Maureen Dowd: Fight really about controlling women, not birth

The Contra Costa Times / The New York Times ^ | May 28, 2012 | Maureen Dowd

[2ndDivisionVet]

Your parents spill a few secrets as they get older.

One night at dinner with my mom, I ventured that the rhythm method had worked well for her, given that there were six years between my sister Peggy and my brother Kevin, and six more between Kevin and me. She arched an eyebrow.

"Well, sometimes your father used something," she said.

My parents were the most devout Catholics I've ever known. But my dad came from a family of 16 in County Clare in Ireland, and my mom's mother came from a family of 13 in County Mayo. So they balanced their faith with a dose of practicality.

After their first three kids, they sagely decided family planning was not soul-staining. So I wasn't surprised to see the Gallup poll last week showing that 82 percent of U.S. Catholics say birth control is morally acceptable. (Eighty-nine percent of all Americans and 90 percent of non-Catholics agreed.) Gallup tested the morality of 18 issues, and birth control came out on top as the most acceptable, beating divorce, which garnered 67 percent approval, and "buying and wearing clothing made of animal fur," which got a 60 percent thumbs-up (more from Republicans, naturally, than Democrats).

Polygamy, cloning humans and having an affair took the most morally offensive spots on the list. "Gay or lesbian relations" tied "having a baby outside of marriage," with 54 percent approving. That's in the middle of the list, above a 38 percent score for abortion and below a 59 percent score for "sex between an unmarried man and woman."

The poll appeared on the same day as headlines about Catholic Church leaders fighting President Barack Obama's attempt to get insurance coverage for contraception for women who work or go to college at Catholic institutions....

[2ndDivisionVet]

She never changes.

[SevenofNine]

Now I could understand why Michael Douglas dump her LOL!

Kirk Douglas count his stars having living to last years on this planet not having her as daughter in law

[SevenofNine]

Now I could understand why Michael Douglas dump her LOL!

Kirk Douglas count his stars having living to last years on this planet not having her as daughter in law

[icwhatudo]

One night at dinner with my mom, I ventured that the rhythm method had worked well for her...

"Well, sometimes your father used something," she said.

What classy dinner conversation. These people are sick.

[berdie]

That is an odd conversation to have at dinner.

I wonder if her dad bought his own protection...or did the church provide it in anyway?

[Salvation]

Contraception is not for you, Maureen? Perhaps you need to do a little studying and save your soul.

Contraceptives and the Environment - What the Pill Is Doing to Our Water Supply
Melinda Gates: I’m Catholic and contraception is not controversial
Catholics Urged to Imitate St. Thomas More in Contraception Battle
Essays for Lent: Contraception

The Differences the Pill has Made
Pastors Preach Against Contraception From Pulpit
Catholics and Contraception: Boston, 1965
Abortion, Contraception and the Church Fathers (Catholic teaching unchanged for 2000 yrs)
Contraception and Catholicism (What the Roman Catholic Church really teaches)
6 Reasons Why Contraception is Sinful and Contrary to God's Will
Time To Admit It: The Church Has Always Been Right On Birth Control
Paul VI: “danger of this power passing into the hands of those public authorities ...”
The Truth about The Church's Teaching about Contraception.
Letter from Archbishop John G. Vlazny on the matter of freedom of conscience and decisions by HHS

Bishop Olmsted's Letter to Catholics [Catholic Caucus]
Liberty for the Amish & Quakers but not Catholics. . .
Contraception mandate prompts Peoria bishop to instate St. Michael Prayer (Catholic Caucus)
Phoenix bishop (Olmstead): defy feds on birth control
A letter from Archbishop Dennis M. Schnurr concerning HHS edict
Speak honestly: abortion is ‘the killing of tiny human beings in the womb’ – Denver bishop
Bishop [Daniel Jenky] Blasts Secularist Intolerance, Calls For ‘Assertive Action’ to Defend Church
(Pittsburgh Bishop Zubik comments:) HHS delays rule on contraceptive coverage
Dolan: Natural law, not religious preference, dictates all life sacred
Religious leaders blast HHS over contraception mandate

Mandated Contraception, Sterilization: Caesar Demands Church Violate Conscience
OBAMA’S CONTEMPT FOR RELIGIOUS LIBERTY (mandates coverage of sterilization & contraception)
Obama Admin Decides to Require Religious Institutions to Cover Free Contraception
Jews and Evangelicals stand with Church against contraception mandate
Obama Supporters Worried He May Grant Contraception Exemptions to Catholic Hospitals
Catholic college sues HHS over contraception mandate
Children of the Reformation: A Short & Surprising History of Protestantism & Contraception
Implications of Obama Admin move to force Cath hospitals to provide contraception and sterilizations
Catholic doctors’ group launches petition against contraception mandate
Contraception mandate tramples religious freedom, US bishops say

Planned Parenthood Cuts Contraception, Not Abortion After De-Funding
Contraception underlying cause of breakdown of family, sexual morality, says expert
Contraception: The Reason Catholics Have Abandoned Confession
U.S. Bishops’ Publication Urges Priests to Preach on Contraception, Sterilization, IVF
Contraception: The Bitter Pill
Catholic Bishops Warn of ‘Civil Disobedience’ Over Contraceptives [Philippines]
Relationships Market After 50 Years of The Pill
Contraception: The Bacteria Devouring America’s Soul
Christians examine morality of birth control [Ecumenical/Orthodox Presbyterian]
The Cost of Contraception: Women's Health - Response to CNN

The Connection between Contraception and Abortion
Baby Bust: The Demographics of Global Depression
The Surest Sign of a Decadent Culture
Protestants and Birth Control
The Protest of a Protestant Minister Against Birth Control
Contraception: Why Not?
The Bible & Birth Control
Our Gravest Moral Responsibility: Convert the Contraception Mentality
Contraception and Conversion
Evangelical Leaders are Ok with Contraception

The pill and 50 years of misery [the pill kills!]
The dawn of demonic deception [the birth control pill]
Researcher finds strong link between contraception and HIV
The Birth-Control Riddle
Social Science Proves Humanae Vitae
"Contraception Is Wrong. Now Here's How You Use It . . ."
Suit claims birth control warning not enough
Natural and Unnatural (father of 5 shocks mother of 1)
Planned Parenthood Uses Teens to Distribute Injectable Birth Control in Rural Ecuador
Study: Low-Dose Birth Control Pills Decrease Bone Density in Young Women
Spanish drug agency confirms grave effects of morning-after pill

Another Woman Dies of Hormonal Contraceptive in Switzerland
Study Finds Half of Women on "Birth Control Shot" Suffer Bone Problems
The Re-Birth of Population Control: Human Life Seen as a Carbon roblem
Radio Replies First Volume - Birth Control
Abortion, birth control pill linked to breast cancer, surgeon says
God before contraception (Australia)
Fighting the 'contraceptive mentality'
Birth control pill creator regrets population decline
Polluted Water, Polluted Culture (one more consequence from contraception)
Abortifacients -- The Other Forbidden Grief

NFP and Contraception: What’s the Difference?
Wisconsin requiring Catholic institutions to provide contraceptives coverage
Contraception: The history you may have missed and would rather not know
Why does Pope Benedict talk about Humanae vitae in the new encyclical? [Catholic Caucus]
New Evangelical Documentary Exposes Abortifacient Qualities of the Birth Control Pill, Promotes NFP
In Quiverfull Movement, Birth Control Is Shunned
Press in a Dither Again over Pope’s Reaffirmation of Catholic Teaching
How Birth Control Changed America for the Worst
If You Are Contracepting, You Are Part of A Very Big Problem

Vatican and Italian government criticize sale of RU 486 in Italy
New Condom Ads Target Catholics, Latinos
St. Padre Pio, Humanae Vitae, and Mandatory Abortion
Responsible Parenthood in a Birth Control Culture, Part Two [Open]
Responsible Parenthood in a Birth Control Culture, Part One [Open]
Humanae Vitae and True Sexual Freedom — Part 6 of 6 [Open]
Contraception v. Natural Family Planning — Part 5 of 6 [Open]
Sex Speaks: True and False Prophets — Part 4 of 6 [Open]
Contraception and the Language of the Body — Part 3 of 6 [Open]
Does Contraception Foster Love? — Part 2 of 6 [Open]

Contraception and Cultural Chaos — Part 1 of 6 [Open]
Priests still suffering from effects of Humanae Vitae dissenters, Vatican cardinal says (Must read!)
"Provoking reflection" (Contrasting views on Humanae Vitae)
Humanae Vitae The Year of the Peirasmòs - 1968
Catholics to Pope: Lift the Birth Control Ban
[OPEN] The Vindication of Humanae Vitae
Catholic Clergy Challenge Colleagues to Reacquaint Themselves and Their People with Humanae Vitae
White House proposes wide "conscience clause" on abortion, contraception
THE EX CATHEDRA STATUS OF THE ENCYCLICAL "HUMANAE VITAE" [Catholic Caucus]
“A degrading poison that withers life”

Australia Study: 70 Percent of Women Seeking Abortions Used Contraception
[Fr. Thomas Euteneuer] In Persona Christi: The Priest and Contraception
A Challenging Truth, Part Two: The Day the Birth Control Died
A Challenging Truth, Part One: How Birth Control Works
Ten Challenges for the Pro-Life Movement in 2008
The concept of the "intrinsically evil"
Pope Tells Pharmacists Not to Dispense Drugs With 'Immoral urposes'
Massive Study Finds the Pill Significantly Increases Cancer Risk if Used more than Eight Years
Birth Control Pill Creates Blood Clot Causing Death of Irish Woman
Seminarians Bring Church’s Teaching on Contraception, Sexuality to YouTube

Abortion and Contraception: Old Lies
History of Catholic teaching on Contraception
Pope: Legislation "Supporting Contraception and Abortion is Threatening the Future of Peoples"
Contraception: Why It's Wrong
On Fox News Fearless HLI Priest Takes on Sean Hannity (may be indebted for saving his soul)
VIDEO - SEAN HANNITY vs REV. THOMAS EUTENEUER (must see!)
The Early Church Fathers on Contraception - Catholic/Orthodox Caucus
Pope on divine love vs. erotic love
Conjugal Love and Procreation: God's Design
Being fruitful [Evangelicals and contraception]

[Salvation]

**or did the church provide it in anyway?**

That’s a first for that statement. The Catholic Church has always stood staunchly against contraception. Read some of the links above, please.

[ClearCase_guy]

So they balanced their faith with a dose of practicality.

If avoidance of contraception is supposed to be part of your faith, then what we have here isn't "faith" at all -- and I'm not sure it's "practicality" either. I'd call it "hedging your bets" and I don't find it admirable.

[Lurker]

Turn on your sarcasm detector, dude.

[mkmensinger]

Rules

[berdie]

Sorry, I forgot the sarcasm tag. I guess I assumed that it would be obvious.

[Dilbert San Diego]

When I think about the people closest to me in life, I must say that I have never discussed their birth control methods with them.

I have no idea what family and close friends do about birth control. I would never think to mention, or ask, or bring up the subject of someone’s personal birth control decisions.

[utahagen]

I know. And what’s with ratting out your parents to the world?

[Jim from C-Town]

‘My parents were the most devout Catholics I've ever known.’

That might be part of your problem, Maureen. They don't seem that devout to me at all. BTW, it is not ‘the rhythm method’ It is more like Natural Family Planning and it is more effective than the pill when adhered to.

Of course, they are so ‘practical’ with their three perfect children, how quaint. They should have stopped with two and spared us all your idiocy.

[AnotherUnixGeek]

Maureen Dowd: Fight really about controlling women, not birth

This logic only holds if one believes women are defined solely by their ability to give birth. I had no idea Maureen Dowd felt that way - interesting.

[Bratch]

[Snickering Hound]

[A.A. Cunningham]

Dudette, Einstein.

[susannah59]

I'm not Catholic and don't personally have any moral objection to contraception. At one time in my life, I could have worked for a Catholic institution. I knew that I would have insurance and that it would not cover contraception. I never went to work for that institution, for reasons having nothing to do with contraception.

If I had ever gone to work for that institution, I would have paid for my own contraception. A Catholic institution doesn't pay for that. Some employers don't provide free parking. Some give you the day off for your birthday, some don't. There are tradeoffs in any job situation.

As it was, there were certain things my employer-provided insurance didn't cover when it came to my children's health care. If I considered those things worthwhile and necessary, I paid them myself.

I thought that was what responsible adults did.

I do have a moral objection to the government forcing a Catholic institution to provide contraception when it is against Catholic doctrine, even if it's not against mine. I'd feel the same objection to the government forcing a Jewish institution to serve ham, bacon, and sausage in their cafeteria, or forcing a Baptist institution to serve alcohol.

I also have a really hard time with people who have spent a lifetime screeching about keeping Government out of their bedrooms, or off their bodies, now think it's OK for the Government to intrude in the church.

[freedumb2003]

What caliber of gun does the RCC use to keep people in the Church?

If they disagree with the Church’s base value system — GO SOMEWHERE ELSE.

This isn’t about control of any kind. It the left’s abhorrence to a set of true moral values. The only values the left allows are those that let THEM control others, not any based on a moral code.

[pieceofthepuzzle]

I have no desire to control women (and no ability to). I don’t know what goes on in the heads of other men, but none of my friends appear to want anything different than a loving partnership with their wife. Christianity and Catholicism emphasize humility in the light of God - not controlling others.

[jimfree]

You can buy it yourself, we’re not banning it. It is YOU who advocate the banning of enumerated liberties. We just don’t want to pay for your sluttiness.

[Harmless Teddy Bear]

Maureen Dowd: Fight really about controlling women, not birth

Harmless Teddy Bear: Fight really about killing people, not women

[MuttTheHoople]

Look at the beautiful children Maureen Dowd couldn't abort.

[piytar]

Only in a liberal’s world could “not being forced to pay for something you don’t want to” equal “control.” And likeiwse “forcing them to pay for me” equal freedom.

Liberalism is a mental illness...

[Popman]

Serious question: What is wrong with a man (according to the Catholic church) using a condom to prevent getting your wife pregnant ?

[A.A. Cunningham]

Dowd is 60. 50 years ago people of Mr. and Mrs. Dowd’s intelligence most likely could comprehend the calendar aka rhythm method. I doubt they or their daughter could grasp let alone chart changes in mucus and temperature.

[pingman]

“Well, sometimes your father used something,” she said.

Yeah, a bag over her head.

[pingman]

Gollee, she’s a stunner.

[A.A. Cunningham]

Ever hear of Onan?

[Lurker]

Then crank it up to 11, sweetums.

[piytar]

This isn’t about control of any kind. It the left’s abhorrence to a set of true moral values. The only values the left allows are those that let THEM control others, not any based on a moral code.

I respectfully disagree. This is absolutely about control: Libs want to control the Church. Birth control is just the issue they're using. Control of the Church is the WHOLE point!

[A.A. Cunningham]

Someone like you who is obviously lite in the loafers has no business on a thread dealing with procreation, genius.

[piytar]

Re-reading what you wrote, our difference is in semantics only...

[Pollster1]

So I wasn't surprised to see the Gallup poll last week showing that 82 percent of U.S. Catholics say birth control is morally acceptable. (Eighty-nine percent of all Americans and 90 percent of non-Catholics agreed.)

This is probably reasonably close to true, but it does not in any way justify compelling the remaining 18% of Catholics to violate their God-given moral rights to the free exercise of their faith. It also does not justify compelling those who fell short of their moral values to fund the shortcomings of others in violation of their beliefs. I have no moral objection to birth control, but I am appalled an the infringement on our legal and natural rights proposed in this latest command from the current administration. Maureen Dowd has, once again, missed the point.

[Lurker]

Bite me, lady.

[Popman]

Ever hear of Onan?

Yes..he pulled out and spilled his seed against Leviticus law

But I see no bearing on using a condom...

A condom is a barrier...

[SaraJohnson]

Everything is the opposite with these liberls.

Liberal claim: Republicans are trying to control women’s sexual organs and birth and that is why we had the government order insurance companies to provide brith control to women. We also like the China policy of forced abortion because there are too many people on mother earth.

Liberal claim: The Republicans are raaaciss and that is why we teach black children to hate whites and be racist thugs.

Liberal claim: Republicans are haters because they against homosexual sex, so we promote homosexual sex to children and refuse to be so hateful as to mention the deaths and disease because we love homosexuals to death.

Liberal claim: Stupid Republicans want to kill the poor by refusing to give them health care so we give everyone health care. Because we are smart, we know collective health care dollars are wasted on old people who will vote for us after they die.

[freedumb2003]

>>I respectfully disagree. This is absolutely about control: Libs want to control the Church. Birth control is just the issue they’re using. Control of the Church is the WHOLE point!<<

Please reread my post — I say the same thing, only bigger...

[freedumb2003]

>>Re-reading what you wrote, our difference is in semantics only...<<

LOL — ignore my post last post about your first post to my first post since I read your last post but only after the first post.

We are indeed in agreement.

[Sun]

Thanx for your links.

Just want to add this:

No, the rhythm method is not very effective, but Natural Family Planning is as effective as the pill.

“Natural Family Planning (NFP) is a safe, natural and effective way to postpone, avoid or achieve pregnancy.
It is 99% effective and 100% natural.
snip
Billings Ovulation Method: www.boma-usa.org: This basic ovulation method has wide appeal among diverse cultures. Used in more than 120 countries, with 3.6 million couples in China. Also offered in Spanish.”

http://www.flrl.org/NaturalFamilyPlanning.htm

Plus, women don’t get blood clots, and can use the same knowledge, if they WANT to get pregnant. Even some secular women use NFP, because it’s natural and safe.

The pill can cause early pregnancies, as many of us know, but even some pro-life women don’t realize this, and can have a miscarriage before they know they are pregnant.

[SuziQ]

"Really, it's about birth control and women's lower caste in the church."

No, Mo, it's really not. Women are considered equal to men in terms of attaining salvation. The fact that women are not allowed to be priests doesn't mean they are considered 'lower caste', except in the fevered imaginations of radical feminists.

The Bishops are fighting for the basic right of Religious Liberty; not having to be forced to do something against her teachings by the government with the force of law. THAT is against the Constitution, and one of the basic rights for which our Founding Fathers fought.

[Salvation]

Great additional information!

[Salvation]

And for the people who even want MORE information"

Young Catholic Women Try To Give Church’s Position On Birth Control New Sheen
Essays for Lent: Natural Family Planning
Divorce Rate Comparisons Between Couples Using NFP & Artificial Birth Control

'Amazing Grace for Those Who Suffer'
Natural and Unnatural (father of 5 shocks mother of 1)
NFP — It Ain’t Your Momma’s Rhythm
Responsible Parenthood in a Birth Control Culture, Part Two [Open]
Responsible Parenthood in a Birth Control Culture, Part One [Open]
Contraception v. Natural Family Planning — Part 5 of 6 [Open]
Journey to the Truth (Natural Family Planning) [Open]
Enslaving Women One Pill at a Time (Birth Control Pills and Natural Family Planning)
New Study Shows Natural Family Planning Technique More “Effective” Than Contraception
Fargo) Diocese set to require pre-marriage course in natural family planning

Making Babies: A Very Different Look at Natural Family Planning
Clerical Contraception (Important Read! By Fr. Thomas J. Euteneuer)
(Fargo) Diocese set to require pre-marriage course in natural family planning
Natural Family Planning Awareness Week, July 25, 2004
IS NATURAL FAMILY PLANNING A 'HERESY'? (Trads, please take note)
Thanks Doc: More (and Younger) Doctors Support Natural Family Planning
Couple say Natural Family Planning strengthens marriage
Reflections: Natural family planning vs sexism
British Medical Journal: Natural Family Planning= Effective Birth Control Supported by Catholic Chrch
Natural Family Planning

[redgolum]

That is the narrative.

Funny thing is contraception has allowed more women to be exploited.

[Sun]

“.......I also have a really hard time with people who have spent a lifetime screeching about keeping Government out of their bedrooms, or off their bodies, now think it’s OK for the Government to intrude in the church.”

Well said. And as one pro-life activist put it (paraphrasing), the liberals accuse us of being in their bedrooms, but then they want us to pick up the tab for what happens in their bedrooms.

btw, if you are pro-life, you might want to read my last post including this part of it:

“The pill can cause early pregnancies, as many of us know, but even some pro-life women don’t realize this, and can have a miscarriage before they know they are pregnant.”

[SunkenCiv]

Thanks 2ndDivisionVet.

• Americans James Blackston, Unnamed Teen, Arrested in Connection with Death [Tokyo]
• US dancer charged w/sex assault; her friend strangled in Tokyo (US MSM to SPIKE this)

[jtal]

It is impossible to answer your question in an FR sound byte.

The closest I can come is “it violates the natural law.”

if you are truly serious in your question, start here:
http://www.vatican.va/holy_father/paul_vi/encyclicals/documents/hf_p-vi_enc_25071968_humanae-vitae_en.html

I will also point out that until the Lambeth Conference of 1930, ALL protestant denominations shared the Catholic stance on artificial birth control. When the CofE allowed it with this conference, the other protestant denominations were scandalized and reacted harshly.

[Sun]

Thank you!

I’d like to see this one, from your list, get out more:

“NFP — It Ain’t Your Momma’s Rhythm”

Maureen Dowd is behind the times. Doesn’t she realize we are in a new century? :)

[ctdonath2]

Communists ALWAYS implement severe population reduction measures. Starvation, forced marches, war, ethnic cleansing, class execution, whatever means - they see some greater value in killing huge swaths of population.

But today, here, outright overt killing is unpalatable (thank you RKBA) so other means must be used. Free contraception can reach the same ends thru more socially acceptable, if longer, means.

The question is: why does the Obama & friends WANT to reduce population so badly?