is from a new species of human?

Seems more than a little far fetched!

5 posted on 08/23/2006 7:01:36 AM PDT by Dustbunny (The BIBLE - Basic Instructions Before Leaving Earth)
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To: Anne of DC


6 posted on 08/23/2006 9:50:49 AM PDT by SunkenCiv (updated my FR profile on Thursday, August 10, 2006.
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To: SunkenCiv


7 posted on 08/23/2006 10:41:47 AM PDT by Anne of DC (Boycott all Bush-bashing threads!)
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To: Anne of DC

Well, it's only right, because after all, the title of the article included "paper reignites". ;')

8 posted on 08/23/2006 12:14:38 PM PDT by SunkenCiv (updated my FR profile on Thursday, August 10, 2006.
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To: Corin Stormhands

Thought a hobbit man might find this interesting.

9 posted on 08/23/2006 6:12:10 PM PDT by Flora McDonald (got teufelhunden?)
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To: SunkenCiv

Miniature humanoids and elephants.

Why has no one postulated that the reason for the miniaturization is that 18,000 years ago the ocean was 400 feet lower, and the island was therefore much larger. As the water level rose the larger animals had to shrink to gt enough to eat and survive. Seems logical to me.

10 posted on 08/24/2006 12:53:11 AM PDT by gleeaikin
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